AuthorTopic: Official Off-Topic Thread  (Read 312152 times)

Offline Ryona

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Re: Official Off-Topic Thread

Reply #220 on: August 05, 2008, 12:39:54 pm
I've seen that, Froli.
When I post an artwork, I'll usually let a couple of comment posts get in first so I can see what most people agree on so I can gague what trully needs work.
Also, I'll rely on my own gut-feeling and experience, and if the critique that someone gave me doesn't sit well with me, I'll most likely not follow it.

Now, as someone who is delivering the critique, I tend not to do so unless someone is in dire need of help and I can truly help them.
That said, I tend to only help the newbies who are just getting into pixel art since I don't consider myself high level yet. Especially not compared to the big guns in this message board.  :o

Offline Ben2theEdge

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Re: Official Off-Topic Thread

Reply #221 on: August 05, 2008, 01:02:29 pm
Today is a historic day! I beat Final Fantasy 7! Finally!  :D :D :D

I think it's pretty easy to tell where someone's heart is with their critique. As far as I'm concerned, my critics can be as arrogant as they want as long as they give me some good advice and don't just trash my work. If someone is too snobby to explain how to do it properly or do an edit or share a link or resource or even point someone in the right direction, the critique isn't going to be helpful, so it's almost a non-issue.
« Last Edit: August 05, 2008, 01:04:18 pm by Ben2theEdge »
I mild from suffer dislexia.

Offline AdamAtomic

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Re: Official Off-Topic Thread

Reply #222 on: August 05, 2008, 03:08:50 pm
I think it boils down to being able to honestly assess your own work.  Their attitude and skill should not come into the equation; Helm might give you a shitty piece of advice (ok its unlikely but its POSSIBLE).  You must be able to judge these things for yourself, or else the whole point of receiving critique is pretty much lost.  You can't just blindly follow all advice, or even all advice from the skilled folks.

Offline ndchristie

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Re: Official Off-Topic Thread

Reply #223 on: August 05, 2008, 03:51:55 pm
I tend to be on the opposite of adam's scale in that I usually need more convincing than others, it's something i'm working on.  partly it's that nothing is more frustrating than not *getting* the critique (or not knowing how to act on it) and that frustration definitely comes out, but I don't mean to direct it at people helping.

I've also had my bad moments.  we know this.  another thing to work on.  my close friend she says I'm so insecure that I have to be stubborn and arrogant just to not panic >.<.

PS : I wonder if anyone else read Froli's comment and thought "fuck, that might be me??" - not that everything is centered around yours truly but well here we go again :P.
A mistake is a mistake.
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Offline Ben2theEdge

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Re: Official Off-Topic Thread

Reply #224 on: August 05, 2008, 04:28:56 pm
PS : I wonder if anyone else read Froli's comment and thought "fuck, that might be me??" - not that everything is centered around yours truly but well here we go again :P.

Ironically it actually was talking about you.  >:D  :P
I mild from suffer dislexia.

Offline AdamAtomic

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Re: Official Off-Topic Thread

Reply #225 on: August 05, 2008, 04:34:14 pm
Well my beef with the whole comment is I think in a lot of ways I actually have learned more from examining and looking for flaws in other people's work than in my own.  That definitely sounds arrogant, but I find it much easier to look at other's work with a fresh eye, but once I've identified flaws there I find it much easier to address them in my own work.  I'm sure that is narcissistic or arrogant, but hey, it works!  Maybe my thought process is "well they messed it up, so i shouldn't feel bad that I messed it up?"

Offline huZba

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Re: Official Off-Topic Thread

Reply #226 on: August 05, 2008, 05:28:27 pm
A great deal of what i've learned is exactly how Adam put it and i feel like i should contribute more for getting free lessons from stalking a lot.
There are a lot of raging art critics around since putting your potentially flawed work out there makes you vulnerable to them. A lot of these angry people get their kicks from pwning others, while essentially a critic should be something completely opposite. The amount of rage is especially high in places that allow anonymous to dwell freely.
I don't see it here on pixelation though. The atmosphere is positive and people are able to disagree without raging and all... i find it quite wonderful.

Offline Froli

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Re: Official Off-Topic Thread

Reply #227 on: August 05, 2008, 05:59:43 pm
To make things clear, I'm not talking about you guys :). Specially a lot of people here are great, seen the individual improvements and has a lot of potential to be high tiers in the art business and game industry. This place is pretty awesome.

It's just I see this often on other forums that I visit, and they critic as if they are an accomplished artist and tells advices as if they are "facts", but draws like a beginner. I think the "Hawk" guy who got banned here long time ago, describes the type of critic I'm referring to. All talk but can't do the walk.

Offline Helm

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Re: Official Off-Topic Thread

Reply #228 on: August 05, 2008, 06:12:51 pm
As far as I'm concerned a good crit is a good crit even if the person giving it can't draw for shit. A lot of people have better eyes for critique than hands for drawing. If a piece of advice helps you address an error in your work you should be happy to have gotten it, not think in terms of 'well DO BETTER YOURSELF THEN!!'. It's not of direct interest if they can or cannot, it doesn't change that you have the error in your work to address yourself.

Also the 'he talks as if he's 100% right' is not directly related to the quality of critique either. You have a brain of your own to make your own choices as to how useful a piece of critique is. That being said I can see how such attitude would grate, but let's be clear it grates because of our own insecurities. And THAT being said such behaviour should probably be moderated in a critique board because a positive attitude, not an antagonistic one, should be cultivated for such a place so as you see we would give notices and warnings to people on attitude in Pixelation. Just keep in mind that on the psychological level, the problem is more with you getting riled up by such attitudes than with the people having the attitude. They might have it because they're conceited jerks that indeed think they're always right, or they might just have no time for pleasantries and just want to help as directly as possible and trust you to make up your own mind as to whether they're right or not.

It's been proved though that if you're super-nice and pepper your critique with more 'that's just my opinion though' s and etc the person getting critiqued will take the harsh crits more lightly at first read. That's both good and bad because a crit taken lightly is a crit lightly dismissed also. And besides, just a scathing, harsh, super in your face mcblunt piece of critique that makes you fume at the first 5 reads of it... well you can read it a sixth time eventually and learn from it, it's on the internet in written form, it's not going anywhere (as opposed to real life verbal crits where being super polite is even more important).

My own reasons for critique have been mentioned a few times and they're pretty benevolent: I get a huge kick out of seeing someone be happy over improving their art because people helped them out of their own good will: it's a small miracle when it happens. Also it helps my own art a huge lot to be critical and analytical of other people's art.

Offline leroy

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Re: Official Off-Topic Thread

Reply #229 on: August 05, 2008, 06:45:47 pm