AuthorTopic: The Delay  (Read 7584 times)

Offline Lóng

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The Delay

on: April 21, 2012, 06:38:31 pm


The current colors are placeholders until I put together a palette.

I'm thankful for any kind of input, anything is subject to change well except the core Idea.

Offline Mathias

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Re: The Delay

Reply #1 on: April 21, 2012, 07:57:22 pm
"Failing artistically gallery"? Another self-deprecating artist. Welcome to the phoald.





















Anyway, sure, why not some crit, I overate this morning so I afford this

INITIATE CRITBARF SEQUENCE. GARBAGECOLLECTION(NULL)=TRUE.ZOMG

First thought - why did he texture the tree's foliage that way; distracting, makes no sense. Looks like two striped snakes gettin' they freak on.
What is the intention here? What is the desired end-result? Seems like a random pixel piece fueled by little to no inspiration - landscape and a tree . . ? Bored + double-clicked my Paint shortcut. Wild.
Tree looks like one of those typical safari trees, yet there's the obligatory mountain range in the BG.
Time of day must be sunrise/morning? Whether it's early morning or late at night greatly affects the scene's colors, yet the current palette doesn't acknowledge this.
Compositiony stuff - Either center your tree or place it on a 1/3's mark. The sun partially blocked by the tree creates a bad tangent, IMUO (In My Useless Opinion). The moon saves the top third of the scene from extreme boredom, I like it, though I don't like it's ditherscanlines much, maybe just a standard crescent?
Tree has 2 shadows, why? One is from sun, other is from . . ?
You could add meaning to this scene by placing a resting lion or something under the tree. It would feel less inanimate.
You take no risks. This scene is plain. Turn it into an alien landscape or something. Use unusual colors, and create some odd natural phenomenons. Be adventurous.
The plane is too plain. Less is more, but there's an art to it.





« Last Edit: April 21, 2012, 08:02:10 pm by Mathias »

Offline Lóng

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Re: The Delay

Reply #2 on: April 22, 2012, 12:17:52 pm
Self-depreacting?not at all its the contrary actually, but I guess its anything but evident that the statement in question is meant in a positive manner, well anyway back to the important stuff.

Repixelled the foilage tweaked some colors, what are the current ones lacking to clearly show that its morning?
Regarding the tangent, I thought that this is what aligning for- and background objects are labeled, whereas here the foliage is clearly overlapping the sun. Also attempted texturing the plane, never intended to leave it plain.
I think the moon is fine as it is, I mean after all you were able to recognize it as one. Yeah I've read about the rule of thirds, but on this piece there is nothing there to compete with the tree, so I think I'm not gonna make use of it this time, unless it has some other function besides shifting attention to an object.About the 2 shadows one is from the sun and the other from the sky.As for adding meaning, I can't think of anything more superfluous in a piece, to me all I'm looking for are shapes and colors that are appealing to my eyes.

Where the piece is currently standing

Offline toaster

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Re: The Delay

Reply #3 on: April 22, 2012, 12:28:41 pm
I don't get why you place the shadow of the trees leaves right under the tree, like it's twelve o'clock in the afternoon. While the trunks shadow seems to be alright. ???
I think the new tree is way better.

Offline Lóng

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Re: The Delay

Reply #4 on: April 22, 2012, 06:58:11 pm
As stated above I'm considering 2 lightsources the sun and the sky, thats why the shades are the way they are.
Further update:

Offline Mathias

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Re: The Delay

Reply #5 on: April 22, 2012, 07:02:03 pm
Opposite of self-deprecation certainly isn't announcing to the world you're an artistic failure, but whatever. Not the point of this thread. . .

CRITBARF REGURGITATION EXPULSION CLEANUP ON AISLE17, PLEASE.NOW=TRUE
The bg has an obvious color tinting, but not the fg.
"Regarding the tangent, I thought that this is what aligning for- and background objects are labeled, whereas here the foliage is clearly overlapping the sun."  What?/not understanding . . . The undesirable tangent effect is when there's an area in a composition where multiple things coincidentally intersect and/or form a concentration of details that is potentially found to be confusing, even unsettling/unattractive to the eye. Best avoided. The sun/mts/tree tangent could be worse, but it could also be better.
Yes, obviously it's a moon, what else would a faint, curved shape in the sky be. Just because I can recognize human and animal figures in Picasso's Guernica, does that mean they couldn't be rendered more clearly? Yes it's cubism, but you're not doing cubism.
You don't understand the rule of thirds like I do, I guess. It's simply a device for artists/photogs to strike up pleasing compositions, which is based on human nature itself - what/why the eye finds a composition pleasing or not. No need for "competing" elements in order to utilize it.
If you're referring to ambient, diffused light from the environment that's causing the downward shadow, I don't see how that works - ambient light isn't directional, it doesn't cause hard shadows. Right now, your tree is telling us there are two light sources, one above, one in front. Can you find a photographic example?
No AA. Color conservation? Perhaps. But is it to a detriment?
Canopy detail is still rather odd. Think simpler. Forget about trying to convey every leaf/branch, just imply them.

Offline Phlakes

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Re: The Delay

Reply #6 on: April 22, 2012, 07:48:53 pm
Really quick (about 2 minutes) edit for just one point, the light source is behind the tree, but its shading pretty much completely flat all over. Just a suggestion-



Not saying this is the way to go, just that there are better ways. Especially since the trunk is shaded that way.

Offline Lóng

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Re: The Delay

Reply #7 on: April 28, 2012, 10:30:24 am
Repixeled the foilage, now it considers the sun too and tinted the foreground blue, except for the directly by the sun lit parts, those were tinted yellow.Also weakend the shadow under the tree and broadened it plus some cleaning up on the steppe.

About the moon it only costs me one cluster, is vague enough and can be recognized as a moon, I don't see why I should change it.Regarding the composition/tangent no matter how I look at it in this case rather than unsetting/unattractive it feels calming/serene even when mirrored.

I know I'm barely reusing colors, the reason fot that is retaining/emphasizing the visual heirachy.

What spots would you say need AA?

Current peculiarity:

Offline Magides

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Re: The Delay

Reply #8 on: April 28, 2012, 10:37:52 am
I feel like I shouldn't be able to see the dirt towards the horizon with so much grass.  The closer the grass, yes, but the further should be less and less dirt.

Offline Lóng

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Re: The Delay

Reply #9 on: April 28, 2012, 12:48:47 pm
Good point, reduced the visible dirt in the distance, changed the foilage once more plus some minor edits, I think the piece is slowly getting there.

« Last Edit: April 28, 2012, 03:18:01 pm by Lóng »

Offline jams0988

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Re: The Delay

Reply #10 on: April 28, 2012, 05:07:36 pm
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"Failing artistically gallery"? Another self-deprecating artist. Welcome to the phoald.
I remember reading that people who are brand new to something tend to overestimate their skills, because they're too ignorant to know just how much work it takes to actually get good at whatever they're doing. People who have actually put some work in, ironically, tend to think they're worse than they actually are, because they're beginning to understand how much of a ridiculous undertaking what they're doing is - once they can see how far away their goal is, it makes them dizzy just thinking about it, and it seems even farther away than it really is. =)

I'm not sure stating your honest opinion of yourself is being self-depreciating. I'm always proud of my work, especially after I put my all into it, but I hold no delusions about how good I am compared to the pros, hahah. =D

Long, the color and texture of your grass is making me think of a swamp, rather than a field. The leaves don't seem to be growing out of the branches of your tree - they seem to be just stuck on top of it.

And....I'll be in Japan for two months starting tomorrow. I'll be doing a lot of traditional landscape paintings, so I'll post them here if I can. Goodbye for now, guys. And wish me luck, heheh. =)

Edit: And that shadow under the tree makes no sense. Sorry, Long, but Mathias is right, hahah. The sky doesn't cast hard shadows.
« Last Edit: April 29, 2012, 05:36:23 am by jams0988 »

Offline Lóng

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Re: The Delay

Reply #11 on: April 29, 2012, 04:29:01 pm
Repixeled the ground and altered the palette, regarding the foilage I honestly gotta admit that I ran out of Ideas, I can't think of a further way on depicting it, open for suggestions/Ideas.
Getting closer:


Also Have fun in Japan ;D
« Last Edit: April 29, 2012, 04:43:32 pm by Lóng »

Offline jams0988

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Re: The Delay

Reply #12 on: April 29, 2012, 11:04:31 pm
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Also Have fun in Japan Grin
Thanks! Packing now, lol.
The shadow under the tree looks more believable now that you've made it a bit lighter. I'm not sure how realistic it is, since I haven't really looked into shadows caused by ambient lighting. It seems like it makes some sense, though...

Tough call on that one for me, hahah.

Offline Kcilc

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Re: The Delay

Reply #13 on: April 30, 2012, 05:24:52 pm
Right now, your piece feels like collage made from scraps of different colored wrapping paper. I see a very well defined edge where the grass stops and the mountains begin, and the colors and volumes don't really compliment each other in a way that brings everything together.

Imagine for a second that you're looking at your piece of art in real life. Would you be able to see that horizon line so easily? Would the mountains really leave no sort of shadow on the grass? Would there be such a stark contrast between the color of the mountains and the color of the grass?  Probably not. The edit I made tried to hold more true actuality.



If you look at some pictures of grasslands or even go outside and look for yourself, you'll notice that seeing each and every blade of grass is pretty much impossible. There are, however, little dips and tufts and bumps in the landscape that you do notice. Drawing grass relies heavily on finding those little abnormalities, and exploiting them to make your flat green rectangle come to life. Those little dips and tufts are generally where you should draw a few actual grass blades. For the rest, you can just generalize, and try to capture the much more important illusion of depth.

The same principle goes for how you shade your tree. Don't worry so much about each leaf on your tree. At least when you're still working on the lighting and feel of the piece. The feeling always comes first because that's one of the most important parts of drawing. Before working on each blade of grass, each leaf on the tree, and the fancy dithering to blend the colors of your sky, ask yourself, "Does what I'm drawing feel convincing?" If it doesn't, then take a step back, and try to find out what it is that's holding it back. I can assure you that it's never the shape of the leaf, or any sort of detail like that. Those can help make something already convincing just a little bit more convincing, but it can't change the core feeling of your piece.
Try squinting really hard on your piece to get an idea of what I'm talking about. Blur out all of the details and see what your piece looks like.

Also, don't be discouraged if your attempt at getting that feeling right flops the first time, second time, or whatever time. Let me show you my first try at editing your piece.



That looks like crap, and it's completely removed from what I think you were trying to accomplish. That failure took me a step closer to what I actually wanted to accomplish though, and sometimes, that's all it takes to get on the right track.

Colors also have a very strong effect on the mood and feeling of your piece. That's one of the problems I ran into with the first draft of my edit. It completely disregarded the softness and calm that kind of defines your piece right now. The main thing I tried to address in my edit was the lack of unity. Every part of your picture felt like a completely different entity, and that didn't feel right to me. In your piece, I see mountains, a tree, grass, and the sun; I tried to blur those lines so that all that was left was a landscape. One single very deliberate idea, with one single very deliberate palette. Colors leave a huge impact on the overall effect of any piece. Here's your piece with a slight tweak in the colors. I didn't touch anything else.



You can keep the mute blues for the mountains if you'd like to keep them really far away, but there will need to be some sort of median connecting the two colors. It could be a gradual change as the grass and mountains converge, or it could be some other element, like trees creating a sort of hedge between the grass and mountains.

Now I'd better go before I'm late for work! I hope that this will help.

Offline dman

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Re: The Delay

Reply #14 on: May 03, 2012, 03:52:10 pm
I did a little edit of the sky and the shading on the mountains
« Last Edit: May 04, 2012, 11:18:09 am by Crow »

Offline Lóng

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Re: The Delay

Reply #15 on: May 05, 2012, 11:37:14 am
Is this any better?


@dman: I'm going for a morning scene not a sunset.
« Last Edit: May 06, 2012, 06:43:49 pm by Lóng »