AuthorTopic: [WIP] asjidsfjksdfkjsf i hate trees (Read 20718 times)

fortunato · **on:** August 15, 2009, 05:55:55 am

FINISHED!!!:

EIGHTH:

SEVENTH:

SIXTH:

FIFTH:

FOURTH:

THIRD:

SECOND:

FIRST:

sooo... i figured i should work on my trees.
i read somewhere that making a tree is like a bunch of circles, so i drew my circles, drew a trunk and was pretty happy with the lineart. so i figured id go for a circular kind of odd look for the tree... and shit its terrible... for some reason i cant come up with a good tree palette... the trunk is ok to me but it could use some work too IMO... but i just dont know what to do with it at ALL.. could someone PLEASE help me out with this thing, its really bothering me
c+c please... be freaking brutal

heyy13 · **Reply #1 on:** August 15, 2009, 10:03:01 am

I feel awful so i'm not going to bother typing out an explanation let the edit speak for itself.

Was good practice for me (trees are not a strong point of mine, i hope you manage to get some other's with good advice in here). I hope it helps. :]

I also reccomend searching "tree" in the search bar, it has some excelent results that would really help you.

EDIT: *reuploads* Sorry, my bad. I was just about comatose tired last night when i posted.

Crow · **Reply #2 on:** August 15, 2009, 12:04:25 pm

Quote from: heyy13 on August 15, 2009, 10:03:01 am

I feel awful so i'm not going to bother typing out an explanation let the edit speak for itself.

Was good practice for me (trees are not a strong point of mine, i hope you manage to get some other's with good advice in here). I hope it helps. :]

I also reccomend searching "tree" in the search bar, it has some excelent results that would really help you.

It's a JPG!

Jad · **Reply #3 on:** August 15, 2009, 01:44:25 pm

It's a JPG but it sure gets its point across nicely.

The old tsugumo tutorial with the ball tree always confused me cause .. a bunch of balls really doesn't convey a tree that well - but heyy13's edit shows how you can use it to create some nice looking leaves.

Dr D · **Reply #4 on:** August 15, 2009, 01:55:01 pm

Did you ever read this topic by Scriblette? It's a great read, all of it. It might give you some insight about how to better go about structuring trees and such.

What you have her so far isn't too bad, I'd go in a direction similar to how heyy13 does it. Are you using these graphics for a game, by any chance? Or just practice?

There are a lot of different ways to construct and render the tree, so you might benefit from trying different styles. If you're not using it for a game that is, if you are, you'd want to stay consistent.

Also, if you try something new, making it slightly larger might not be a bad idea, but it's up to you.

I really don't enjoy the spheres approach, either. But if in the end-result it is well concealed then good. I just encourage you, to, once again, try different methods.

Bissle · **Reply #5 on:** August 15, 2009, 01:59:39 pm

I think that round bubbly foliage would be cute (something in between the original and heyy's first edit) in a quirky way, but then it wouldn't work with the realistically rendered trunk. If realistic is the way you wanna go, heyy's edit is a good example of pixeling a tree using the tsugumo model (what i got out of it was to draw a bush and c+p all over the trunk, which... yeah xD)

EDIT: @Dr D : that thread is a godsend!

Gil · **Reply #6 on:** August 15, 2009, 05:22:48 pm

From Enterbrain:

heyy13 · **Reply #7 on:** August 15, 2009, 11:02:50 pm

In my experiance the ball method only works at a relativly small resolution. Since it doesn't lend itself too realistic construction of trees at larger sizes. But it's so fast and easy to work with at small sizes, and if your unsure of how to shade something can really solidify depth in your mind. Even for large trees if your unsure of how you should be placing the highlights you can take 5mins to make a ball outline, tweak it and then use that as a referance.

I don't think i like the enterbrain tree, it is alot more realistic in construction but just doesn't look nice too me.

Scriblette's topic is increadibly useful and a good read.

In anycase i can't wait to see the OP's progression of his tree. Might him him to try out afew differant styles and methods of work.

fortunato · **Reply #8 on:** August 16, 2009, 04:15:24 am

update..
figured i should get better at actually drawing trees before i do any weird ones... used graphicsgale default colors haha, but they look 10x better imo. this is obviously really rough, but i wanted to get everyones opinion so far, like what you guys think i should improve on..
btw heres the reference so you can compare:

fortunato · **Reply #9 on:** August 16, 2009, 06:36:57 pm

small update

fixed up the shape of it and tried to make it less flat looking.. i think its coming out pretty good so far, what do you guys think? im still painting but i wanted to make sure it looks right before i do any REAL detail.

Gil · **Reply #10 on:** August 16, 2009, 07:05:56 pm

It looks wonderful. The branches and trunk are a bit noodly though, try making them a bit sharper and branch-like

Bissle · **Reply #11 on:** August 16, 2009, 09:00:05 pm

Wow, that tree is... awesome! Tremendous improvement! I agree that the trunk and branches should be built up a little more.

fortunato · **Reply #12 on:** August 16, 2009, 10:45:29 pm

thanks guys!

im not home now but ill post an update later on the branches...

fortunato · **Reply #13 on:** August 17, 2009, 02:39:25 am

now that im home..

i think its looking a lot better... trimmed the shape of the tree and added more detail to the branches.. also added two more colors for the trunk, and lowered the amount of blueness. what do you guys think?

Scribblette · **Reply #14 on:** August 17, 2009, 04:15:20 am

Your concept of uh, if I have the right word, volumes, there, looks lovely. It looks like the beginnings of a great tree - or the endings of one for a appropriate style. Taking it to the next step - defining leaves more or whatnot, if you do - was for me the hardest part. Best of luck with this - I'm really looking forward to how it turns out. Colours look great.

I'm hoping to do a lot of practice on trees and update my original thread these next couple of weeks - up in the country, lots of sketching study to do. Just have to recover from the driving test today and keep the birds happy.

fortunato · **Reply #15 on:** August 17, 2009, 07:10:35 pm

thanks scribblette! means a lot

heres an update:

i was feeling really good about this, but theres something thats like making me not feel good, if that makes sense haha... im starting to define the individual 'bushes' if you will and the overall shape and i like it... but i dunno... anyone got any ideas?

Elk · **Reply #16 on:** August 17, 2009, 07:17:19 pm

1 question, what is this for?
if its for frontal usage, then it looks neat as it is, if not then I could show you with a model how to shade it

fortunato · **Reply #17 on:** August 17, 2009, 07:50:26 pm

Quote from: Elk on August 17, 2009, 07:17:19 pm

1 question, what is this for?
if its for frontal usage, then it looks neat as it is, if not then I could show you with a model how to shade it

im trying to get better at drawing and understanding trees realistically in order to take them on with my own style.
basically i am trying to pixel this: http://www.istockphoto.com/file_thumbview_approve/6054090/2/istockphoto_6054090-camphor-tree.jpg
but please show me what you mean too! i am interested!

Scribblette · **Reply #18 on:** August 18, 2009, 12:19:12 am

Uh, maybe we could convince Elk it's not for frontal usage, just so he could bless us with a model of how to shade it and we could pass it around for generations to come whenever anyone cries over foliage.

fortunato · **Reply #19 on:** August 18, 2009, 07:18:20 am

haha well in that case, elk no it is not for frontal usage... (hehe)
in all seriousness, i am really interested in this shading model.. please show us!

fortunato · **Reply #20 on:** August 20, 2009, 06:03:15 am

hi again! two things... tried to lower the saturation on the colors and got this...

then i bumped up the saturation a TAD so its more in between the old one and the one up above. this one also has some more defining work.

what do you guys think? to be honest im getting concerned that im overdoing it... or maybe im just going in the wrong direction? help please!!

Jad · **Reply #21 on:** August 20, 2009, 12:39:55 pm

You're noising it up with all the dithering is what's going on, there's actually nothing wrong GENERALLY with the rendering and dithering, but the dithering creates one pixel noise

One pixel noise turns the leaf bunches into meta-clusters instead of having small pixel clusters that represent leaves

The one-pixel noise thing turns makes the eye believe that the tree is fuzzy or that the leaves are so small they all turn into a fuzzy mess, thus making the tree a bit broccoli-like

So I'd say put some more emphasis on leaf-like big clusters and try to avoid single pixels when not in a dither cluster - if you know what I mean!

I think the progress in this thread is completely tremendous and this is one of the nicest trees we've had here in a while! Fantastic!

Gil · **Reply #22 on:** August 20, 2009, 05:17:38 pm

I'd say it's not really noisy, but rather not the correct texture. It depends though, I don't think it's a bad texture, just that it's maybe not the best one you could achieve.

That made no sense, did it?

fortunato · **Reply #23 on:** August 21, 2009, 12:03:23 am

Quote from: Gil on August 20, 2009, 05:17:38 pm

I'd say it's not really noisy, but rather not the correct texture. It depends though, I don't think it's a bad texture, just that it's maybe not the best one you could achieve.

That made no sense, did it?

no no, youre totally right... it could be better. but its just like i dont want to go too solid cause im afraid its gonna lose volume or whatever and obviously too dithered comes out as noisy.. im just concerned about how i would go about changing it i guess.. i think maybe i could expand on the clusters like jad said, maybe?

Bissle · **Reply #24 on:** August 21, 2009, 11:49:48 am

I don't think it's noisy, but any more dithering and it would be; gotta agree that you need to tame it some, because it gives the tree a 'fuzzy' texture. But most of it is perfectly fine, I think you should keep it mostly dithered; smoothing it out would create a plastic tree, and who wants that? XD

Not really a crit here, just a personal thing--I liked the more saturated palette, at least for the brightest shades, too.

Without a doubt, you're a fast learner! My mouth hit the floor when you posted your second version.

fortunato · **Reply #25 on:** August 22, 2009, 04:57:48 am

thanks bissle!!! and i also forgot to thank jad and gil for their comments... means a lot!!!

fixed up the tree shape a bit, tried to clean up the dithering and focus more on a 'leaf cluster' like look haha... also, trunk update!!

im really proud of how the trunk is coming out so far... it looks like it goes in and comes out at certain spots... but guess what, thats only one rectangle bitch!!! haha sorry i just like it a lot... anyway what do you guys think? i could improve on the leaves more without a doubt but i wanted to get you (your?) guys' opinion on the trunk first..

Draco9898 · **Reply #26 on:** August 24, 2009, 01:39:50 am

The colors, shading, volumetrics all look awesome. Also like the shape. Trunk could use some type of highlighting or something, right now it looks rather flat.

politopo · **Reply #27 on:** August 24, 2009, 05:26:50 pm

I think that the only problem with the trunk, is that it is too much straight, try to add some bump, or slant it a little, and it will not look "flat" anymore...
The rest is relly wonderfull, maybe worth of featuring.

Hibernated · **Reply #28 on:** August 24, 2009, 11:53:56 pm

Wow! Teach me!

That really is amazing. I agree with Draco about the trunk though, as proud of it as you are adding a brighter shade would make it look more solid I think. Did you ever use that lightest brown shade?

fortunato · **Reply #29 on:** August 25, 2009, 06:16:01 am

thank you so much everyone! and about that trunk... my goal was to actually give it the illusion through subpixeling that its not just a straight rectangle... as anything else (i.e. adding actual curves and such) was just too extreme for my tastes... and no hibernated i never used that lightest brown shade haha (there are probably a few shades that i never used on there). i reeally have to try and sleep now but i will try to add more.. not rectangly-ness tomorrow. and ill try out that highlight shade, draco! (i actually typed toucan first but corrected myself.. that icon!! haha)
also.. wow politopo thanks so much, featuring.... haha. that would be pretty sick!! maybe it could if i stopped taking breaks haha..

brod · **Reply #30 on:** August 27, 2009, 06:18:39 am

I think the desaturation was a wrong step, the fifth tree's colors are better than the current. Well, I'd say at least up the saturation of the current one by 30~40%. The colors of the trunk could also use some changes, since they're not contrasting very well, specifically the highlight.

fortunato · **Reply #31 on:** September 15, 2009, 09:53:06 pm

oh my god im so damn lazy.. im really sorry to you guys and mostly myself for letting myself put shit off so much... eeeep

heres the newest version when i last worked on it (prob last day of august). damn.. haha i know its not much but its mostly a tiny up in the saturation as suggested by brad (and ill work on that contrast) and mostly just tiny detail work i guess; mostly in the bottom left corner of the leaves there. i promise ill finish this soon!!!!

politopo · **Reply #32 on:** September 16, 2009, 05:15:27 am

maybe I already told you..
but you don't believe me...
So I have to do it...
what about slanting the trunk?

Anyway really Impressing tree.

Jad · **Reply #33 on:** September 16, 2009, 12:32:51 pm

looks cute, but looking at real life trees, they're often way more straight than you'd expect them to be O:

fortunato · **Reply #34 on:** September 19, 2009, 04:39:50 pm

Quote from: politopo on September 16, 2009, 05:15:27 am

maybe I already told you..
but you don't believe me...
So I have to do it...
what about slanting the trunk?

Anyway really Impressing tree.

yes i have sort of played around (like a one or two pixel bend/slant) but like it always comes out too harsh for my liking, so i tried to show some edges and shit through sub-pixeling (or at least what i like to call sub pixeling lol). and also if you look at the reference its very straight, and jad is right. but anyway i will try messing with the trunk a bit tonight/today, as brod suggested i should mess with the trunk too...

fortunato · **Reply #35 on:** September 21, 2009, 03:50:07 am

played with the saturation a bit (i.e. upping it) and messing with the trunk in tiny bouts. not much but still at least its something.

TPoe · **Reply #36 on:** September 22, 2009, 01:53:07 am

There's like one big floating leaf on the left side.

fortunato · **Reply #37 on:** October 13, 2009, 07:36:24 pm

really sorry once again.. ive been running into trouble recently but thats no excuse for not finishing up pixel art!

i tried to make a transparent one (with no grey) but graphics gale didnt let me.. anyway i know it isnt much from last time but i really think its done and that theres no more i could do with it. i tried to make a background but it just didnt come out very good (it was like a blue sky with the tree on a hill..) but unless anyone else has any ideas i guess im done. im more posting this for just completing the threads sake too.. i hate leaving things unfinished (cause i always do

) anyway, thanks a lot EVERYBODY who posted in this thread... made me feel liked haha and help me improve on my shitty ass tree a while of posts back.

brod · **Reply #38 on:** October 13, 2009, 07:39:33 pm

You need to cut down the color count there, there are tons of unnecessary ones.

Gil · **Reply #39 on:** October 13, 2009, 09:35:34 pm

Quote from: brod on October 13, 2009, 07:39:33 pm

You need to cut down the color count there, there are tons of unnecessary ones.

Erm, which ones? I don't think he can cut colors any more than he did brod. Besides, he didn't mention color count needs to be low for this project. I count 8 colors for the whole tree, that's pretty damn low already actually.

Dusty · **Reply #40 on:** October 13, 2009, 11:01:28 pm

Seems like a few of the colors on the palette to the left aren't even being used, so that's not an accurate color-count.

brod · **Reply #41 on:** October 13, 2009, 11:24:53 pm

Quote from: Dusty on October 13, 2009, 11:01:28 pm

Seems like a few of the colors on the palette to the left aren't even being used, so that's not an accurate color-count.

My mistake then.

fortunato · **Reply #42 on:** October 15, 2009, 01:29:58 am

oh yeah, some of the browns are probably unused, like the lighter ones... and i dont even know if those are the same colors actually lol but im pretty sure that all the greens/blues have been used. and also thanks a lot gil; i pride myself on that. :3

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AuthorTopic: [WIP] asjidsfjksdfkjsf i hate trees (Read 20718 times)