AuthorTopic: GR#082 - Rat Warrior  (Read 20574 times)

Offline Dan

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Re: [wip] Rat Warrior v2

Reply #20 on: August 18, 2008, 11:50:57 am
The strap going around his body and over his shoulder should have an effect on the fur like have fur over lapping the strap or displaced fur as a result of the strap. Apart from that it looks great but im not to sure about the perfectly verticle assult rifle i think it was said before that maybe give it a bit of an angle.
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Offline 0xDB

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Re: [wip] Rat Warrior v2

Reply #21 on: August 18, 2008, 07:01:49 pm
But the most important part of turbo's edit for me was that you shouldn't render every strand of hair on the rat individually, that you should go a bit more abstract.
I think that if there's enough space to render all that detail, there's no need for abstraction. I also like how the fur turned out so far and I think it is already a lot more abstract than it was in version 1. However, even with that being said I will try to make it more abstract (thinking of cleaning out the whole fur texture and redoing it from scratch) to see whether I'm not missing an opportunity to make it so that I like it even more.

Thinking about it though, I am now aware of the fact that the background is hopelessly under-detailed in comparison to the rat, maybe that's even the whole issue: too much abstraction in one place and not enough of it in another, thus creating an inconsistency that is displeasing to view?

More imprtantly (IMO) the rat seems kind of...blank? I think it lacks a clear expression on it's face. Are you trying to make it look ridiculous? or are you seriously trying to make the rat threatening?

Neither of those. Unlike in the original drawing that this is based on (the rules of the challenge that the first version of this piece was made for required to rework an old drawing as pixel art/16 colors/canvas size unspecified), the rat is not supposed to be aware of the camera or the viewer.

She is supposed to be looking straight above the camera into the far and wide emptyness that surrounds her in an emotionally detached way, as if she's uninvolved in the world, just standing there, pausing, blankly (as in without really thinking consciously but rather instinctively) trying(subconsciously) to make up her mind into which direction she should be traveling next.

As she's not aware of the viewer or anything (she's completely alone there) there's no reason to why she should be posing in a threatening way.

The more I think about this though, the more I wonder about why I have given her all those weapons. I can imagine though that my original intention(back in 2002 when I drew the pencil version) was probably not to express anything specific but rather to just try and make a pretty picture (for that friend of mine who had rats as pets(it was a birthday present for him)). This does seem a bit stupid to me now, but I'll keep working on this nonetheless, even if just for technical practice.

The rats head looks sort of like you wanted a view that makes the head look like its slightly tilted backwards, but the body looks out of view in comparison. Still looks nice though.
The head is not supposed to be tilted into any direction. It is seen a bit from below only because of the camera being located so far below it. Maybe the perspective is a little too strong for such small scale object like that? Please mark the exact place(s) in which you think it is off and explain this some more, because frankly I can not see where it is wrong or out of view.

The strap going around his body and over his shoulder should have an effect on the fur like have fur over lapping the strap or displaced fur as a result of the strap.
I'll keep that in mind when I redo the fur.

Thanks again everyone for the critique, even if it seems like I'm getting very defensive about my work in this post, please don't think I don't appreciate the feedback, I do because it makes me think more about my work and it allows me to explore things that I would never have taken into consideration if I would work in isolation.

summary of the issues raised by you(mainly for myself, so I don't forget):
*straight gun
*insufficient fur abstraction? (that and/or: background too simple and boring?)
*lack of expression (well... not sure if that is really a flaw, see explanation above)
*neck/shoulders too humanlike
*belt does not affect fur distortion

[off topic]
Sorry, no update in this post, as mentioned earlier my vacation is over so I will work on it again this weekend. I don't want to ruin it by working on it in the evenings while being all stressed out from my programming job.
[/off topic]

Offline Helm

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Re: [wip] Rat Warrior v2

Reply #22 on: August 22, 2008, 05:33:56 am
Quote
Thinking about it though, I am now aware of the fact that the background is hopelessly under-detailed in comparison to the rat, maybe that's even the whole issue: too much abstraction in one place and not enough of it in another, thus creating an inconsistency that is displeasing to view?

This isn't a problem in the least and I would personally advise against ALL DETAIL EVERYWHERE. You can do it, and pixel art is certainly the mode in which this sort of thing is usually done, but I see no harm in keeping the subject matter well-detailed and the background simpler.

Offline zeid

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Re: [wip] Rat Warrior v2

Reply #23 on: August 22, 2008, 09:24:29 am
A partial edit showing how I would go about expressing the fur texture (main area being dealt with is the torso)...

It really is just re-iterating the point that areas with extreme light or extreme shadow show less details then the mid tone areas.
Also I second the point about background being fine, the point about detail I just mentioned plus it isn't the main focus of the piece are my main reasons for this. Also the last thing you might want is for it to look too cluttered, detail is one way of creating contrast in a piece so keep in mind that contrast distinguishes background from foreground.
« Last Edit: August 22, 2008, 09:29:09 am by zeid »
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Offline 0xDB

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Re: [wip] Rat Warrior v2

Reply #24 on: August 24, 2008, 05:15:21 pm
Didn't have much time this weekend to work on it, so it's just a small update.
I've removed the fur texture and reworked the gun. While I was at it, I also made the gun smaller, because it seemed to be huge in comparison to the mini-gun:


Thanks for your view on detail/abstraction Helm.
Thanks for the edit zeid.

Offline 0xDB

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Re: [wip] Rat Warrior v2

Reply #25 on: December 07, 2011, 12:43:37 pm
...three years later... made many changes, some radical, some less radical but all for the better I think.

20082011

Offline Corinthian Baby

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Re: [wip] Rat Warrior v2

Reply #26 on: December 07, 2011, 09:45:43 pm
I almost like the old one better. The new one's pallet shift to purple and abbreviated shading made him lose some volume. The reason why, I think is because you interpreted the shading too literally, instead of observing how light might move across the figure's body. It's too uniform bright-medium-dark. I think Turbo's edit still has merit. Keep the abbreviated style to the fur, but try to take a volumed approach to the rendering.

The pose of the AK looks much more natural, but by dropping his neck, and decreasing his chest size, his body looks more peanut shaped and weaker. Unsure of the rat head to body proportion, my intuition tells me his head should be bigger but don't take my word for it.

Love the character of this. Keep going!

Offline fortunato

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Re: [wip] Rat Warrior v2

Reply #27 on: December 08, 2011, 05:40:06 am
...three years later... made many changes, some radical, some less radical but all for the better I think.

20082011

i don't know much about composition, but i like where the AK was before more than the new edit. with where the AK is now, there is a lot of empty space right above his right shoulder. empty space isn't bad, its just that in this case i feel like filling up that empty space would give the piece more of a sense of "completeness" or "wholeness".

maybe the AK in the 2008 edit is a little straight; maybe have it tilt to the left (our left) a tiny bit. but i don't know if that is even too necessary. the first piece just looks more complete with the AK in that upwards position than the 2011 one.

Offline Elk

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Re: [wip] Rat Warrior v2

Reply #28 on: December 08, 2011, 07:18:37 am
Hi, I think in terms of composition, your image is verrrrry static! The application of pixeltechniques is fine though!
I doodled around with the impressions, dont mind the colorful areas, they are not supposed to be green/blue, its just a little game for imagination!

At the bullets, I could have done a little more so the perspective shows... but meh :D i think youd get a hang for it! Also changed the Lightsource a little and added a lenseflare (cooooool lol) aswell as the placement of the animal itself was changed, so it's not totally centered, you also had the horizon set at 50/50 vertically! Usually one would say that is not so appealing... so, heres a little concept edit!



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Offline 0xDB

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Re: [wip] Rat Warrior v2

Reply #29 on: December 08, 2011, 11:50:40 am
Thanks for all the new feedback. Made more changes based on that (also reconsidered the reflected light from the sand suggested by Turbo in 2008).
changes: reflected light, light/shadow updates, composition, palette, many minor pixel tweaks here and there

2011 b2011 a