Homebrew DS pixel editors?

[Atnas]

Hey guys, did a search but everything was pretty scattered. I'm looking for a nice pixel art editor for the DS.

There's SEDS by our very own PypeBros: http://www.wayofthepixel.net/pixelation/index.php?topic=7049.0 And a link to his page with latest beta: http://sylvainhb.blogspot.com/p/sprite-editor.html

Argyle as well as Kasumi mentioned Animanatee in a topic somewhere. http://deku.rydia.net/

I'll be trying these two out tonight and I'll come back with some feedback, as I'm sure others can benefit from a topic dedicated to just DS pixel editors.

Anyway, does anyone else know of other quality pixel editors for the DS? I've heard of a few others but I'm not sure what's best from a serious pixel artist's perspective.

Anyway, thank you.

[HughSpectrum]

Inchworm Animation for people without flash cards is capable of pixel work.

[Atnas]

Well last night I tried out SEDS and animanatee. SEDS is definitely not user friendly haha. I think I saw PypeBros admit that somewhere as well.

Animanatee on the other hand was quite nice. It's geared towards animation. It has an editable 60 color palette and 2 layers though.. As well as a dither brush and 16x zoom. So it's the better option of the two HOWEVER it doesn't have basic copy/paste so tiling is going to be a pain. Should be ideal for sprites however as the animation is already such a focus. Surprisingly its the only pixel editor I've used with pressure, haha.

Made this limpy walk cycle when testing it out:

I would try out inchworm if there was a .nds version, but there is not. I am looking into Pocket Pixie DS, but apparently there's no save feature. Oh well.

I'll report back later with more experiments and possibly other homebrews.

[Kasumi]

"One day"™ I want to make my own DS art program, but I have to get more of my game engine finished before I create my music and graphics creating programs.

To get around lack of copy and paste in animanatee, here is the clunky workaround I do. Copy frame. Paste to a new frame. Erase everything you don't want selected. Turn on onion skinning. Scroll the image frame around with the scroll tool. Use the onion skinning to position it to where you want it pasted. Copy frame. Go back to first frame. Paste frame.

Sounds really complicated, but once you're used to it it doesn't take very long.

[Atnas]

Haha! That's genius! Thank you very very much.

[PypeBros]

Well last night I tried out SEDS and animanatee. SEDS is definitely not user friendly haha. I think I saw PypeBros admit that somewhere as well.

That's indeed something I'm aware of, most likely due to the fact I modeled the tool after an old game-maker, and partly because I somehow ignore how to produce quality pixel art with regular paint programs. I know that the option I picked to use the buttons of the DS as part of the UI make it hard to learn ... and the fact that clicking and L-clicking may do different things on different objects certainly doesn't help either.

I'd be happy to hear your #3 improvements for the software, anyway. Knowing the userbase better would certainly help doing user-friendly software: I have no pixel artist around IRL that could provide such feedback.

Btw, loading/saving from .png files is not something I'd want to integrate on the homebrew, but I have plans for something like "load from/save to imgur.com" ... If I manage to use their API.

Other question, do you think a UI that reminds the user of possible actions would be more useful for you ?
Finally, assuming that you'd be comfortable with the controls, is the edition of 16x16 or 32x32 areas of a 64x192 canvas of any help, or are you actually looking for something that would be closer to the 'sketch-on-DS' use case suggested by Panda a while ago ?

[Atnas]

I'm personally more of a game artist, I think I've only ever made "pixel art" about 5 times or something. Not something I'm too interested in. The sprite focus is definitely good for me.

My main problem with the interface is even with the documentation, I have no idea what anything does and the controls don't respond as I'd expect, in fact at times they seem situational. I think if a little screenspace was dedicated to a tiny toolbox it would help things a lot. Another option is a sort of pop up menu like animanatee does: when you hold a key, in their case it's L, all the options are at your fingertips.

Also, sometimes when I'm fooling around with the tools to try to learn them, I get locked out and cant find my way back to drawing and need to restart.

While I pixel I'll only ever have one hand for buttons, so making the left (or right, its usually mirrored in ds tools) dpad (buttons) contain everything I'll need is a plus.

If you want, I could give you a mockup of what sort of thing would be most helpful. SEDS is much more powerful than anything else out there, it's just much harder to use.

My own level editors etc that I have made in the past are a bit cryptic and someone else wouldn't know where to start - so I definitely understand why SEDS is hard to use.

[PypeBros]

So, if I convert that into a todo list ...
#1: make sure there's *always* a button that brings you back to the drawing mode when you've left it.
#2: visual feedback for the tool currently used, and a way to activate tools for people who find ABXY and R hard to use.
#3: extra feature through a pop-up menu

If you want, I could give you a mockup of what sort of thing would be most helpful. SEDS is much more powerful than anything else out there, it's just much harder to use.

Yes please. Indicate the items that puzzled you, those which were hard to use. There's a lot of room that has been "saved for future use" (namely, layers support), but there's no plan to work on layers on the "grid window" anymore, rather for merging "AnimEDS" and SEDS in a single program.

Oh, and a list of functions you'd invoke from the pop-up menu would be good.

[PypeBros]

I updated the latest beta so that objective #1 is met. You've got a 'Draw button' on screen that will take you back to the drawing grid. Please ignore the "A B ? / \" buttons that appeared at the top of the drawing screen: these aren't responsive yet. They'll become your right-hand button alternative if you don't feel like pressing buttons with the stylus in your fingers

[Atnas]

Hey, I can't seem to find the draw button? But I think it's great that you're working towards those points. I'll try to get that mockup done of what I'd find an optimum setup soon.

[PypeBros]

on these snapshot, you see them high-lighted. It won't appear on the "drawing" screen, of course, but I think that could be the place for the "extra actions menu" on that screen. Unless usability dictates me to do otherwise (i.e. put it in a corner for easier reach).

[Argyle]

It's not homebrew or anything, but Inchworm Animation is great from the DSi shop (might be on 3DS too, not sure)

Strangely enough, it's made by the studio that created movies like Waking Life and A Scanner Darkly.

I don't have any drawings or anything that I've done in completion on there, but it lets you use the camera for stop motion as well as having aliased/non-aliased artwork and onion skinning.

My Gallery is masterful

Here's some pixel art that somebody on PixelJoint made using Inchworm:


by TheBlackMarket

[HughSpectrum]

(might be on 3DS too, not sure)

It is.

They claimed they were gonna make a 3DS version, but the DSi version is available anyway.

[PypeBros]

I'll try to get that mockup done of what I'd find an optimum setup soon.

Btw, there's another feature I've got as a plan for a while. Please let me tell whether it should be prioritized over other development.

Idea would be to have a free-drawing, 1-bit canvas that can be overlaid transparently over the grid you're drawing on.

That would be to receive some lineart of the thing to be drawn that remains persistent. I wouldn't put "erase" nor "line" features, just bare "plot pixel" on a transparent layer, a slider to select transparency level and a button to clear the canvas or to return to a grid canvas. Does that sound useful to you ?

Here's some pixel art that somebody on PixelJoint made using Inchworm

I see on his gallery page that he also used graphics gale afterwards. I'd be curious to know whether the actual 'pixel art' could be started on inchworm as well or has been done purely in GG over an animated sketch on inchworm animation...
I'll give the tool a second try anyway (I think that's the one I've downloaded was flipnote studio, which doesn't do the trick for pixel art).

edit: no inchworm animation mentioned anywhere on my DSi shop here. Looks like it's one of those software (together with Cave Story) that isn't released world-wide but only in selected areas. >_<

[PypeBros]

the controls don't respond as I'd expect, in fact at times they seem situational

I'm taking a second read at your earlier response. "situational" as in "behaviour depending on some hidden internal state you have no idea what it currently is" ?
I'm not too sure I've understood whether you're talking about on-screen widgets or use of other DS input buttons, here.

I'd love to ask you a little poll.
for the following actions: sketch on the grid, change the color, erase something, save a intermediate step before proceeding further, reverting to a previously saved state, reuse a previously picked colour, save your work, design your own colours, do an animation test, make a tile that tiles, switch the grid size (16x16 <-> 32x32)

• A) you found which widget on screen was involved (5=immediately,..., 1=not at all, 0=you thought it was impossible)
• B) you managed to do what you wanted (5=immediately, 1=you stopped trying)
• C) after you succeeded to do it, the way the control work seemed (5=good idea, 3=you could learn it, 2=counter-intuitive, 1=didn't figured out how it worked)
• D) describe how you'd proceed to do it again
• E) describe how you'd rather have it working

PS: here's a google doc spreadsheet with the form if you want to fill easily.

[PypeBros]

Here's my first catch at the toolset widget. I don't have time today to encode the icons for pencil - block - fill - lighten - darken tools (so they are still A B ? / \ regular characters). Feel free to offer your 8x8 pixel art for the job

And of course, let me know whether it sounds more useable. You can grab the latest version here or just

• go to some place where your WiFi likes your DS,
• launch your currently installed SEDS version,
• press (START) to enter file mode,
• hold (L) and (R) and then press (SELECT) when they're hold

and the tool will then access the Internet, download the latest 'beta' version and reboot itself. Make sure you don't have unsaved data before you upgrade your copy of SEDS

edit now with proper icons for the tools.

[PypeBros]

a thought about feedback the program gives to the user ... should the pixel editor produce sound at all ?

[PypeBros]

I just filed AnimEDS -- the companion Animation Editor for SEDS -- to the Neocompo 2012.


If anyone around tries it, I'm eager to know your feedback in terms of User Interface for the following actions (use the same form as for SEDS, just tell which program you're reporting):

- open a .SPR file
- create a simple (one-component) animation
- pick an existing animation for edit
- review the existing animations in a file
- change the location of one of the components (limbs) on a frame
- change the sprite used by one of the components
- preview your modified animation
- change timing (speed up/down the anim)
- create your own character structure
- toggle animation looping