AuthorTopic: this time a hand made character- need crits  (Read 11819 times)

Offline piotrek255

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this time a hand made character- need crits

on: June 07, 2007, 06:59:49 pm
16 colors, done in 1 hour
edit -> edit---> edit-> full edit WIP ->
 edit ->
« Last Edit: June 22, 2007, 10:54:45 am by piotrek255 »
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Offline PippySaid

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Re: this time a hand made character- need crits

Reply #1 on: June 07, 2007, 07:35:33 pm
He kind of reminds me of Jean-Luc Picard from Star Trek. On another note it looks alright, he seems a bit out of proportion and the shades should be more noticable on his shirt because it almost looks as if it is a solid colour. And you really don't need 16 colours for a piece that looks like it could be done in probably 10.

Offline Zee

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Re: this time a hand made character- need crits

Reply #2 on: June 07, 2007, 08:05:05 pm
Theres no sense of weight to that gun at all. He doesn't have to struggle to hold it or balance it. His arm is cradling the butt of the gun like a baby,

Other then that, I like it.

Offline Krut

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Re: this time a hand made character- need crits

Reply #3 on: June 07, 2007, 08:35:13 pm
Hey:

Basically the main problem with this is bad color usage, along with some anatomy problems;

On the lower part of the body, you have some high contrast going on between the 2 tones used there, the lightsource is flawed in the way that the char reacts to it; you could use some integration of the colours, manage those grays and include them as highlights on the pants/legs.
Im also not too fond of the pants/shoes, youve integrated them, in a way they seem like kiddy-pajamas; give him some shoes or something like that, you have the colours to create them using the grays of the gun.

On the upper part, we have the opossite, theres not enough contrast, we have a light red thats barely noticeable up the contrast of those shades, and the same can be applied to the facial features and shadows casted.

The lightsource you have used like i said is flawed, as it doesnt seem to be casted in the same way on all the part of the char, so for instance you should definetely have a highlight on that bold head, and theres none
Im not sure of what that red and black lines on the head are supossed to be (headband?) so you might want to look into that if its a design feature.

I would also add some more logical highlights to the gun, more contrast and a variation of hues on the gray colours.

I also think that you could use some variable weight/colour outlines instead of that selout right now, as i feel its not making the piece better.

You could also apply some AA if you manage to create a good reusable shades colour pallete.

Anatomy wise, i feel that the shoulder position feels uneasy, too squarish i think. Also, acording to the perspective his left shoulder should be a little bit more towards the torso of the char.

The position of the legs/and feet seems a bit too Chaplin-esque to me, might want to look on them.
I dont understand what the left hand is supossed to be doing, or what those white things on the side are, also his right arm seem to have some unexplicable "BUMPS" on it, check that too.

If you need an edit just give a shout.
Looking forward to the progress on this, because regardless of the extensive ammount of critique i gave, i quite like this sprite, keep rocking  :y:

-Krut.

Offline piotrek255

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Re: this time a hand made character- need crits

Reply #4 on: June 07, 2007, 10:03:50 pm
i added some serious changes and updated the sprite in the first post.

Krut-> thanks for this large comment, if you see anything you think needs improving, please retouch and post, for me  it's the best way to learn.
thanks again for your comments people!
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Offline Krut

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Re: this time a hand made character- need crits

Reply #5 on: June 07, 2007, 10:07:59 pm
Clearly an improvement in many areas, but could be more polished.
You should leave the original to compare, and just so the original comments dont loose their context, working on an edit right now.

EDIT: Ok, heres something you should take in account, its not pixel perfect by any chance, but it shows in practice some of the things i wrote before.



-Krut
« Last Edit: June 07, 2007, 10:54:21 pm by Krut »

Offline piotrek255

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Re: this time a hand made character- need crits

Reply #6 on: June 08, 2007, 09:17:27 am
wow, great remake... and it probabbly took you about 20 minutes....now i see what you had in mind, thanks for the help:y:
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Offline Krut

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Re: this time a hand made character- need crits

Reply #7 on: June 09, 2007, 02:40:00 am
wow, great remake... and it probabbly took you about 20 minutes....now i see what you had in mind, thanks for the help:y:

No problem, all the help that you need as long as you keep pushing it;
Show us some new progress!

-Krut.

Offline piotrek255

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Re: this time a hand made character- need crits

Reply #8 on: June 10, 2007, 09:04:45 am

ok, from your update krut i noticed that the problem was in the position of the character. legs and his general shape, so here's an update.
« Last Edit: June 10, 2007, 09:13:07 am by piotrek255 »
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Offline piotrek255

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Re: this time a hand made character- need crits

Reply #9 on: June 10, 2007, 06:48:45 pm
krut: no matter how long i look at it, your edit looks much better than my character.... i noticed that the lightsource in your edit is from the top left side, could you show me some edits with different light sources? this would improve my skills by a LOT

btw, thanks :y:
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Offline Gil

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Re: this time a hand made character- need crits

Reply #10 on: June 10, 2007, 10:05:22 pm
Compositions need flow. It's hard to explain, but for example the angle between the gun and the body is 90, which is generally "not done" for composition.

Offline piotrek255

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Re: this time a hand made character- need crits

Reply #11 on: June 11, 2007, 01:26:08 pm
Gil: I understand the part with the gun, could you  please say something more on this subject? like, what does it mean that the composition needs flow (apart from the gun thing which was a great hint :y:) ?
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Offline Turbo

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Re: this time a hand made character- need crits

Reply #12 on: June 11, 2007, 03:44:59 pm
It's better with the new leg positioning, but you could push it even more.

Keep in mind that Krut's edits, while adressing contrast, some anatomy issues and some composition ones, do tend to be an interpretation in his style, moving completely away from your initial one. Although i don't think his pose helps much, i'd recommend showing weight by balancing his body back to counterbalance the huge (aparent) weight on the front (and the back leg would also move back more, bending at the knee, the gyus torso leaning back some). Other than that, take a look at how Krut's edit works on the color contrast department (specifically on the top part): bold contrast, hue and saturation jumps. Also, clearly defined areas and shapes (with the help of those contrasting colors).

Offline piotrek255

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Re: this time a hand made character- need crits

Reply #13 on: June 11, 2007, 04:05:10 pm
oh, now i see it, so now he loks like he is some kind of a plastic figure, with zero weight and a gun that is made of plastic, he should bend his knees and lower his torso, holding the gun so its more facing the floor, wioth a kind of sneaky pose with his eyesight at the front.

i'll make an upedate as soon as i have time, but please correct me if my idea is wrong. thanks
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Offline Gil

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Re: this time a hand made character- need crits

Reply #14 on: June 11, 2007, 04:32:51 pm


As you can see in this crude sketch, you drew the same thing, only krut didn't use a single straight line in there. The fact that he rendered it completely different is not as important as the fact that there's a knee bend, and a torso bend in there.

This is only composition within a smaller piece, but it applies to all pieces that the curvature of a line is what makes stuff nice to look at.

Offline Turbo

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Re: this time a hand made character- need crits

Reply #15 on: June 11, 2007, 10:45:40 pm
I don't think that posture's very good for his back. I was thinking more along the lines of this: (sketch on the left shows the idea better)


Also added some suggestions for color contrast.

Offline piotrek255

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Re: this time a hand made character- need crits

Reply #16 on: June 12, 2007, 11:43:19 am
new update , i still cant get a hold of the shadows but i'm working on it >:(

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Offline Helm

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Re: this time a hand made character- need crits

Reply #17 on: June 12, 2007, 12:20:43 pm
Sorry for not being very helpful generally, but on the last edit most prominently, there's a very freudian overtone to it. Are you sure you'd rather disregard it and end up with people snickering when they see your art?

Offline piotrek255

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Re: this time a hand made character- need crits

Reply #18 on: June 12, 2007, 12:33:42 pm
i dont really know what you mean by freudian tone, i checked in dictionary and sigmund freud pops out.
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Offline Snippa

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Re: this time a hand made character- need crits

Reply #19 on: June 12, 2007, 12:36:11 pm
I actually checked as well.. :P
Never heard that word used that way...
But I believe he's trying to say that the gun seems even more weightless now than it did before...

Offline Helm

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Re: this time a hand made character- need crits

Reply #20 on: June 12, 2007, 12:50:56 pm
No I am saying the gun looks like a humongous erect phallus.

Offline piotrek255

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Re: this time a hand made character- need crits

Reply #21 on: June 12, 2007, 12:53:46 pm
OMG youre right!!! better think again before i add red shading to the end of such a gun :o
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Offline Snippa

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Re: this time a hand made character- need crits

Reply #22 on: June 12, 2007, 01:01:26 pm
No I am saying the gun looks like a humongous erect phallus.
Oh, lol
Didn't realize that, though I feel my comment about it looking more weightless is still valid. :P

Offline Helm

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Re: this time a hand made character- need crits

Reply #23 on: June 12, 2007, 01:02:01 pm
...also carried at hip height, and tilted upwards. Virile.

Offline piotrek255

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Re: this time a hand made character- need crits

Reply #24 on: June 12, 2007, 01:08:26 pm
well, while making it i didnt notice what you noticed. to me, he holds the gun on his stomach's hight, not the hips, i dunno, though the tip of the gun looks strange, i wouldnt have noticed that if you hadnt told me
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Offline Snippa

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Re: this time a hand made character- need crits

Reply #25 on: June 12, 2007, 01:11:57 pm
Something else you might want to think about is the yellow colors on the gun.
at 1x it looks like it's his thumb on the gun (to me anyways)... the color just seems too close to the skin color and makes it look like his hand is shaped oddly.
May just be me though.

Offline vellan

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Re: this time a hand made character- need crits

Reply #26 on: June 12, 2007, 01:48:54 pm
imo the largest problem is the complete lack of a light source. every edit you change poses and guns, but the form and volume wont ever be there because there because there is no light hitting anything.

Krut's edit started to roughly add a direct light source and it worked wonders.

Offline piotrek255

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Re: this time a hand made character- need crits

Reply #27 on: June 12, 2007, 02:57:57 pm
i added some light, and changed his legs again. i know a little how light bounces off of objects but i think its simply not enough... i seriously need to get it right or else i'm stuck in pixelart:/ all your great advices are helping a lot, i think that i'm improving slowly, but improving, thanks.
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Offline piotrek255

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Re: this time a hand made character- need crits

Reply #28 on: June 19, 2007, 07:12:08 pm
after couple of hours, i came to realize that i have to start from the very beggining, here's a new character, its work in progress, i will fix the gun and shading, but this is roughly what i came up with. btw. he wars jeans, do they look like jeans? 0_0....
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Offline AlexHW

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Re: this time a hand made character- need crits

Reply #29 on: June 19, 2007, 07:35:27 pm
that last edit shows massive improvement.
My opinion though is that the clothing looks rather ordinary. A couple key details for the clothing could help give him more character.
How about beige colored pants? red and blue is pretty elementary..

Offline piotrek255

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Re: this time a hand made character- need crits

Reply #30 on: June 19, 2007, 07:53:10 pm
i wanted to stay with my original concept, but i will try the color you suggested in the next edit
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Offline Obsidian

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Re: this time a hand made character- need crits

Reply #31 on: June 19, 2007, 07:58:53 pm
I think the guns are too big; once again you have a weight problem there. There's no way that guy could hold those guns like that, especially since he's pretty skinny. Still much better than before though.

Offline piotrek255

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Re: this time a hand made character- need crits

Reply #32 on: June 19, 2007, 08:19:07 pm
i think that i just played too much japanese games, everything they make is overpowered......
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Offline AdamAtomic

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Re: this time a hand made character- need crits

Reply #33 on: June 19, 2007, 08:30:00 pm
hey great progress - the lines on his headband, the way they fly out seems very arbitrary and hurts the compo a bit - otherwise, PROCEED

Offline piotrek255

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Re: this time a hand made character- need crits

Reply #34 on: June 22, 2007, 10:55:28 am
next edit, i plan to work on the gun some more

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Offline mangust

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Re: this time a hand made character- need crits

Reply #35 on: June 22, 2007, 03:06:47 pm
Wow!
I glad for you - you not be afraid a full revamp - it's good the trait of character)))
Very good. But I think, if the Big Guns, than man must be a bit mighty in hand? Now is some comic )) But maybe it's a good.
Anyway this me like more, than first design.

Offline piotrek255

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Re: this time a hand made character- need crits

Reply #36 on: June 22, 2007, 04:33:54 pm
omg, i have to change the shading a bit... i just noticed that his chest looks like woman's breasts.... thanks for commenting. i'm working on another char right now, keep a good look on this thread :y:
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