AuthorTopic: [WiP] Tiny Mech  (Read 5547 times)

Offline BioLink

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[WiP] Tiny Mech

on: July 03, 2014, 09:36:55 pm


Just a Little Mech/robot im working on. Opinions/ critiques welcome.
« Last Edit: July 03, 2014, 09:39:52 pm by BioLink »

Offline Manupix

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Re: [WiP] Tiny Mech

Reply #1 on: July 04, 2014, 08:54:08 am
Very cute!

Main problem for me is gun readability, esp on the right facing one.Make it black, or a different color?

I'm not a fan of the mirrored feet either, esp since they remain unchanged on the 2 angles of view.
Not sure what you could do about it, as you probably wanted to avoid just duplicating them. Try to have one foot facing the viewer?

Offline Carnivac

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Re: [WiP] Tiny Mech

Reply #2 on: July 04, 2014, 12:59:27 pm
If this is for a game I think the main gameplay issue would be that the gun is in a different position in terms of it's co-ordinates from the center of the sprite.   Even games where the sprites have different left and right sprites (rather than simply flipping them) tend to still have the gun end up with the muzzle bit in the same distance from the center.   It makes setting the co-ordinates for the bullets, muzzle flashes and such a lot easier but also when it comes to collision checking. 

I don't have any readibility issues with the gun itself.  If this is for a game I presume it would be scaled up for the low res charm anyways at which point the gun is clearly readable.
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Offline BioLink

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Re: [WiP] Tiny Mech

Reply #3 on: July 04, 2014, 05:38:48 pm
I tried fixing the mirrored feet problem as well as the gun readability.




Carnivac i see what your critiques are how a bullet fired from the barrel would have 2 drastically different x values when in a game. But im not exactly sure how to remedy this problem without massively extending the barrel or his arm any ideas?

Also iv been having trouble with the right facing ones gun it has its barel visually showing so it has some contrast against the mech but it makes it look like hes shooting out in space rather then straight ahead which bugs a friend of mine. But when i remove the open barrel it lose the contrast between the barrel of the gun and the robot and it kind of blends in with him any ideas on how i can remedy this?

« Last Edit: July 04, 2014, 05:59:50 pm by BioLink »

Offline astraldata

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Re: [WiP] Tiny Mech

Reply #4 on: July 05, 2014, 02:56:32 am


The problem with readability of the gun on the right image is the left arm being in the way. It leads the eye down to the feet since the arm is brighter than the gun and it attracts the most attention.

Just some things to think about:

If you're not partial to the one-gun-arm idea, instead of working with my edit, just give the guy two gun arms and simply mirror the sprite. Or let either arm animate a transformation from the gun back to a regular hand *after* it is fired (don't delay the ability to shoot for some aesthetic as trivial as this one however -- big mistake.)

To be honest with you, if I had to choose, the right facing sprite vs. the left, I'd choose the left everytime. No need to be unique on something like this -- just flip the sprite. People will care MUCH more that the x value for shooting is different than about the time you spent putting into drawing a completely separate left/right standing/shooting frame. Trust me, most people will *not* think that much into it. Games have been flipping sprites for years.

Find another way to be unique and compromise any perceived 'quality' on this one -- it's not a feature enough people will truly appreciate to justify its existence. Even my edit is suffering from the same x-axis issue, and I've tweaked it to the best natural looking state the arm can be in for the right frame (aside from turning the sprite completely around and showing his back when he's firing -- though you may still have the x axis issue *and* it may lead to other issues with your moveset such as problems with your walking animation(s).
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Offline BioLink

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Re: [WiP] Tiny Mech

Reply #5 on: July 05, 2014, 03:14:07 am
I have made some edits.




Astraldata, i have decided to instead of flipping the sprite rather change his pose when hes firing so that his body is turned completely to the side similar to how samus is in metroid zero mission to fix the bullet coming out of the correct x axis. Working on that now, the current version is going to be his idle frame. im not exactly happy with the left arm if you or any one else has some ideas they would be much appreciated.
Edit: in fact after looking closer at your edits Astraldata i do have some ideas to make it better.



Well i think its coming along nicely.
« Last Edit: July 05, 2014, 03:52:21 am by BioLink »

Offline Carnivac

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Re: [WiP] Tiny Mech

Reply #6 on: July 05, 2014, 06:34:07 am
To be honest with you, if I had to choose, the right facing sprite vs. the left, I'd choose the left everytime. No need to be unique on something like this -- just flip the sprite. People will care MUCH more that the x value for shooting is different than about the time you spent putting into drawing a completely separate left/right standing/shooting frame. Trust me, most people will *not* think that much into it. Games have been flipping sprites for years.


Have to say it is something that bugs me in many games and why in all three of my projects the main character does have seperate left and right frames so the gun is always held the correct way (even several 8-bit games on home computers did seperate frames, SwitchBlade for example).  Mine also have front and back frames it turns through when changing direction so simple flipping just wouldn't work anyways.    It's all to do with the posing though.  Mine tend to be side on when using the guns so that

Figured I'd upload examples to show.   Excuse the blockiness.  These are from my two 8-bit Amstrad CPC projects but despite being done in different styles and proportions and holding guns in different ways they still have seperate left and right torso sprites and the gun stays in the same x position.    The Commando guys below hold their guns with two hands and are posed from side on.   RoboCop at the top holds his gun with one hand and so his body is more at an angle.   In both cases I designed them by doing one direction then flipping the sprite and erasing everything that needed to change while keeping things like the head and gun and general outline in position to then help create the new side.   Dunno if these examples help but hey you go anyway.

« Last Edit: July 05, 2014, 06:36:32 am by Carnivac »
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Offline astraldata

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Re: [WiP] Tiny Mech

Reply #7 on: July 05, 2014, 06:50:03 pm
Nice approach there Carnivac! I didn't think to use the silhouette to forge a new pose for the other side. Great way to fix that x axis issue! :D

I do stand by my original comments that it doesn't make much of a difference on many small sprites (your robocop sprites are an exception due to their different forms being more easily readable than your metal-slug-ish sprites whose forms appear too similar from each side for the difference to be really noticeable.) It really does depend on the gameplay most of all however. If we're talking more slower-paced gameplay like Metroid rather than Metal-Slug, this level of detail seems a lot more justifiable.

Either way, with this 3/4 view, a technique like that one is much more difficult. The only way it'd be possible is if he turns his upper-body completely sideways (toward and away-from the camera) on his shooting frames to fire the weapon while maintaining the forward-facing of his feet to the direction of movement. Really not sure how that would look with this sort of sprite, but it's definitely worth a try. :)
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Offline Carnivac

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Re: [WiP] Tiny Mech

Reply #8 on: July 05, 2014, 07:01:44 pm
Nice approach there Carnivac! I didn't think to use the silhouette to forge a new pose for the other side. Great way to fix that x axis issue! :D

I do stand by my original comments that it doesn't make much of a difference on many small sprites (your robocop sprites are an exception due to their different forms being more easily readable than your metal-slug-ish sprites whose forms appear too similar from each side for the difference to be really noticeable.) It really does depend on the gameplay most of all however. If we're talking more slower-paced gameplay like Metroid rather than Metal-Slug, this level of detail seems a lot more justifiable.

Remember these are meant to be viewed in a low resolution so would appear much bigger and it is certainly very noticable, particularly when turning as it adds a whole extra depth to the otherwise two-dimensional characters and really is worth the extra bit of time and effort.  It's something I definitely encourage people to do where possible.
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Offline BioLink

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Re: [WiP] Tiny Mech

Reply #9 on: July 05, 2014, 07:28:38 pm
Well iv been working on it. I think it still needs to be touch up a tad but its looking great.