AuthorTopic: Scrolling Backdrop perspective?  (Read 53419 times)

Offline Helm

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Re: Scrolling Backdrop perspective?

Reply #40 on: January 19, 2009, 09:05:43 am
But the merit of this whole thing is debatable. Why not just parallax layers of parallel perspectives like since the dawn of pixellry?

Offline Indigo

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Re: Scrolling Backdrop perspective?

Reply #41 on: January 19, 2009, 11:22:11 am
for the sake of curiosity:


I think it works quite well and I have yet to see a game that uses this method for an infinitely scrolling background.  Although it emulates rotation rather than pan, I still think it could work out

Offline Jad

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Re: Scrolling Backdrop perspective?

Reply #42 on: January 19, 2009, 02:15:31 pm
This is true! For simulating a background that loops around in a circle, this works amazingly well!

Especially for extremely linear games like shmups, this could give a welcome feeling of changing perspectives/not just riding along a straight line. I like it.
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Offline Mike

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Re: Scrolling Backdrop perspective?

Reply #43 on: January 19, 2009, 05:10:19 pm
Wow that is awesome looking!!  I didn't even know this stuff was possible!

Ya know I'm starting to recall crazy perspectives while playing Odin's sphere

Check this vid out http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VxJygK07clY

This town is incredible!!!

Also this video is pretty impressive too.  Specifically note the curve in the atmosphere that doesn't seem to scroll, but the screen does scroll...its nuts.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7vC2vhbkzYU

Offline Gil

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Re: Scrolling Backdrop perspective?

Reply #44 on: January 19, 2009, 05:44:49 pm
Youre my hero indigo, that was exactly what I was talking about :)

You avoid the sharp corners around the perspective points this way. I'm sure that it even works better if the vertical are straight.

Offline Indigo

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Re: Scrolling Backdrop perspective?

Reply #45 on: January 19, 2009, 07:07:10 pm
I know many fighter games did this wonkey cylindrical perspective, but never in such a way that it loops.

as per the discussion of 10-point perspective, thats just silly.  In reality there is infinite-point perspective because there are no such thing as straight lines.  straight lines are a man-made figment.  vanishing points allow us to interpret straight lines much easier, but as you see with cylindrical perspective, there are none (at least by way of the horizontal lines).  In a real would scenario, we have spherical perspective.  our eyes do actually see a small sliver of *rotation* rather than a pan segment, and if our eyes were to capture more, it would complete and entire spherical map of changing, curving, perspectives.  -But since it's so small, we do not see the curving lines.  The argument that there could only be up to 6 point perspective is also silly because our vision is spherical, not cubic.  -confusion on my part
« Last Edit: January 20, 2009, 07:30:47 pm by Indigo »

Offline TrevoriuS

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Re: Scrolling Backdrop perspective?

Reply #46 on: January 19, 2009, 08:28:18 pm
Well as far as I'm concerned it's only possible when you are going to run in a circle, or when you manage to take the 10 point perspective principle to represent not a closed environment, but an opened up one in a longitude shape.

And if that escher drawing is 5 point perspective, this most certainly would represent ten:
http://www.heddalstavkirke.no/pano/heddal.jpg
It's the reflection of a room in a sphere, but mapped and flattened out, to display ALL the reflection of all sides, and not just half of them from one side, into a 2D image. So if 1 sphere side's reflection results in a 5 point perspective image (I didn't know, really) - then the above image is 10; and then probably that's what they did with the star wars feature too.

Now processing that image is a different story, I wouldn't know how to, but this applet does it with that image I mentioned before:
http://www.heddalstavkirke.no/pano/ptviewer.jar

Still a closed environment. Though I think it actually is possible making the second side, the back, which is seen after 180 degrees rotation, a completely different scene. If you then keep linking new 5 point perspective images together, you will keep cycling around, but a new environment keeps appearing. How to actually make this... I don't know, model a 3D environment and bake such a 10 point environment map? Then still you'd have to find out how to process the outcome.

Another option, which only works on boxes, would be to just draw the front view, and scale it in X based on the distance it is from the center, the lack of image created by scaling it down, can be then filled up by a side view image, scaled again to fit into the cerated space. It's the kind of fake 3D GTA 2 simulates.

Offline Conzeit

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Re: Scrolling Backdrop perspective?

Reply #47 on: January 19, 2009, 08:54:43 pm
So, realistically you could make a pretty cool boss room where the player goes around in a loop, or a level comprised entirely of some sort of staircase...

Other than that, I think that if you dont have any elements in the drawing actually reach close to the viewer you could make a background more interesting than what we're used to see. Correct me if I'm wrong but wasnt it "AstroSpoon" that made a pseudo 3d game about a warrior nun...and it used some kind of perspective similar to this in some of it's levels?

Anyhow, I'm glad I suggested this silly use of the perspective from some page I never understood, I think it got us thinking of ways of using 2D art that we had never considered before, and wrong or right I think that is a good thing. Sometimes I think we miss looking at how things should be done in the future, instead of taking apart what already IS, and I wonder wether this makes projects critiqued here stall instead of being comleted.

Offline Indigo

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Re: Scrolling Backdrop perspective?

Reply #48 on: January 20, 2009, 12:55:04 am
I think the fact that it's a complete circle turn-around is far less visually important or noticeable to a player than would be the simple effect of changing perspectives.  Like TrevoriuS was saying (i think), There is no reason in my mind why this technique would be limited to a 360 turn-around of a single location, but can be stretched accross many many scenes that use the same principal.  logically does it work?  no.  but neither does nearly all 2d games that try to simulate depth.  We take the liberty to break some things in order to create a grander illusion.

another thought occurred to me.  combining parallax layers to cylindrical mapping.  I'm curious how this would look.  Something tells me it wouldn't work just by the very nature of pan vs rotation, but it'd be interesting to try none the less
« Last Edit: January 20, 2009, 01:08:46 am by Indigo »

Offline Jad

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Re: Scrolling Backdrop perspective?

Reply #49 on: January 20, 2009, 04:58:24 am
in a side-scroller this would imply a curved movement and in the end circular movement for me, I just can't look at the example you made without getting the feeling of rotation.
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