AuthorTopic: [WIP]Trees related  (Read 28870 times)

Offline micintexp

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Re: Second Try For Tree

Reply #10 on: November 22, 2009, 10:23:04 pm
Atm im making another tree just wait a bit ;)

Edit:



What you think?
« Last Edit: November 22, 2009, 10:34:57 pm by micintexp »

Offline Gil

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Re: Second Try For Tree

Reply #11 on: November 22, 2009, 11:00:56 pm
I think it's mirrored. :n:

Palette is better though.

Offline Tourist

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Re: Second Try For Tree

Reply #12 on: November 23, 2009, 12:19:59 am
I took your first tree and did an edit.  I liked the basic placement you started with, but it needed a lot of work.  I'm not that good at pixel art yet, but I think I can help.

Problem 1: Consistent lighting.

I added a sun to keep track of where the light is coming from.

Problem 2: Black outlines.

I replaced the black outlines around the leaves with the darkest green (as a placeholder).  Then I started to work on the trunk, using the lightest brown where the sun hits (up and left), and the darkest brown where the shadow is (down and right).

Problem 3: Flat branches

The trunk and branches all have the same flatness to them.  On a real tree some branches would come towards the viewer and some away from the viewer.  Branches that come towards the viewer would show a lot of the underside of the branch, so there should be a large shadow underneath.  Branches going away would show a lot of the top of the branch, so more of the light brown color.

Problem 4: Not enough branches.

What you have looks ok for Charlie Brown's Xmas tree, but most trees would have additional branches. I added a few smaller branches and tried to add depth too.  Some should come towards the viewer, some away.  It's harder to do with smaller branches because there are fewer pixels, and some of these may get covered up by the leaves, but it's worth doign well.

Problem 5:  Trunk and branch roots too thin

Most trees are like long cones.  Wide at the bottom and narrower at the top.  The branches work the same way.  There are exceptions (palm trees), but this looked like a normal tree.  This was an easy fix, just widen the bases of the trunk and branches.

Result:



Step 2, the leaves.

Problem 1:  Not enough leaves

Too many gaps in the foliage, and the new smaller branches needed some green too.  I connected the clumps you had.

Problem 2: Inconsistent shading

With the light from above and a little to the left, the different clumps needed better shading.  The leaves also come forward towards the viewer like a dome shape (sorta), so the brighter colors needed to match the dome curve.

Result:


This is ok so far, but there's room to improve.


Step 3: Good enough version

Problem:  Shading incomplete

Shaded the rest.   This was just a lot of filling in, trying to keep the 3d-ness in my head.

Problem:  The dark green outline doesn't look so good.

I tried lightening the outline, and then just removed most of it.

Result:



Step 4: Final version

Mostly more tweaking of the green leaves on the right hand side.  I'm not sure how much of an improvement it is.  There's more work that can be done, like adding some leaves in front of the branches, but I called it good enough for an edit.  Looks a bit puffball-ish, I suppose.

I stepped away for a bit and thought about explaining what I did, and realized the simplest explanation was the two small circles you see in the last pic (brown and green, just under the sun).  Zoom in on those.

Imagine each of these is a sphere rather than a circle.  I took the colors in the pic and put them on the sphere where they would show up given the lighting.  When you look at a pixel on the tree, you can figure out the direction that surface would be facing and use a pixel of the right color.  With only 3-4 colors, the sphere can be small.  More colors would probably need a larger sphere, and the ones I drew don't take into account cast shadows.  Since the parts of the tree are larger than the sphere (like the trunk), where you choose to fill in the different colors defines the shape of the resulting object.



Things not done:
On this piece the shades were all the same hue.  I didn't adjust the colors, but shifting the hues would be a good improvement too.

Hope this helps,
Tourist

Offline micintexp

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Re: Second Try For Tree

Reply #13 on: November 23, 2009, 12:42:32 am
But oh well I wasn't realy going to continue edit it.

Im not realy a persoon that makes a tree then continue editing it.

I just keep trying to build a new one untill I figure out the trick thats how I do it.

For me myself I have improve pretty fast for 5-6 days on pixel art.

Even so drawing the tree is not that much of the problem,the problem is the shading and adding leaves and all.

Wich is exactly what im trying to practice on and always reach to another failure.

But practices makes your improve yourself wich is what I have been doing and starting to improve alot more :).

And you didn't notice but,in my last tree I don't have the black outlines .

-About the shading adding light and so.

Your example were okay,but Im already watching inside a thread daily on how to make a thread wich is Schrib wich is this thread http://www.wayofthepixel.net/pixelation/index.php?topic=8291.0.

For now I also started to watch the in-game 2D graphics game on NDS games to study there trees and others.

Tomorow I might start to build another new tree but a better look.


Edit:


Will continue with it tomorow,might aswell change the side.


« Last Edit: November 23, 2009, 02:25:35 am by micintexp »

Offline Gnarf

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Re: Second Try For Tree

Reply #14 on: November 23, 2009, 08:09:47 am
sometimes it's tough to go back to a piece you aren't happy with.  but it could really help to go over your mistakes and correct them rather than scrapping it.  i think it would help if you tried to get a working silhouette of the tree first.  i googled "tree" and used one as a reference, not necessarily copying it, just as a reference.  with your silhouette, you can define the object without any details.  if it reads as a tree that's great.  secondly, you can find a balance in your piece using the same method.

i went into mspaint and blocked out a tree with a square brush and then moved on to sculpting the silhouette which is the bottom piece.  you can always add more to a piece, but i'd call that done and move on to details.  that's where you can further clean up the silhouette as you move along.



hope this helps.

Offline micintexp

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Re: Second Try For Tree

Reply #15 on: November 23, 2009, 07:07:31 pm
Gnarf,for some odd reason I can't see your image.

You mind readding that image again.

I will take your advice and study it,maybe your right sometimes.

Because If I watch clearly Schrib did do some edits on the same trees in order to get a better look.

Thanks.

Offline Gnarf

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Re: Second Try For Tree

Reply #16 on: November 24, 2009, 02:11:48 am
it shows up fine for me, i think imageshack was down for a while is all.

Offline micintexp

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Re: Second Try For Tree

Reply #17 on: November 24, 2009, 02:28:42 am
So far the trunk is done.

I have been working on the trunk for few hours.

But Its stil not right in some way.

Im gonna reshade it again.



Edit:





Will continue shading it tomorow.

Might aswell reshade it again because its not going the way I wanted it.

The outline will be removed after im fully done with the shading on the tree and trunk and so.

For now lets call it a day.

« Last Edit: November 24, 2009, 03:08:26 am by micintexp »

Offline Gnarf

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Re: Second Try For Tree

Reply #18 on: November 24, 2009, 06:14:58 am
it doesn't seem like you're really following anyone's critique.  there are no real shortcuts to this, and any that you try to take only look so apparent.  it's not going to just hit you like an epiphany or something.  really take the time to read over the critiques.

as for your current piece, you're rushing into details at an extremely early stage.  there are no rules to going about this, but when things aren't looking right, there are processes you can use.  we've given you some meaty critique, and there are tons more pertaining to trees all over this forum.

it still seems as though you're mirroring, the lines on the trunk stand out to me.  it's nice that you established a lightsource, but save the actual shading until later.  lay down the base colors of the whole tree first.  then move on to toning.  do this in chunks and with as few colors as possible: generally meaning midtones, highlights, and shadows.  start with three colors for those.

i would move into detailing afterwards.  believe me, with a guide and a clean start you won't be scrapping every tree you work on.  when you have a clear cut idea of where you want to go with the piece, you'lll really enjoy it.

Offline micintexp

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Re: Second Try For Tree

Reply #19 on: November 24, 2009, 10:10:56 am
Thanks Gnarf,I will do that when I get back from school :).

But I did say I will reshade it again because its not realy going that well.

I must still study certain trees again,well schrib trees are some good trees that I could study .