AuthorTopic: Arabian Knight  (Read 22052 times)

Offline hsn2555

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Arabian Knight

on: March 30, 2009, 01:29:47 pm
an arabian knight ..





update:









« Last Edit: June 10, 2009, 07:44:02 pm by hsn2555 »
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Offline Pizza Tom

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Re: WIP running knight

Reply #1 on: March 30, 2009, 06:44:40 pm
Reads more as a brisk walk to me. The arms are a little too static, as well. I can see you have a little motion in them, but a little more swing might help. Also, why does the cape kick up and down like that? If he's constantly going forward it should stay flowing.
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Offline Chris2balls

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Re: WIP running knight

Reply #2 on: March 31, 2009, 05:31:34 pm
Reminds me of a Metal Slug enemy (can't remember which MS in particular). His torso and arms don't move enough. And I agree with what Regulus Awesome said.
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Offline Zuonius

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Re: WIP running knight

Reply #3 on: April 01, 2009, 01:54:06 am
Bring his knees up a bit more in each step, and have him come off the ground a little bit. That might help it look more like he's running.

Other than that I really like this sprite, especially his sword. Is he wearing a hood or is that supposed to be a helmet?

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Re: WIP running knight

Reply #4 on: April 01, 2009, 03:23:40 am
Reads more as a brisk walk to me. The arms are a little too static, as well. I can see you have a little motion in them, but a little more swing might help. Also, why does the cape kick up and down like that? If he's constantly going forward it should stay flowing.

i was intending to edit the cape, also i've added some swing to the arms :-


Reminds me of a Metal Slug enemy (can't remember which MS in particular). His torso and arms don't move enough. And I agree with what Regulus Awesome said.
umm .. check this out



Bring his knees up a bit more in each step, and have him come off the ground a little bit. That might help it look more like he's running.

Other than that I really like this sprite, especially his sword. Is he wearing a hood or is that supposed to be a helmet?

yup, he's wearing a hood
i've done some improvements :
« Last Edit: April 01, 2009, 03:27:11 am by hsn2555 »
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Offline Mathias

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Re: WIP running knight

Reply #5 on: April 01, 2009, 03:35:43 am
Cool sprite. He's still power-walking. The highlight on his knee reads as a scuffmark on his drawers, not light. (assuming you're attempting a lighting effect)

Offline hsn2555

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Re: WIP running knight

Reply #6 on: April 01, 2009, 10:27:02 am
i think i got you,


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Offline Jad

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Re: WIP running knight

Reply #7 on: April 01, 2009, 11:10:10 am
The distinction between a walk and a run is actually that in a walk both of the feet never leave the ground at the same time, whereas in a run they do.

So if he never leaps up in the air it'll never be a run, really O:
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Offline NaCl

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Re: WIP running knight

Reply #8 on: April 01, 2009, 11:20:48 am
Yes, for a run he must push off the ground with his back leg, then extend his other leg in front of him to catch himself. His torso is moving forward at a constant velocity, so when it hits the ground then the bodies weight rests on it forcing it to bend at the knee, then the body passes over that leg, and the person uses the bend in the knee and the ankle to push off the ground once again. The difference between a run and a walk is that in a walk, you are simply leaning forward, and constantly catching yourself with alternating legs. In a run, you are jumping forward and catching yourself with alternating legs.

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Re: WIP running knight

Reply #9 on: April 01, 2009, 11:43:57 am
so what i've done is jogging ,right ?
so in order 2 make him running i have to redraw the whole steps  :blind:
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Offline Mathias

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Re: WIP running knight

Reply #10 on: April 01, 2009, 01:11:27 pm
Hmmm yeah probably, at least his bottom half anyway. Though, you could've avoided this by doing a quick basic skeleton/keyframe animation first to get the movement right. You know what I'm talking about don't you?

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Re: WIP running knight

Reply #11 on: April 01, 2009, 03:00:07 pm
yea, i do .
anyway, -.- i've edited some frames and added new ones ..
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Offline hsn2555

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Re: Arabian Knight

Reply #12 on: May 27, 2009, 12:22:59 pm
another update xD ..
i'll do the shading later ..
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Offline hsn2555

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Re: Arabian Knight

Reply #13 on: May 27, 2009, 10:30:59 pm
i felt like drawin the attackin pose

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Offline Sokota

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Re: Arabian Knight

Reply #14 on: May 27, 2009, 10:34:58 pm
Just a note, his cape is much longer in the attack than it is in the run. Do you realize this, or was that intentional? I think you could exaggerate the sword swinging more; the top of the sword should go in more arc than at the bottom.

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Offline hsn2555

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Re: Arabian Knight

Reply #15 on: May 27, 2009, 10:43:23 pm
yea, that was intentional ,it was like a sketch, cuz as it's seen it's not organized. i'll try editing the swinging, but after a while of sleep.
here's the idle


« Last Edit: May 27, 2009, 10:46:02 pm by hsn2555 »
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Offline Dr D

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Re: Arabian Knight

Reply #16 on: May 27, 2009, 10:58:52 pm
For the attack, I think the main problem is that he's attacking without any kind of buildup. It takes a little bit of power to swing the sword, let alone make a hit that has some kind of viable impact. His body movements should follow through with the attack, it should take the whole body, including leg and head movements, he seems rather static.

Others can explain much better than I.

For a positive note, I like the motion trails, just clean them up a bit.

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Re: Arabian Knight

Reply #17 on: June 05, 2009, 12:35:54 pm
here's the idle

Interesting idea to keep the highlight of the sword in place (indeed, it has no reason to move together with a sword like some painting). Yet, i'd try to give it some sub-pixel animation, drifting its hue or something like that to avoid it looking like "something overlaid" on your animation.

Offline hsn2555

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Re: Arabian Knight

Reply #18 on: June 05, 2009, 09:02:05 pm
For the attack, I think the main problem is that he's attacking without any kind of buildup. It takes a little bit of power to swing the sword, let alone make a hit that has some kind of viable impact. His body movements should follow through with the attack, it should take the whole body, including leg and head movements, he seems rather static.

Others can explain much better than I.

For a positive note, I like the motion trails, just clean them up a bit.

that's exactly what i need to edit, and i currently am trying to probe that.
thanks dr ,i really appreciate it ^.^
here is a very sketchy edit ..


Quote
Interesting idea to keep the highlight of the sword in place (indeed, it has no reason to move together with a sword like some painting). Yet, i'd try to give it some sub-pixel animation, drifting its hue or something like that to avoid it looking like "something overlaid" on your animation.

yea that's it ! and i am exciting to see what you're going to come up with ..


here is a little drawing for a portrait of the knight ..
« Last Edit: June 05, 2009, 09:06:04 pm by hsn2555 »
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Offline hsn2555

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Re: Arabian Knight

Reply #19 on: June 08, 2009, 11:55:03 am
Due to my finals.i'll stop working on the sprites, i'll put more effort on one piece,
this is my first piece with the pen tablet i bought ,and i can tell you. it's kicking ass  :y:
here's the sketch ..

here's what i've come up with so far ..

i'm actually done with the sky, it really tired me. Peach's dithering was my inspiration http://www.pixeljoint.com/pixelart/43562.htm?sec=showcase# O.O he dithered it so amazingly,so i tried it with the sky, i hope it works with the knight as well.
and i know it's messy, >.> that's what the tablet does !
Now it's time to dither the knight !
Any suggestions ,guys ?
colors count 16.Did you notice how sucky the shield and the sword are ?, therefore i might add more colors.
« Last Edit: June 08, 2009, 12:13:22 pm by hsn2555 »
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Offline Mathias

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Re: Arabian Knight

Reply #20 on: June 08, 2009, 12:54:52 pm
Haha, you're blaming the messiness on your tablet? Does it have some built in wobble/jitter feature or something? All I use is a tablet these days. You just have to get better with it. The messiness is more a result of not having polished it enough - the random texturing, the sketch's black lines still surviving the coloring phase, the light and dark pixels juxtaposed against eachother all over the place.

Overall it looks good, though. And the grittiness isn't horrible, it's a dirty sandy desert scene, so it actually lends a lttle bit to it.

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Re: Arabian Knight

Reply #21 on: June 09, 2009, 04:45:53 pm
Haha, you're blaming the messiness on your tablet? Does it have some built in wobble/jitter feature or something? All I use is a tablet these days. You just have to get better with it. The messiness is more a result of not having polished it enough - the random texturing, the sketch's black lines still surviving the coloring phase, the light and dark pixels juxtaposed against eachother all over the place.

Overall it looks good, though. And the grittiness isn't horrible, it's a dirty sandy desert scene, so it actually lends a lttle bit to it.

Man! i got tired and bored ! i'll be working on it some time later .. -.-

well,i made something ..
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Offline ndchristie

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Re: Arabian Knight

Reply #22 on: June 09, 2009, 11:56:20 pm
For the character, who exactly is he supposed to be?  Your enemy by his face and costume seems like, if anything, a Turk, that more or less works out.  He's pale-skinned, wearing a turban, and his outfit would have been against medieval Islamic doctrine, so we can assume he is not Arabian by ethnicity. 

The main character you're calling a knight, but he carries a Persian shield an a vaguely eastern sword (although they could be found in any part of the Mediterranean by the fall of the Sassanid Dynasty).  Arabia has never had knights in the western sense of a direct feudal system (largely due to religious issues), and since he's dismounted we can assume he's not being called one because he's a horseman.  He wears a black cape, generally a garment worn by high-ranking Christians of the crusader states (mostly just Hospitallers and other orders founded in Jerusalem), but he doesn't carry any Christian emblem or equipment beyond that.

The reason I'm asking is because atm the headscarf is nonfunctional and killing the portrait.  I would suggest historical ways of wrapping the face, but his ethnicity and religion make a big difference in terms of what he can wear.  For instance, a westerner wouldn't wear the keffiyeh, but a Christian Arab still would.  it's about making a believable character.
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Re: Arabian Knight

Reply #23 on: June 10, 2009, 11:08:15 am
I like how good and profound at historical knowledge you are.

well, maybe I'd better mention some points before even posting the actual work.

once upon a time there was an arabian muslim young guy named Ali, he and his family were living in an arabian happy town peacefuly,until some foreigner army/group came aiming to occupy the town.
So, Ali aimed to kick them out of the town and bring the peace back,so he just grabbed his father's sword and asked his mom to sew him a clothes .. since then the adventure's began ..
( i know he seems to be like a bandit more than a knight xD but i really liked it )

and about the shield and the pestilent dagger,a persian seller gifts Ali them .
grr .. i'm not getting into the story's details ..i'll keep them until i'm done with the art's part :)

Calling him a knight'd rather to be adjectively since his nobleness and bravery .
from Arabic (فَارِس - Faris) which means (horseman), (cavalier), and maybe (knight) <- since you told me, idk if it really means that proprely .
so i might be mistaken. i'll just keep an eye on "Faris" :D





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Offline ndchristie

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Re: Arabian Knight

Reply #24 on: June 10, 2009, 04:30:44 pm
Faris can seem close to Knight though the French Cavalier and German Ritter, which both demand feudal rank and vassalage, but my readings have generally used it more in the sense of juts horsemen (all cavalry), and when it is specific, it tends to refer mostly to turkoman (unrecognized or disenfranchised asiatic families) cavalry whose level was on that of slaves (about the same as an Egyptian).  The Mamaaleek that emerge, some from this class (the difference being that a mameluk must convert to Islam) have been compared to knights, but this is a desperate comparison: the loyalty of a mameluk is not pledged but purchased (the name is slave, from the Semitic root of possession), they hold no title by their status (nor though are they barred from title, as a western commoner would be).  They have no code of chivalry.

I like your description though :).  Sounds fun.  The goblin there sets things a little farther from reality ^^.  In a few cases you reach the black on your palette too quickly, while other place (shield bottom, goblin's back and under-ear) would benefit from stronger shadowing/lining.
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Re: Arabian Knight

Reply #25 on: June 10, 2009, 05:55:32 pm
The mamaaleek ,Ass'er Almamaleek (Slaves' age).I actually studied everything about them at school,including their lifestyle, independence, how they settled,how they were being forced and everything .besides the Ottomans,Mongols (Genghis Khan -jankees khan) and all those fellow ages .
It might be a similar story.but i'm not taking "knight" as a rank, nor as a social level. it's just like (the Desert's knight - faris As'sahraa' )

and about the goblin, i'm not sure about having it into the whole project; i actually drew it (like randomly) in order to get some ideas out of it.

Nice to see people with that wide knowledge ,it really is a rare treasure,
thanks man. ^^
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Offline hsn2555

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Re: Arabian Knight

Reply #26 on: June 10, 2009, 07:38:20 pm
here's an edit on the attack
« Last Edit: June 10, 2009, 07:44:49 pm by hsn2555 »
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Offline ndchristie

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Re: Arabian Knight

Reply #27 on: June 10, 2009, 08:08:09 pm
If you plan to use the phrase, ask a native speaker the best way to translate The Desert's Knight.  I stick by the idea that Faris has always meant cavalryman where I've read it.  I think Faris would also need an Al- because it is the true subject.  I suggest something simpler like the desert rider (al faris sahra'i), the rider in the desert (al faris fissahra') or the rider from the desert (al faris manissahra').  Pronunciation note : As'sahraa' is misleading, i suggest Assahra', because saad is smooth and the hamza makes the aleph short.  Perhaps even Assohra', because saad is deep, although that might confuse the fatha with a damma or even a waw.

Right now he looks like hes wearing some sort of nondescript headscarf similar to traditional berber wraps.  the closest thing I suggest is looking at modern Tuareg headscarves.  The arab/muslim equivalent, the keffiyeh, is much looser, and much more hat than mask.  In fact, with the holy Qur'an forbidding you to hide you identity, most men muslim would not have been covering their face.  Women are different with the concept of modesty sometimes overruling certain ideas of rights and identity...the fact of course being that at the time, women were expected to be covered in a similar fashion in many non-muslim areas including greece, byzantium, and the pre-islamic east and africa.  Luckily, you have no women yet.  

Anyway, I suggest making him a Berber and keeping the veiled pseudo-turban because it excuses him living in isolation when of the population was urbanizing and a medieval Muslim headscarf looks nothing like what your sprite already has on (your other 3 options include a turban which on no occasion would have had a veil (unless a separate veil was worn under it), a cloth wound up not unlike a sail and wrapped around a scarf that resembled a wimple, or the keffiyeh, a much shorter wrap/scarf.)  Try making the structure more hatlike rather than return of the mummy and do look up berber and tuareg scarves as I think that's close to what you are looking for.
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Offline Mathias

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Re: Arabian Knight

Reply #28 on: June 10, 2009, 09:08:19 pm
I'd just like to say that this whole thread just got a whole lot more interesting after that history lesson, guys. By that I mean this game concept seems enriched and more interesting now. I think it's the immersion factor in play. I feel more informed, better connected to the world this game portrays. I feel like exploring it further.

Something on the current attack anim - if it's meant as a two stroke combo, move it could flow better. Not sure about that little two-step he does/foot movement altogether, it's not very enthusiastic. Cape is cool. How about some head movement? -  just something to reduce the staticness.

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Re: Arabian Knight

Reply #29 on: June 11, 2009, 04:02:24 am
I suggest something simpler like the desert rider (al faris sahra'i), the rider in the desert (al faris fissahra') or the rider from the desert (al faris manissahra').
But then you'd lose the Arabian Nights pun.
thanks Dogmeat!

Offline ndchristie

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Re: Arabian Knight

Reply #30 on: June 11, 2009, 05:12:51 am
But i don't think that faris As'sahraa' is right.  It would translate as "knight (indefinite), the desert," or worse "knight (indefinite) is the desert."  I could be wrong about this but I'm pretty sure that's not the way to say The Desert's Knight.  If he's bent on using an Arabic phrase, the grammar should be proper.  I say ask a native speaker just I can't tell you how to translate such a complex possessive like "the Desert's Knight."  I don't see how that ruins any puns (there's only one character Faris in the entire arabian nights, an egyptian, and he is only featured for a little while?).
« Last Edit: June 11, 2009, 05:21:23 am by ndchristie »
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Re: Arabian Knight

Reply #31 on: June 11, 2009, 08:42:26 am
ndchristie

awesome, i see you know how to speak arabic and how its words are pronunced, really interesting.  :y:
but in case you don't know,I'm an arabian muslim guy, and the arabic is my native language. so don't worry about the translation's part.
Faris Assahraa' ,means (the desert's knight) as (The desert's rider) .which the knight is definite

Quote
I suggest something simpler like the desert rider (al faris sahra'i), the rider in the desert (al faris fissahra') or the rider from the desert (al faris manissahra').
*The desert rider : Faris assahra' فارس الصحراء
*The rider in the desert : Al-Faris fe assahra' ,which could be (Faris(ُ ) fessahraa') فارسٌ في الصحراء
*The rider from the desert : Alfaris min assahra', <-- it's not suitable.( Fairs(ٌ ) min assahraa' ) is more suitable فارسُ من الصحراء
it can't be Al-Faris Assahrawi because assahrawi leads us that he completely lives in a desert,or like a desert race car.
and if i'd go with (Al)-Faris, it'd be written alone ( Al-Faris - The Knight) which ease the desert idea.




here you can see how the arabian soldiers functionally look. but mine isn't a soldier, he's doing the play and everything hiddenly in order to get to the responsible man for all what's happening.


i might take a bit of this one, you see how sharp it is ?

Arabian Nights puns, also known as one thousand and one nights, it's inspiring .

==
Mathias

i'm definitely gonna change his head, which is gonna take a bit of time, i'm also going to change his legs,foots positions.
« Last Edit: June 11, 2009, 08:54:15 am by hsn2555 »
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Offline ndchristie

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Re: Arabian Knight

Reply #32 on: June 11, 2009, 05:01:54 pm
Heh, I got shut down!  Right down to a picture of 5 men and no horses and a big sign above their head saying (فريس) :yell:  That's a really great lesson though.  I've actually saved all this for the examples.
Do you mind if I ask a few questions for my own reasons?
How does the knight become definite without al- or written diacritics like you have in the last few examples?  Is it purely by it's relationship to assahra'?
I always wondered how to continue out of a word ending with a hamza as in Assahrawi.  I know you aren't using it, but could you write it out? (i'm not sure exactly what letter combos a-w-i means).  Is it generally "w" or is it like those other hamzas, which can change sound with the letters around them?  What I wouldn't give to go somewhere where these things were just lived and spoken naturally rather than studied as rules and systems...
It's great that you have a relationship to Arabia far beyond what my university has been able to offer.  I'm envious.  And I'll stop reading to you out of books what you can look around to see :).

Good to see you've got a northern (syrian? perhaps even persian?) reference to balance out my berbers.
If you're looking to round out the references, i suggesting looking for the elite guard as well, which were called (unfortunately, because it makes them impossible to find) "غلام" warriors.  Maybe they were sons of noblemen?  Or perhaps there is another meaning aside from "boy" that I don't know.  I don't know how late you want, but janissaries will come to prominence in turkish lands about the 1430's.
It might pay to keep in mind also that even in Saladin's time, when arbia had well-established wealth and military presence, the "Ghazi" made up the bulk of the army and this term generally referred to dirt-poor brigands with limited military training and more often than not no home to go back to.  The usual depiction (in italian and byzantine illustrations) is a fighter with an unbelted tunic, simple round shield (of the buckler type, not the large perisan sort) and a spear or a short, gently curving sword.  Short bows were also prevalent.  Other depictions have a heavy, cloth-belted garment over the tunic, kinda like a western surcoat with short sleeves or a highly padded bathrobe.  Armor was rare, and produced largely in urban areas and ancient centers of industry (damascus, antioch, tyre, fars, sidon).  The favored weapon of arabian elite as always been the crescent-shaped axe designed specifically for breaking well-armored opponents but which could also take your hero's head without concern :P.


Edit! - I found some scans of one of my good books on my harddrive.  I wish i could bing the est up but my scanner is broken so these old ones will have to do:



These are centuries apart on the one hand, but on the other hand what they say as arabian armies 600-800 will continue to be true into the 15th century for rural forces.  The "Islam" page shows those jackets which are the bathrobes I described, accomplished or professional soldiers (i mean, half of them are wearing chain underneath) - they have no militia or peasant levies here.  Even though the art seems a little childish, they're drawn by one of the leading military researchers of our grandparent's generation (back before it was "cool" to hate muslims).
« Last Edit: June 11, 2009, 05:37:47 pm by ndchristie »
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Offline hsn2555

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Re: Arabian Knight

Reply #33 on: June 11, 2009, 11:25:22 pm
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Heh, I got shut down!  Right down to a picture of 5 men and no horses and a big sign above their head saying (فريس) yell  That's a really great lesson though.  I've actually saved all this for the examples.
it's not فريس fiyrs.. it's قريش - Quraish ..

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How does the knight become definite without al- or written diacritics like you have in the last few examples?  Is it purely by it's relationship to assahra'?
we call it (Edhafa - additament) which is a grammatical rule.Faris As-sahraa' it's an additament ,Faris is the additive word ,As-sahra' is additive to word. means "yea, that guy is the desert's knight ;the knight of the desert." we don't add (Al) to the first word because we know him/it, we add (AL) to the second word.
another example : The Pixelation's prince --> Ameer Al-Pixelation أمير البكسليشن

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I always wondered how to continue out of a word ending with a hamza as in Assahrawi.  I know you aren't using it, but could you write it out? (i'm not sure exactly what letter combos a-w-i means).  Is it generally "w" or is it like those other hamzas, which can change sound with the letters around them?  What I wouldn't give to go somewhere where these things were just lived and spoken naturally rather than studied as rules and systems...
oh, i thought you meant assahrawi صحراوي ,which is an adjective, but it seems like you meant ( الصحرا(ء with the hamza which is a noun. there are more than one hamza, but the one in assahraa' is the singled one, which is put at the end of the word.
you can't say (assahra(a'o)) or (assahra(a'i)) when they're placed at the end of a sentence or a title.
Assahraa'a <<-- Fat-ha
Assahraa'o <<-- Dhama
Assahraa'i <<-- Kasra

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It's great that you have a relationship to Arabia far beyond what my university has been able to offer.  I'm envious.  And I'll stop reading to you out of books what you can look around to see
xD

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Good to see you've got a northern (syrian? perhaps even persian?) reference to balance out my berbers.
berbers (persian people)'s clothes' style was actually similar to the arabian, being persian traders selling goods and slaves at arabian bazaars   usually caused them to be getting some epithets and clothes style from eachother .
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If you're looking to round out the references, i suggesting looking for the elite guard as well, which were called (unfortunately, because it makes them impossible to find) "غلام" warriors.  Maybe they were sons of noblemen?  Or perhaps there is another meaning aside from "boy" that I don't know.  I don't know how late you want, but janissaries will come to prominence in turkish lands about the 1430's.

غلام means (a boy),غلمان (boys) were known as servants. according to the scans you posted i see you're talking about the 15th century,Andalusia <3 i like it.
yet i am not going for it, i'm going back to the 7th century.
and i don't see any arabian sword.they all don't have the originality of the arabian swords.
i think they're mongrel ones.

here are some scans (of series of books of an encyclopedia . the book i took the scans from talks about the world's civilisations ) showing the arabian clothes during the 5th century.
portraits :-

An arabian manager reading a massage loudly to a group of people .

an arabian travler .

An arabian leader/ prince. /faris ,taken as a rank as well as an adjective here.

scenes :

an arabian camel rider.

An arabian horseman/knight/rider

A battle's scene shot, called poitiers .

anyway,i'm supposed to be studying now.
I have exams to study for, lots of studies !!! omg. so i'll be gone for a while ,i might not be able to post anything during these three weeks.
« Last Edit: June 11, 2009, 11:30:12 pm by hsn2555 »
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Offline ndchristie

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Re: Arabian Knight

Reply #34 on: June 12, 2009, 01:46:46 am
Heh, this is fun.

I think I was still talking about صحراوي, being confused about how the noun form would become the adjective form, as with nationalities.  Or maybe I am just confused :P.

Poitiers was fought by the Ummayads against what would become the Holy Roman Empire, the bulk of their forces were western Muslims (berbers mostly) and slaves with the exception of the home-grown elite guard.  The second page i posted is of the proper time frame but it's also i think more generic, with the red lances still being a national symbol in morocco (which isn't really Arabia :P).

So little is documented about the first caliphates that it's almost impossible to research them.  The rest of the world largely had ignored the region until that point.  the Ummayads though are vey well documented and flamboyant and they are the ones who took the fight for Islam all the way here!
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Re: Arabian Knight

Reply #35 on: June 12, 2009, 03:12:08 am
Is that page talking about the city of Poitiers (as in the Charles Martel battle you mention in your last paragraph) or is there a person called Poitiers too?

This thread is gold.

If the last images are some representative of actual clothes during the era, I'm beginning to think the design of the hero might be okay. I'm assuming that the gear he's wearing is indicative of any desert-going commoners in any age though. I'm not sure I like the black cape, the design seems to call for something else. Either the black needs to return in the rest of the clothing or the color of the cape needs to be brought together with the sand colors (brown?)

Also, beware of contrast! Your art has very strange contrast curves, with almost no contrast contradicted by gamma-heavy black.

Offline ndchristie

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Re: Arabian Knight

Reply #36 on: June 12, 2009, 05:25:05 am
Is that page talking about the city of Poitiers (as in the Charles Martel battle you mention in your last paragraph) or is there a person called Poitiers too?

The battle of poitiers took place north of the town, on the road to tours, the last-standing bastion of catholic france.  Had it fallen, no urban center stood to hold the muslims from invading all the way to Britain in the north, or into pagan germany, allowing them to come at byzantium and italy from east and west, likely conquering or at least severing/encircling the christian world.  The franks represented the only remaining christian power at that time outside Byzantium, with the british isles dissolving in civil strife under norse invaders, italy also a series of tiny warring states and the goths+visigoths all but broken into other tiny factions (the lombards, who would form northern italy, the vandals, who had already fallen to the moors, etc etc).  The victory, a now-textbook case of why never to charge heavy cavalry up wooded hills (and why not to commit your reserves early - mass attack means mass victory or mass rout, in this case it was a rout) successfully broke the muslim advance, giving much-needed spirit to the frankish tribes who united more strongly that day than ever in history.  they repelled the muslims out of fance and laid the grounds for the carolingian empire, which would establish catholocism in france and germany and provide support to andalusian/celtiberian aragon, castile, gascony, navarre, and portugal.
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Re: Arabian Knight

Reply #37 on: June 12, 2009, 01:51:28 pm
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Poitiers was fought by the Ummayads against what would become the Holy Roman Empire, the bulk of their forces were western Muslims (berbers mostly) and slaves with the exception of the home-grown elite guard.  The second page i posted is of the proper time frame but it's also i think more generic, with the red lances still being a national symbol in morocco (which isn't really Arabia Tongue).

as Poitiers was fought in Paris
ummayads (bani ummayah بني أمية) marched beyond Andalusia to the france ,they built up an army by gathering slaves and berbers along their marching. yup
Ummayads had the biggest marine armada. <-- Randoms xD

we had studied all the islamic history in school (including the Caliphates starting with Rashidun الخلفاء الراشدون
passing by Umayyads الاموي,Abbasids العباسي,Ottomans العثماني ,to the End of the Caliphate نهاية الخلافة.)
i'm going to read those books once again right after i'm done with my finals.

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Is that page talking about the city of Poitiers (as in the Charles Martel battle you mention in your last paragraph) or is there a person called Poitiers too?
poitiers was name of either a place or a city(, i'm not sure), located in paris.

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I'm assuming that the gear he's wearing is indicative of any desert-going commoners in any age though.
as anyone would assume.

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Either the black needs to return in the rest of the clothing or the color of the cape needs to be brought together with the sand colors (brown?)
the matter of colors is another issue, good point though.

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Also, beware of contrast! Your art has very strange contrast curves, with almost no contrast contradicted by gamma-heavy black.
i've been cautioned about that before xD.

ndchristie, your histroical knowledge is much needed in such issues. i really appreciate it.
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Offline Gil

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Re: Arabian Knight

Reply #38 on: June 12, 2009, 05:51:52 pm
Yeah, I knew the part about the battle at Poitiers. As a kid I was pretty heavily into Carolingian, Merovingian, etc history. Something about those post-Roman parts of history. They obviously shaped the whole region I live in, that might be it.

I'm pretty impressed by your knowledge of old world history ndchristie. I have a great game storyline lying around featuring teutonic and templar knight orders that you might find interesting.

hsn2555: Poitiers, Tours and Paris are actually still a pretty fair distance from each other. As ndchristie noted, it was a case of extreme luck for Europe that the Ummayads were stopped there.

I don't think they had the strength to hold the entire region of France, so it would have just ended in turmoil, but as you can see in the southern part of Spain, it might've affected Mediterranean culture a lot.

As for the art, would you like a palette edit? I can try to pull the colors together a bit more...

Offline hsn2555

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Re: Arabian Knight

Reply #39 on: June 12, 2009, 07:20:04 pm
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I have a great game storyline lying around featuring teutonic and templar knight orders that you might find interesting.
You've just found the right person.

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I don't think they had the strength to hold the entire region of France, so it would have just ended in turmoil, but as you can see in the southern part of Spain, it might've affected Mediterranean culture a lot.
they'd be able to go further than where they were at if they axed the gaiety sense and were more careless about sumptuous stuff, tempting .The part of spain you're talking about (when was included to Arabia) was called Andalusia.

to be honest, i actually was not going to give a big attention and be strict to make this games' objects basing on historical facts,
but now i'll be punctual to keep it stand the right way.

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As for the art, would you like a palette edit? I can try to pull the colors together a bit more...
that'd be great
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