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Messages - Arne
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31
Pixel Art Feature Chest / Re: PixelArt tutorial illustration and mini dump
« on: September 18, 2013, 06:49:08 pm »
Oh, more? I'll include those next update. I actually did a very similar stonehenge gate for my GB version (reference to Valkyrie no Bouken).



Blentard v0.43 now supports reloading gfx while in-game, and up to 8 sheets which are assigned randomly to each region. I included 4 sample regions.

I don't know much about demoscene art. I liked the logos the most. The figurative art (I saw) was mostly copies or badly drawn women or screaming psycho faces.

32
Pixel Art / Re: Justin Bailey Pin up
« on: September 09, 2013, 11:30:54 pm »
I thought IvanX's second face edit was pretty spot on myself. It looks like something from Starzinger or the early 80's anime era. Long nose ridge, narrow eyes.



Rough ideas: Use panel lines to sculpt suit. Trunky 80's boots? Propped a leg up for no particular reason. Her original hair color is brunette. Green is with Varia.

33
Pixel Art / Re: Help Needed!
« on: September 09, 2013, 11:48:31 am »
I wouldn't focus on anti-aliasing too much. It's often an artifact of not-pixelart because it's blurry and not very space efficient. I suppose it sort of depends on the scale you're working at and the size of your palette (and whether you actually want a smooth looking surface or not). For me, there's some joy in finding ways to not use AA and solve the detail representation by tweaking the alignment of the pixels and angles.



Shrunk and reduced to 9 colors. Added leafwork and iso perspective guide. Colors go from cold to warm (to cold for the little teal highlight at top of the tree which... probably isn't needed). Trees tend to look a little strange when highlighted a lot with super greens. The leaf work was done by first establishing larger lumps in perspective with the iso box, then I divided that into clusters of 6 pixels +-2 or so (a leaf). The clusters (leafs) are separated by darker values, sometimes gradually with color ramping, sometimes suddenly to keep things interesting.

Edit: Also note that the leafs have more subtle separation (less values used) within the larger groups/lumps. Sometimes there's no separation at all, but a big color field.



34
Pixel Art Feature Chest / Re: PixelArt tutorial illustration and mini dump
« on: September 07, 2013, 06:50:38 pm »
I felt the gray wasn't working on that one. By enhancing saturation points, I mean... when going from dark to light, (and probably pretty desaturated), or just from one form to another, having a 50% blend is a bit boring. By adding some saturation you can say, hey, this thing has some color dimension too. I don't really mean saturated terminators (on a an overexposed red planet you'd only see black where shadowed, white where lit, and say, martian red on the terminator because it's the only place where you can fit in a normally saturated color. I'm more talking about sort of whimsical points of light, chromatic aberration perhaps. Actual color, perhaps. Subsurface scattering, perhaps. Self illumination, perhaps. It doesn't matter so much. It's just to bring in more color dimensionality.



I never uploaded this one for some reason.


Basically I'm talking about a more subtle version of painting with correct values but garbled colors.

A related discussion is what I'd call... color textures... color fields which consists of many colors upon closer inspection, i.e. dithering in pixel art, but with the intent of creating something more than a color rather than just a new value. The impressionists and pointillists did it with gusto. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Henri_de_Toulouse-Lautrec_056.jpg It's pretty common to see artists from any time mix in blue textures into warmer colors but digital art tends to be cleaner nowadays. Paul Bonner works traditionally and likes to use a copper teal: http://www.amazon.co.uk/Out-Forests-The-Paul-Bonner/dp/1845767055 - It's sometimes a plain flat hue shift but I think the double (or triple) color texture has a different feel to it so I wouldn't call that a hue shift. It's visible on the brushstroke level.

Needless to say, this kinda stuff is difficult to do in pixel art with a small palette and so few pixels to work with. Can't quite do the dither-color thing on a tiny NES sprite (pixels are too big) and you wouldn't want to waste a color on just a saturated dot. Can play with adjacencies though, maybe colored outlines.

35
Pixel Art Feature Chest / Re: Reworking Zelda tiles [tips & edits welcome!]
« on: September 06, 2013, 07:01:44 pm »
For the rocky platforms, it might be interesting to use cold vs warm. A dark gray purple for the Top and the Sides could be lit up by the lava from below.


36
General Discussion / Re: How long does an RPG world map tileset take?
« on: September 06, 2013, 03:15:23 pm »
I'm thinking they did the daytime graphics first, then implemented nighttime later, at which point the artist had to paint in the index for window light anyways. Seems unlikely they painted the nighttime graphics first, or had the foresight to paint in a special index for daytime windows from the start, so it was still extra work, so to speak.

Edit: The best money saving approach for them would probably be to do a complete sheet with "programmer art" and then hire a guy to paint over that.

37
General Discussion / Re: How long does an RPG world map tileset take?
« on: September 06, 2013, 01:56:13 pm »
I'm not disagreeing with 2 days, but then there can't be too many features, things have to go according to a decent plan or the client has to be happy with what sort of came out, and there has to be shortcuts taken like cloning and palette swaps (they did take the time to light up the windows here though). I suggested 1-3 days (close to a thousand bucks with my rate at least) as "lower end" in my original post. I don't know what other people charge though.

If a middle sized developer contacted me wanting a decent looking world map, I'd expect to put a week's time into it though. They might even have concept art for area specific buildings and landmarks which needs to be followed and they probably won't be happy with something looking like Ogre Battle.

38
General Discussion / Re: How long does an RPG world map tileset take?
« on: September 06, 2013, 01:09:47 am »
Perhaps the proper question to answer is "how to go about estimating how much time is needed"...

That Ogre Battle tileset does look like quite a bit of work. Different climate zones * night and sunset versions :o Sure, a lot of it is copied and color tweaked, but I don't think I could churn out a full set like this in say, 12 hours, at least not if I had to figure out the structure/system from scratch, test tiling, run into dead ends, etc.

39
Pixel Art Feature Chest / Re: THE CLUSTER STUDY THREAD!
« on: September 05, 2013, 11:57:36 pm »
Took a look at Shadow dancer. The Mame shots/videos seem to exhibit the problematic popping black tones and pastel colors. Guessing the game looked quite different in the arcades.

Completely reindexed this.



40
General Discussion / Re: How long does an RPG world map tileset take?
« on: September 05, 2013, 09:46:25 pm »
I was talking about something abstractly like that map in terms of features (rather than quality). I'm not familiar with the game, but I'm guessing it has several maps, each with different features. There might even be some climate zones.

If you have 100 tiles and spend 5-10 minutes on each, working nonstop, that's 12.5 hours, which you multiply by pi because all time estimates should be multiplied by pi.

Basically, there will be a lot of extra time on top because the something was done wrong (miscommunication) and needs to be redone, and maybe the mountains looked peculiar so you spend an hour or two fiddling with those, and some beach seams needs fixing, then there's the little towns and buildings which can be unexpected extra assets. And woops, client wanted combinatorial roads too. And then the tiles needed to be fiddled together on a sprite sheet a certain way. And then there's the first hour of two before starting, just figuring out how to do stuff efficiently, and understanding the client's needs and... tolerances. Maybe he wants a few initial style tests?

But like I said, if the artist knew exactly what to do and got free reins (client will be left with whatever comes out), maybe a full days work (probably split into 3 because communication lag). It's a lot different to just draw something and to draw something for someone else. I'm also assuming the artist isn't sloppy and puts some love into cliff edges and stuff.

If we're talking Ludumdare speed & quality, maybe 4hrs. Perhaps the same for just replicating the particular map that I linked in about the same quality. But that's probably not what the client asks for unless it's some kind of fan game.

Edit: I see now that OP mentioned SNES "quality" so it seems we're talking lower end here. A smaller studio could keep the costs down by figuring out what is needed, limiting the amount of blind alleys run into... but since the post was so vague...

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