[WIP] Skeleton Warrior

[samw3]

This piece is one of the baddies from the game.  Battles are done in a Dragon Warrior style with one baddie per battle.

So.. I'm starting with a sketch here.. a sword in his right hand, a buckler on the left arm.

I guess, first off, how does the pose look?  I'm trying my hand at some fore-shortening.  I'd like it to feel planted yet active like he's running at you.

[Redshrike]

It looks good so far.  It seems somewhat traditional for the sword's blade to be somewhat more foreshortened in such a pose, but I think that this look is good, too.  It's hard to tell at this stage, though.

[Dyble]

If you were in his point of view, His left arm looks too big other then that I think it looks like a great stance, it looks like he is ready to pounce at his target at any moment  

[EvilEye]

Why is the background so dark? I can barely see the outline on my monitor.

The pose looks decent, but his arms seem a bit long.

I made this edit before I realized the title was *skeleton* warrior.



I tried to do a see-though effect in some parts to show you some of the body parts that are hidden.

[samw3]

Thanks, EvilEye for the edit.  I like the foreshortening you've got on the sword, that's really nice.  Sorry about the contrast.  This one's a little better.

Here's an update.. the stuff on his head is trying to find the volume of it.  How do the bones look now?

[Dyble]

His left shoulder should be lower then his right shoulder, because if you make your self into that pose you right shoulder is higher up
because your putting your weight into it.

[samw3]

@Dyble, he's pulling it back.

Here's some more progress...  How's it look?  critiques?

[Gil]

The skull is not just a cylinder. You'll need to make the shadow follow the facial contours.

I also think the dithering is out of place, it doesn't really work. The right foot (his left) can use some work.

I like where it's going

[Dyble]

Ahh he is pulling back, DOH!  your skeleton is really good looking, but Should'nt his nose area be a dark hole? not just a dark outline.
maybe your going to fix that kater just thought I would point it out jsut incase you didn't see it

[ndchristie]

the lower leg and forearm each have 2 major bones, not 1.  Kneecaps are nice to have, too.  ribs stop and spread at the solar plexus.

the overall pose is OK but the sword is in a very awkward place.  he's in no position to attack, advance, or defend.  since he's apparently swashbuckling (shield), recommend actually keeping the sword sheethed and the buckler across his front, shoulder height, to allow for the first move (drawing to a mid- or high-block before entering the attack), OR if you're opposed to that then a more defensive pose with the buckler arm held in the same position as the first but the sword drawn and crossed downward over the off-hand presenting the flat of the blade to the enemy and offering the shield boss-point centrally with the intention of forcing the enemy into an attack by way of shoving.  In sword and buckler this is called second guard, first guard being identical to that found in epee fencing.  if you need a charging pose, keep the hand at shoulder level in line with the head and the sword pointed at a relaxed vertical to allow entering a thrust, swash (cut) or returning to the second described stance.

[Gil]

Would that all be possible with a curved blade 3/4th of the body height? I think I would use the buckler more as a simple armguard with a blade that size. It doesn't seem to lend itself to real swashbuckling.

And then there's the issue that we're talking about a reanimated skeleton without muscles or tendons. I'm thinking that the skeleton isn't really meant to be an undead Erol Flynn 

[samw3]

yeah, whew.. that's quite a lesson in swashbuckling.  And it's too late for me to totally change the pose on this one.

I did try to fix the chest and add a semblance of two bones in the front leg.  Also there's some skull work.  Still not sure about the foot.. any ideas?

[Dyble]

looking good, his left arm is way larger then his right arm but I guess its too late to fix that, also his left hand seems to be just a stump
while the right hand has fingers.

[samw3]

Ok, i'm heading to bed.  Shortened the shield arm a bit, made the hand a bit more distinct.  Still open for C+C

[Reo]

the main problem I can see is that the body dosn't really read as a skeleton, I made this Edit to illustrate some of my points:

I'm not sure if its supposed to be a skeleton with muscle's(if so then ignore this).
I focused mainly in the edit on making it look more ''skelety'', like the feet and ribcage for example.
but I also touched up the skull, I feel Gil's comment on the skull went (abit) unnoticed.
I think some things look a bit bland/boring like the skull and the sword, some details like blood,cracks, whatever should be added to make it look a bit less bland and generic...
Also you could use contrast to make ''important'' things like the skull pop more.
Anyway keep it up, I'm looking forward to an update!

[ndchristie]

i may have misread the foreshortening, but i didn't think that the blade was overly curved or any more than half his height, but i could be wrong.  also, if you plan on dueling with any 16th century noblemen, beware! - a buckler is never a simple armguard, it's a weapon in it's own right or else it's a handicap.  for the record too, sword and buckler or "swashbucking" (swashing blows falling upon the buckler) is a form originating in the late middle ages, coming to it's peak in the high renaissance, and falling out of fashion by the late 17th century, so the idea that Errol Flynn and his over-animated pirate buddies are "swashbucklers" is nothing more than a hollywood and comic book misappropriation of the term.

edit- didn't realize Flynn was in old-world set movies as well, but he's still not using the right weapons (or any bucklers) that i can find...

I don't think this is at all too far along to raise the shield and redraw the sword, but some people do feel that these starts are precious.  I think the critique (that his pose is ineffectual and non-menacing) stands regardless of the will to act on it.

Also, reposting for emphasis, since it's the more important point now:

the lower leg and forearm each have 2 major bones, not 1.  Kneecaps are nice to have, too.  ribs stop and spread at the solar plexus.

[samw3]

That's a gorgeous edit Reo.  Thanks a bunch.  The toes are what I was trying for, but failed.

ndchristie, I appreciate your comments, and it's not that I'm emotionally attached to what I have already.  The problem is that I'm still painfully slow at this, and I need to finish a bunch of these.  I honestly don't have the time to redo the pose.  I hope you understand.  I do understand your critique and will keep it in mind with future swashbucklers I attempt to draw.

You all will probably be shocked to know I've put 12hrs into this piece.  And yeah, it probably would be cheaper just to hire an already skilled artist, but I want to learn it myself, and I am getting faster.

Well, I have to move on.  I put the notes from Reo's edit in as further polish.  I hope I can come back and add them in.

I'll be posting another char in a little while.