AuthorTopic: How did the old masters create their pixel artwork (e.g. Simon the Sorcerer)?  (Read 33244 times)

Offline Helm

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Speaking of "no rants" I wonder if next time something like this comes around we should start enforcing that rule in earnest. I wonder if the cumulative 'letting off steam' benefits of threads like these are worth the negatively charged atmosphere.

Offline Bkeegan

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« Last Edit: March 11, 2010, 06:52:25 am by Bkeegan »
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Offline Rawsushi

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There are several reasons for choosing to use dithering in a piece. Aside from creating textures, it's also used when trying to keep color counts to a minimum, or when working with a predefined palette. I feel as though there's a stigma attached to dithering because of it's misuse. A lot of beginners use it on smaller pieces, or use only a 50/50 (checkerboard) pattern, or use it when the palette's contrast is so high that the dither work sticks out like a sore thumb. There are certainly times when it should and should not be used.

Dithering is most impressive when you can't tell that it's being used at all.

You certainly could just add another color to your palette in place of a dither pattern if you're working without restrictions, but there comes a point when you may as well just not do pixel art at all, you know? Might as well just switch from PENCIL mode to BRUSH mode.

Offline Helm

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Bkeegan: I checked out your thread. That comment by Shrub is certainly not in the spirit of Pixelation. Critique is free for all doesn't matter pro or commercial. So don't take his comment to heart. If Shrub continues on this path he's going to get strikes.

The problem with your art is not so much that whether it is or is not pixel art in the abstract, it is that it's not clean and controlled. Progressing towards an arbitrary goal of 'is my art pixel art?' is not really the point in itself (well it is sometimes, but I don't think in your case). People usually make pixel art because it suits their needs on how to create their art in a timely fashion, with controlled means that are reliable to apply and the end assets usable in their games or whatever else. This is where Pixelation can help you. If you want to learn to control your indexed palettes, to do proper dithering, to do proper anti-aliasing and other such techniques, you have done well to come here. If you're not interested in those things, check out the 'low spec art' part of the forum. Though probably if you post what you posted before there people'll still tell you to try to remake your pieces using pixel art techniques because that's what the climate here is when it comes to 'messy' semi-pixel art like this.

So about your complaints: it is unimportant if you're a pixel purist or not, it is unimportant whether you like dithering or not. What is important is that you take advice by people that are trying to help you to learn to convey the items you're trying to render in pixel art means better. You seem lacking in fundamental concepts on how to do art, so don't worry right now on whether some 7 post new user told you off for whatever reason and just get down and dirty and learn.

Offline Dusty

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I have never, ever felt smothered in the least by the rules or community here. I honestly don't know where anyone gets this feeling from. It's not like it's a gallery such as PJ where things can be rejected because they don't follow the rules. Either people will reply with their opinion, or you won't get any replies at all.

By the way, there are so many pieces here that have benefited the advice of members here.
http://www.wayofthepixel.net/pixelation/index.php?topic=2528.0
Has a few examples of pieces that started out bland/mediocre/poor and through the cooperation of the artist and the community ended up with amazing pieces.

I have had nothing but good feelings towards the community here at pixelation. Does that mean it's perfect? No. It's a community, so there will be some members that can give bad vibes, but there is nothing that can be done about it(most get weeded out pretty fast, though).

Offline Gil

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I'm just a bit curious bkeegan.

If you don't like color preservation or dithering or any predefined pixel art techniques, what is it you hope to achieve on this forum?

Offline Bkeegan

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« Last Edit: March 11, 2010, 06:52:02 am by Bkeegan »
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Offline Rawsushi

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And you're at that point, sadly. When dealing with shiny objects, it's best to use dithering sparingly if at all. As not to derail this thread even further, I'll do a quick edit and post it in the "[WIP] Small icons..." thread.
« Last Edit: March 11, 2010, 10:38:25 am by Rawsushi »

Offline Bkeegan

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And you're at that point, sadly. When dealing shiny objects, it's best to use dithering sparingly if at all. As not to derail this thread even further, I'll do a quick edit and post it in the "[WIP] Small icons..." thread.


I was put to an ultimatum to use dithering and less shades....so that's what I did =p.

Agreed though, it's noticeable.
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Offline Dusty

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Don't you think you're exaggerating the situation a bit?

I don't see any ultimatum's in your thread. All I see is Helm pointing out your piece as 177 colors, which is an insane amount for pixel art, and pretty much means that it's not, especially for a sprite of that size. However, did he close the thread and throw you out of the forums? No. His reason for pointing it out was because the approach was not benefiting your art, and even went out of his way to provide a great edit.  He even said that it didn't need to be a 'pixel purist' piece in the end, so much that the mindset of a pixel purist will help the art, which is true. When you work with images at that resolution, thinking like a pixel artist will benefit you no matter if you're making pixel art or not. The smaller the size, the more individual pixels play a larger role in the overall image people will see. Thus, knowing how a pixel artist would approach an image means you can manipulate these factors to create a better image. Contrast, pixel clusters, dithering, seamless tiling, patterns... knowing how to manipulate these things can only be helpful in the future, even if you're not working in pixel art. I know I've applied things I've learned from pixel art to my sketches and I think they look better because of it.

Also, I don't see where it was said dithering was needed or forced. You can pull off great shading with minimal colors without dithering. Again, the edits do a good job of showing this. I don't see why you're taking such helpful replies and blowing them out of proportion into some sort of negative thing.
« Last Edit: March 11, 2010, 05:31:06 am by Dusty »