[wip] dude, get yourself a notebook!

[tomic]

hi everyone.
haven't posted anything here since joining in january 2007.
but now your help is appreciated again =)




my piece for the evoke demoparty next weekend and i feel a bit stuck with the foreground:
any ideas how to fill? (i already have 2 stumps, big leaves are not a good idea as it's not a tropic forest,..)

also: still not sure if speechbubbles are a good idea. suggestions?

[PypeBros]

mushrooms ? gnomes laughing at the donkey ? flowers (if you're more in a poetic mood) ?
I'd push something that echoes the anachronism of the computer in that scene, such as bulb-flowers ...

[ndchristie]

how about filling it with some design theory?


a good composition is filled, but not with clutter.  there needs to be a contrast of open to dense.  I say move your good stump up to where the more wippish one is, and get rid of the little WIP bush...also those clouds under the castel destroy more depth than they suggest because the colors cut into the form rather than sitting in front.

Also, the guy is supposedly the focus  of the piece, but he's pushed all the way over to the side?  and the donkey, for all it's complaining, doesn't look to be struggling at all under the weight.  these are the important things, not stumps in the foreground!!

I know demoscene has rarely been about effective communication or composition, but honestly the worst thing you could do for this piece right now is throw a bunch of junk in.

(as far as the speech bubble goes my vote is for a caption)

[AdamAtomic]

Yeah, I also vote no on speech bubble, and yes on exaggerating the donkey's expression or pose to communicate the same idea.  The comp doesn't strike me as TOO cluttered yet, but I think as long as you keep good separation between foreground and background you'll be fine.  Right now the tower in the BG pulls my eye I think a little more than it should.

[ptoing]

Nice stuff, I agree on the speechbubble stuff tho, as in ditch it and make the donkey suffer more visibly.

Compositional atm the prime focal point to me is the sun which is not too good. The guy on the donk is not seperated very well from the background. I would try and make the background with the mountains more faded and all blue tones (including the far castle) and give the donkey and guy a bit more contrast and saturation as well as less bluer colours, to make em stand out more.

[tomic]

thanx for the criticism.

the issue of the donkey rider standing too much off the focus is what friends told me too.
as recommended i've centered the rider by swapping his position with the castle's one. ironically this produced more foreground green to fill =) also followed ptoings advice to blue the background and turn up the contrast of the rider, looks better, thanks.



won't change the sun tho, i feel that with the donkey's new position it won't steal to much attention from the two

and i'll make the donkey suffer asap =)

[Dusty]

Perhaps some sweat coming from the donkey's brow?

[AdamAtomic]

This is probably the worst edit I have ever done, but it is meant to only illustrate how effective color theory can be in helping you to separate foreground and background:



By working with the exact same palette as the terrain, I think you're going to have a very hard time getting your dude and donkey to stand out; working some red (or reddish) hues into the deal should go a long ways toward achieving something that is easier to look at.  What you have so far is very pretty but my eyes roam all over it without finding a good place to focus; I think when you fix that you'll have a really special piece here

[Conzeit]

I must say...I love the color choices, the atmosphere and the daft look on the nerd guy....all good eye candy

That must be the most clearly defined piece of fog I've seen

far too often with these big pixel pieces it seems like the whole thing is just an excuse for the effects, to pull out fancy looking stuff "only with paint"

it can be ok that you have that fancy mountaintop and the dramatic ray of sunlight to establish the setting, but to emphasize everything BUT the punchline which is the actual bunch of PCs on the donkey is just nonesense. it's not just eyecandy here, you're trying to communicate something!

it almost seems as the furthest away from the character, the more emphasis you put. Instead I'd give the donkey a big old oversized pile of pcs, that he couldnt realistically balance on himself,  take away the luxury of detail on that FOG and cast some lights on the pile of PCs...I'd even give the nerd a keyboarda mouse and a good old CRT that he can stare to. Give the CRT a glow that rivals the sun...to make it all the more ironic.

[PypeBros]

it can be ok that you have that fancy mountaintop and the dramatic ray of sunlight to establish the setting, but to emphasize everything BUT the punchline which is the actual bunch of PCs on the donkey is just nonesense. it's not just eyecandy here, you're trying to communicate something!

.I'd even give the nerd a keyboarda mouse and a good old CRT that he can stare to. Give the CRT a glow that rivals the sun...to make it all the more ironic.

Imho, the non-sense can be the very aspect of this piece. If you make it immediately visible that the donkey is carrying CRTs and such, you're spoiling the humour. I think the way it should be perceived is a two-step reading. First you read a scene where a old guy is riding an overbooked donkey in a fairy-tale environment. That could very well be gandalf, except he's not dressed like a wizard.

But the piece is dubbed "get yourself a laptop!" and then, by looking closer, you realise that the pile of junk the donkey carries is PC equipment. What you initially thought to be a net holding something is a mess of power cables, etc. Now it gets clear than "get yourself a laptop" is what the donkey think of his rider (if he's got a more annoyed expression) or something the laughing characters in the foreground say at those two dumb guys (the geek for not having a laptop, and the donkey for willingly carrying that weight).

My sense of humour would even put a sign saying "Evoke, 50 km" that has been invaded by mushrooms, foam and spiderwebs, to insist on the fact that the geek is so slow that he's already missed the event he's moving to. Now, i guess you already have your own idea of what you want to communicate, so i leave it up to you

[tomic]

really not a bad idea, but i wanted to avoid signs as i feel that i've seen this too often already.

anyways, here's a little update on the donkey.. more suffering and more glare on the load to make it standout more..
i'll add some floppy drives and stuff after a little nap =)



adam: i've limited myself to 32 colors and am at 30 atm, so there won't be much reddish =)

[ndchristie]

scribble edit -

the emotion added to the horse is more tired boredom than strain, which actually makes the job look easier rather than more difficult!

[TrevoriuS]

Now he looks more like he's running uphill than that he's bothered by the extreme weight... (The donkey I mean)

[PypeBros]

-->
tried a dirty edit to adjust the donkey's mood. From my experience, horses lower their head when hardworking. I'd expect donkeys to do the same. i also tried to make his "hair" fall more in his face (tired/sweating) moved the pupils backwards (his mind is focussed on the cause of his pain, not on the road), and tried to make him frowning.

HTH. good luck & have fun at the party.

[Helm]

I think you shouldn't pussyfoot around the case that you might need more exaggeration



something like this? (with a more realistic tongue perhaps?)

[Dusty]

Helm has the same idea I had... though... perhaps not with bulging eyes.

[Conzeit]

yay. arent we all so original

[Helm]

but what's happened to the form of the body of the donkey there? Is it running? Also the eyes don't emote. Sorry to countercrit, it's a bit annoying I know. Conceit you should post character sketches in the OT for discussion in terms of emotion I think because it's something we could help with.

[tomic]

@helm: that helped a lot, thank you.
@conceit: that didn't help =D

i've tried to include the mentioned, not sure about the donkey's facial expression yet, but i'll take it as finished for now - needa concentrate on finishing other parts of the picture first.

first version is for drunken sceners, not nitpickers =)

[Dusty]

That is an awesome improvement. The addition of keyboards and such really clarify what was really going on... when it was just monitors it took a second look to grasp it. Great job on the donkey's face.

edit: heh, what's with the squirrel? I just noticed it... is it painting the scene?

The donkey's face looks much better and the added volume of the PCs definitely brings that part of the scene far more into the limelight. Great! Just one little nitpick that you can consider when working on the facial expression later - perhaps use more of your lighter colors in the donkey's eye, or more of your darker colors on the little white patch around the eye. This is just for readability's sake, and maybe it's just me - for just a second I thought the donkey's eye was closed and that he just had a bead of sweat on his eyelid.
Incredible work though, good luck at the compo!

I had to input your name in photoshop to see what color it was. Very tempting... interesting.

[#36005A]

The donkey's face looks much better and the added volume of the PCs definitely brings that part of the scene far more into the limelight. Great! Just one little nitpick that you can consider when working on the facial expression later - perhaps use more of your lighter colors in the donkey's eye, or more of your darker colors on the little white patch around the eye. This is just for readability's sake, and maybe it's just me - for just a second I thought the donkey's eye was closed and that he just had a bead of sweat on his eyelid.
Incredible work though, good luck at the compo!