AuthorTopic: Nurse Logo WIP  (Read 14073 times)

Offline Manupix

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Nurse Logo WIP

on: February 17, 2010, 04:17:47 pm
A freelance nurse friend of mine asked me if I could draw a logo for her group.
I decided to give it a try in pixel-art, since I don't know any other digital art technique well enough (and no vector art at all).

I'm not too sure about the design, it looks somewhat oldfashioned but I can't point why exactly nor find a way out.

At this point I'm looking for design advice, more than pixelling. Esp from those pro graphic designers around here! ;)

First doodle with dirty tools:


It incorporates the snake in the Rod of Asclepius; the dancing people are supposed to express the idea that they network at various levels: between them (they're a small 6-people practice in a small country town), with other health professionals and with their patients (usually going to patients homes and working beyond the mere medical acts).
Some refs I checked.

Offline twodayslate

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Re: Nurse Logo WIP

Reply #1 on: February 18, 2010, 12:37:04 am
A pixel art logo... Not the best idea IMO.

Logos need to be printer friendly.
A good tip I try to follow is make a black/white version. If it looks good b/w then color it. This ensures it will print well too.

Why is there a white border? It looks like you just took an image off of google and very poorly took out the white background.

Offline CrazyMLC

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Re: Nurse Logo WIP

Reply #2 on: February 18, 2010, 01:03:00 am
I've gotta say that logos should always be vector.
Logos need to be small to fit on buisiness cards, or big to go on posters. You can't do that with pixel art.

Offline Manupix

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Re: Nurse Logo WIP

Reply #3 on: February 18, 2010, 02:18:36 am
Yes, I'm aware vector would be the way, but as I said it's beyond me at this point.
The intended use so far is only as letterhead, and this only directly from their computer (no need/money for a professional print job).
Also, I'm doing this as a test and for fun. I'll do it best I can, but I'm not a graphic designer ;)

Quote
A good tip I try to follow is make a black/white version. If it looks good b/w then color it. This ensures it will print well too.

Thanks, I'll try that!

Quote
Why is there a white border? It looks like you just took an image off of google and very poorly took out the white background.

No! :D
I doodled the elements on separate layers, then free-transform-resized them for better fit, hence semi-transp border values. Sorry for not cleaning the mess, I'd rather do that when I'm set on a design.

Btw, the other 'dirty tools' involved are blending modes. I do not want the elements hiding each other; and I wanted to try several possible color interaction between them.
It will be all hand-pixelled over later.

Offline twodayslate

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Re: Nurse Logo WIP

Reply #4 on: February 18, 2010, 02:29:28 am
My suggestion would be to mock the idea and give this job to a real designer then. That is unless your friends group is serious. If they are not that serious then pixel art may be just fine...

Offline Jeremy

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Re: Nurse Logo WIP

Reply #5 on: February 18, 2010, 03:07:30 am
You don't have access to any vector-capable software at all ??? Not even the GIMP?

As for the design, I think that some more of a third dimension could help; i.e. making the part of the yellow ring closest to us non-translucent, as well as the snake over the arms and yellow. I guess I meant to make the figures the only translucent-looking element; in that same place with the hands, purple head, yellow ring and snake it becomes a bit of a hodgepodge.

And because I explained that terribly...



I like the design personally :)

Offline Manupix

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Re: Nurse Logo WIP

Reply #6 on: February 18, 2010, 03:41:17 am
Thanks Jeremy!

Quote
You don't have access to any vector-capable software at all ??? Not even the GIMP?
Oh yes: photoshop. What's missing is the vector-capable user.
I've barely doodled a little with vector tools, but I'm far from familiar enough with them to do anything serious yet.

I think you have a point about 3D feeling. That's my main question I believe: should I go for some shading / volume rendering, or for a flat abstract-like color composition?
Both are attractive. Maybe I'll do both! ;)

Offline NaCl

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Re: Nurse Logo WIP

Reply #7 on: February 18, 2010, 04:17:52 am
I think the ring and squiggly line should disappear behind the people, right now it is kind of confusing to look at.

Offline 32

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Re: Nurse Logo WIP

Reply #8 on: February 18, 2010, 06:25:23 am
Something you could do is draw the logo using your pixel program, maybe twice the resolution, then use a vector tracing program. Inkscape should do, and it's free.

I think the design itself is pretty nice but it doesn't communicate medical to me. Perhaps try using some colours that relate more, red and white are the obvious choices. Definitely agree with NaCl on the ring and snake.

Offline Manupix

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Re: Nurse Logo WIP

Reply #9 on: February 19, 2010, 02:40:04 am
OK, I'll keep that transparency in check for the next versions, thanks!

I think the design itself is pretty nice but it doesn't communicate medical to me. Perhaps try using some colours that relate more, red and white are the obvious choices.

Well, that's specifically one design request: nice warm colors, no cold distant big hitech hospital feeling which does not relate to how they work. The red snake is the closest I'll get to that, and even that red is not really red.

Offline NaCl

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Re: Nurse Logo WIP

Reply #10 on: February 19, 2010, 03:16:21 am
Not sure about where you live, but the caduceus is the traditional symbol for medicine in the US, even though it really has nothing to do with medicine. Short of that, actually adding the rod for the serpent to wind around would more clearly show "medicine". Right now I think it's a little hard to tell it's a snake at a glance.

Offline Jeremy

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Re: Nurse Logo WIP

Reply #11 on: February 19, 2010, 04:46:39 am
Actually this'un would be more of a Rod of Asclepius. Apparently it's also the origin of the striped barbers' pole (The first surgeons being barbers). Or so my uncle told me.

On second thoughts, having the figures solid and the snake and ring transparent might be better :)

Offline twodayslate

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Re: Nurse Logo WIP

Reply #12 on: February 19, 2010, 04:51:23 am
I just realized that the orange thing was supposed to be a snake. Just thought it was a random swirl...

Offline STE 86

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Re: Nurse Logo WIP

Reply #13 on: February 20, 2010, 12:26:05 am
generally speaking in my advertising design job, private medical outfits like nurses and carers and mental health will usually adopt shades of green for their logos as its a very neutral soothing colour. it promotes the idea of peace and harmony.

also be very careful about using the translucent effects, as at letterheading size, they will tend to blur and logos do need to be sharp.

% shades of a single colour like a single green would also enable professional printing of the logo to be done in cheaper "spot" colour as opposed to the more expensive 4 colour CMYK process at a later date if required (when they realise that to print their own letterheads in any quantity is extortionately expensive on an ink jet desktop) :)

also generally speaking an earlier poster was correct. if u can make a logo work in mono first then the same logo will be easier to make work in colour.

Steve

edit:

after looking at the design again from a logo POV rather than a pixel one, i think if i were u i would try it without the ring too, u already have a ring in the shape of the 3 people to signify care and support. u could even tilt them slightly towards the angle the ring was at. the simpler the better for a logo tbh.

also 1 last thing u could even simplify the snake down to just a series of "S" shaped curves with no actual head in a similar style to your figures.
« Last Edit: February 20, 2010, 01:01:52 am by STE 86 »

Offline Manupix

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Re: Nurse Logo WIP

Reply #14 on: February 20, 2010, 01:46:36 am
Thank you Steve, that's highly valuable advice!

Latest version:



Redrew it at the larger original scale; tried to make the snake more stylized and graceful, and got rid of the ring.
Decided those before reading your latest edit: looks like we're on the same thought track!
I'll seriously consider the possibility of a headless snake too.

Greyscale (because of overlapping shapes) and pure black versions; sure gives a better idea of how shapes work together.
Also it might have to show acceptably on just any B&W desktop printer.

@ NaCl, Jeremy: yes it's Asclepius's rod - see my first post ;)
Over here too (France) the rod appears in the most traditional forms; these look too rigid however in my (our) opinion. They're more suitable for really official documents, like parking permits...
My friend is not even insistent on the snake. I think it's important.

In many of the google refs which are specific caducei (???) for nurses, the rod is actually an I for Infirmier (nurse). We're not getting into that either.
For the fun, the one with a large O is the midwives'! (and a lovely one too)

Offline STE 86

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Re: Nurse Logo WIP

Reply #15 on: February 20, 2010, 08:47:20 am
try the snake in 10%-20% black so its the lightest thing on the greyscale one. its competing for attention a bit too much at the moment where i think it should be secondary. afterall in the caring profs, "the people" would be the main focus. definitely leave it in tho coz it does say "medical" to me.

and maybe try a couple where the ring of people are not so horizontal. in the same manner that your original ring was. definitely coming down the right path now tho i think.and the simplified version will be much easier and cheaper for a print agency to reproduce in vectors should itbe necessary and you not want to do it :)

Steve

Offline Jeremy

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Re: Nurse Logo WIP

Reply #16 on: February 20, 2010, 09:12:04 am
I think that even though they want neither design nor colours to be what you think of when someone says "Nurse", it may be reading as a bit too hippy; if you're not careful maybe even a logo for a design company  :P
If I'm right, France uses the green + sign and blue * (With caduceus on it)? Hospital colours are pastelly greens, blues and pinks; so maybe even raising the saturation of those colours and using them might work? Although, removing the ring looks good so maybe the design is streamlined enough now :P

(Snake looks off center to me, should be more to the left)

Offline STE 86

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Re: Nurse Logo WIP

Reply #17 on: February 20, 2010, 05:53:15 pm
hi i vectorised your image and made the ammends to illustrate what i meant. it starts to get a bit complex in just words :)



Steve

Offline Manupix

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Re: Nurse Logo WIP

Reply #18 on: February 21, 2010, 03:55:34 am
Thanks guys.
Steve, that's epic! Next thing I learn is vector drawing.  ::)

I followed most of your advice, starting from a redrawn, rounder arms ellipse and cleaner lines.
2 versions of snake, 2 versions of tilt with some distortion too.
I think I prefer the snake with its head. The tilt brought some unwelcome transparencies again.  >:(

(Btw, there isn't a way to free-transform (in photoshop) without auto AA, is there?)

Also tried 2 'cooler' color versions; interesting but not there yet.




Then I experimented a bit with color reductions. Some interesting options there, especially with the greyish/brownish tones.





Awwright, this is drifting further and further away from pixels, I'm sorry about that. The end product will be pure pixels, I promise!  :lol:
Even so, if you mods wish to move this thread to a more appropriate place, I won't mind!

Edit: forgot to put numbers on the images for further discussion.

First row:
1  2  3  4

2nd and 3rd rows:
5   6   7   8
9  10  11  12
« Last Edit: February 21, 2010, 03:58:32 am by Manupix »

Offline Atnas

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Re: Nurse Logo WIP

Reply #19 on: February 21, 2010, 03:21:39 pm
I'm sure this could qualify as low-spec. Personally I would move directly to the vector, you have a good design and pixels don't work well for logos simply because they're raster in nature. I think if you want AA practice you should probably do it with something for yourself rather than for another. But if there's no rush on this then don't let me stop you!

Offline STE 86

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Re: Nurse Logo WIP

Reply #20 on: February 21, 2010, 11:31:11 pm
vector drawing is very easy to pick up but requires a slightly different "mindset" to raster.

with vector u are plotting and curving beziers, but to my students i always tried to explain it by saying the nearest "real world" type of art i can think of is constructing a picture from layers of cut paper.

Steve

Offline Manupix

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Re: Nurse Logo WIP

Reply #21 on: February 22, 2010, 03:07:35 pm
Cleaned lines on the tilted version (13).
I'm now painfully aware of the stupidity of doing this in pixels.  :-[

I'm not satisfied with the interaction of legs and snake tail in the lower left corner.
The composition looks confused there, and all those pointy things give off an aggressive feel.

I tried to remedy it in two ways: rounding the leg tips (14); and reversing some curves (15).
I think 14 is my fav, but it doesn't really address the composition issue. Is there one really?

Offline Stickman

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Re: Nurse Logo WIP

Reply #22 on: February 22, 2010, 04:02:00 pm
I like the look of the logo and I prefer number 14 as I like the direction that the curves flow in. I would say that it looks too "generic star character" which is quite common. Definitely go vector when you have the chance.

Offline STE 86

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Re: Nurse Logo WIP

Reply #23 on: February 22, 2010, 09:56:28 pm
yeah i like 14

if u arent happy with the way the legs and snake tail meet, one small edit you could try is to very slightly extend the snake tail and curve it off to the right away from the dark starmans leg. just add a small flick curve to the right on the end of it. nothing huge.

just a thought.

Steve

EDIT: like u had it in your first 2 example posts :)
« Last Edit: February 22, 2010, 11:39:33 pm by STE 86 »

Offline Manupix

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Re: Nurse Logo WIP

Reply #24 on: February 23, 2010, 08:46:03 pm
Latest:



Longer snake with that little tail stroke to the right: thanks Steve! Starguys lines cleaned a bit more (some bumpiness remains here and there).

New color trials, using these palettes.
There is a logic in that: these are the local colors. I certainly had not planned that use when I first made them!
I'm not saying (yet) I'll stick to them, just wanted to see what could happen.

Offline Stickman

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Re: Nurse Logo WIP

Reply #25 on: February 24, 2010, 12:58:02 am
I really like colours for number 17, but I do wonder what other background colours the logo might be put onto...

Offline Chis

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Re: Nurse Logo WIP

Reply #26 on: February 24, 2010, 02:00:21 am
I like 18 and 19; the orange colors emit vitality.

Offline Jeremy

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Re: Nurse Logo WIP

Reply #27 on: February 24, 2010, 03:05:38 am
Liking 19 :)

Offline Hellaphone

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Re: Nurse Logo WIP

Reply #28 on: February 24, 2010, 10:40:59 am
I can't help but think of a group of people summoning some kind of nefarious demon. Of course, no one's really going to think of that when they see it, so it's no problem. Made me chuckle though.

Offline Dr D

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Re: Nurse Logo WIP

Reply #29 on: February 24, 2010, 06:53:22 pm
I can't help but think of a group of people summoning some kind of nefarious demon. Of course, no one's really going to think of that when they see it, so it's no problem. Made me chuckle though.

Sh*t, can't un-see.

Offline Manupix

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Re: Nurse Logo WIP

Reply #30 on: February 25, 2010, 02:00:57 am


AAed the greyscale version (to a white bg; might need some fixing yet); tried more color versions (AA between color zones will have to be fixed).
I like messing with colors so much that I'll have a hard time settling for one.  :blind:

Hellaphone, DrD:  :lol:

Offline STE 86

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Re: Nurse Logo WIP

Reply #31 on: February 25, 2010, 07:52:19 am
generally speaking i would not use red and green in a logo. the colours tend to "clash" with the eye when in print.

there used to be an ols axiom taught in artschool that "red and green must not be seen"

tho this is not a hard and fast rule, the use of red and green in advertising is usually limited to "christmas" ads (because of the holly and berries etc)

your use of blue and orange would work, tho i would go for purer hues.

also u could use deep blue and golden yellow for the people

Steve

Offline Kælaar

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Re: Nurse Logo WIP

Reply #32 on: February 25, 2010, 10:13:27 am
I completely agree with STE, the one that really catches my eye is the blue and orange one but when looking at it i find it a bit faded looking.
though the spiral thing in the middle is alright, because it makes more sense for the people to be the focus in something like this. or at least to me =)
Good luck!

Offline Manupix

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Re: Nurse Logo WIP

Reply #33 on: February 25, 2010, 06:47:39 pm
Thanks again guys for the valuable advice!

By orange and blue, I guess you mean 23?

I improved from that: saturated colors (not too much, I think the early suggestions about pastel-looking colors were good; also the blue is at the limit of printability, according to my color management photoshop settings).
Also fixed AA between color zones.