AuthorTopic: Terra Tactics Online  (Read 30475 times)

Offline Souly

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Terra Tactics Online

on: September 02, 2008, 08:06:50 am






« Last Edit: October 07, 2008, 01:22:18 am by Souly »

Offline Destiny

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Re: I hate iso

Reply #1 on: September 02, 2008, 08:21:10 am
It would be easier to do iso if you used a smaller sprite hieght/width. Imo, they seem kinda overly simplified, and er, bad, based on what I have seen from you.
The grass looks a bit messy, and random, and could use better form inside the tile
The guy with red hair has two lightsources, one from the hair, and one on the rest of the body.
The lineart seem kinda rough on the shrunken version, and the shoes seem to have a really basic shape.
You could use some more contrast on the skin.


If the designs/style isnt yours, then you can probably ignore this :X

Offline tocky

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Re: I hate iso

Reply #2 on: September 02, 2008, 08:25:48 am
It only makes sense for a tactics game to be isometric.

That's a strange thing to say. See: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tactical_role-playing_game .

Offline Souly

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Re: I hate iso

Reply #3 on: September 02, 2008, 08:30:58 am
These characters are all paper dolls, the items just get
Some of the items are going to break the lightsource.
I don't want the characters to be any smaller then the shrunken version.

The shrunken down version has not been touched up in any way.
I really don't want to lose the cartoony look, I had so much more done avatar wise on my old site.
But the server went down and now it's all gone. :(
I had re-done their feet, right now they have clown feet to the max.
Knowing me I'll get fed up and start the base from scratch.
Considering I have no clothes or hairs anymore I don't see why I can't start over. :/

It only makes sense for a tactics game to be isometric.

That's a strange thing to say. See: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tactical_role-playing_game .
Final Fantasy Tactics (uses 3D), Ogre Battle, Dofus
It's common for tactical games to be iso or at least at an isometric view.

Quote from: wikipedia says
But this genre incorporates strategic gameplay such as tactical movement on an isometric grid.
« Last Edit: September 02, 2008, 08:36:23 am by Souly »

Offline tocky

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Re: I hate iso

Reply #4 on: September 02, 2008, 08:42:15 am
Truth, that. But it's not the only projection that'd work, and it's not the only one that makes sense. See Fire Emblem, Langrisser, Advance Wars for another one that's common, or Bahamut Lagoon for another that'd suit the sprites you've already made. There are a whole bunch of ways to do it, is what I mean to say, and isometric projection isn't some magic bullet. If you don't like it, you don't have to use it, I mean. Sorry for the tangent.
« Last Edit: September 02, 2008, 08:46:32 am by tocky »

Offline Souly

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Re: I hate iso

Reply #5 on: September 02, 2008, 09:28:09 am
The engine that my RPG will be coded from is an isometric engine.
So I kinda have to do iso. :/

www.battleforcesonline.com
Is the game which will be the starting point for my RPG.


I just realized the bushes are way to small.

This is just a trial for me, I edited the crap out of the male base and made it much smaller.

Now the bushes aren't so tiny.

« Last Edit: September 02, 2008, 10:39:26 am by Souly »

Offline Jiisuki

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Re: I hate iso

Reply #6 on: September 02, 2008, 12:43:46 pm
I think the base sprite could use some more contrast. Or perhaps it is this crappy screen.
I will have another check when I get home.
I think the character design in overall is really cool though :)
I also feel that the rocks looks a bit out of place for now when placed on the grass. Perhaps some longer straws that surrounds the rocks in some places?
Perhaps I can come with an edit if you don't understand what i mean, but i think you do ;)

Offline Fatalis67

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Re: I hate iso

Reply #7 on: September 02, 2008, 01:47:54 pm
I love the overall character design, but all the characters, especially the skeleton & little demon guy, need to have some edges smoothed. But that's just from shrinking them.
In the words of Shakesphere: "Villian! I hast done thy mother!"

Offline Souly

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Re: I hate iso

Reply #8 on: September 02, 2008, 10:19:05 pm

Alright took some time to remake most of the bases.
« Last Edit: September 02, 2008, 10:29:33 pm by Souly »

Offline Sabata

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Re: I hate iso

Reply #9 on: September 02, 2008, 10:28:15 pm

Alright took some time to remake most of the bases.

Umm, will there be movement? Or any other animation? Because I think that they would look much better if they were isometric view like the tiles...

Sure you can try and make the "Gaia online" walking style... of witch I am not a fan

Offline Souly

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Re: I hate iso

Reply #10 on: September 02, 2008, 10:35:04 pm
No there wont be any animations.
The characters are going to be be stiff while moving across the board.
I want full customization, and animation just doesn't allow that to be very easy...
The only animations will be the skills and attacks.

Do the characters fit in with the isometric at all?
I think they do but it could just be me.




Crappy iso tiling program.
« Last Edit: September 02, 2008, 11:08:44 pm by Souly »

Offline Souly

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Re: I hate iso

Reply #11 on: September 03, 2008, 12:01:31 am

Sorry, update.
How's my tree look. (updated tree)


« Last Edit: September 03, 2008, 12:47:55 am by Souly »

Offline Redshrike

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Re: I hate iso

Reply #12 on: September 03, 2008, 01:45:01 am
The characters don't really look iso to me.  They're in a plain side view.  They'd fit fine in a sidescroller, but in iso they look out of place.  One easy way to tell:  If you draw horizontal lines across your character, you can see that certain features line up: the shoulders, the hands, the feet, the eyes, they're all on the same horizontal lines.  In an isometric perspective, your 'horizontal' is actually a slanted line corresponding to the slant of the tiles you're using.  It's also viewed from above, so you see the tops of shapes as well as the sides (but never the bottoms).  Here's a quick pic to show you what I mean:

Offline Souly

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Re: I hate iso

Reply #13 on: September 03, 2008, 03:03:48 am

I'm doubting this actually looks better.

Redshrike: Thanks for the edit.
I'm still thinking if I want to make the characters more isometric.
Kinda partial to straight on view since it's easy to make clothes for.



I tried highlights on some of them.
Better?

Offline tehwexxl0rz

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Re: I hate iso

Reply #14 on: September 03, 2008, 03:35:12 am
I think it's crucial that you adjust the perspective of your characters. Even if you want to show them facing directly to the left or right, your map is displayed from a 1/2 overhead angle and they must adhere to the same perspective for your game world to look cohesive. Right now, they look disconnected and pasted on top.

Another perspective issue; the tree looks likes it's leaning waaay back.

Offline Souly

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Re: I hate iso

Reply #15 on: September 03, 2008, 04:39:38 am
I don't want to sound like I'm not taking criticism here, but I really like what I have at the moment.
Just not too inclined with changing the design.
I have moved the right leg up to give it a little bit more depth. Iunno if it worked. :/

I feel it will be easier to paper doll clothes onto the characters from this angle, and that it'd be harder to do clothing layering on an iso perspective.
And have it still look good.



As for the tree I know it's leaning back, I'm trying to fix it.
If I can't oh well, not all trees are straight.

Offline Doppleganger

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Re: I hate iso

Reply #16 on: September 03, 2008, 06:07:33 am


Here's a shot at giving you some tree guidance. All I really had time for was a quickly whipped up image, but I decided to make it useful by adding in some instructionary rings. The important thing to know with iso is that everything is in a 2:1 ratio, and everything is viewed from a slightly more overhead view than the traditional 3/4 straight on perspective. This is why the rings are layered like so, and it is also why they are ellipses. And because all of that is so, the tree does not look like it's bending. While the roots of your tree are actually acceptable for iso, I opted to edit them in order to ease the process of correcting the lighting.

As for the characters, I really think that they should be in isometric perspective. If you are only going to have four walking directions, than it would actually save you time to use the traditional NW,NE,SW,SE facings, because all that is necessary is NE and SE directions. If you're going to make 8-directional walking than you're going to need those NE and SW positions anyways, and it'd probably be a good idea for them to be facing directly where they're headed. I personally believe that your choosing to work your characters in a non-iso perspective is related to your general inexperience with iso and that taking the easy route is not necessarily the best way to go. Especially considering that you're going to be constructing an entire game with isometric graphics. It is better to get things right the first time, than it is to make a bunch of stuff and realize -in the end- that it needs to be redone. It's natural for an artist to strive for perfection, and I can almost guarantee that if you see this game through, that you'll be wanting your characters to be in true iso perspective by the end of it.

Making and animating human figures in iso is probably one of the hardest things I've ever come across in the game making world, but having those skills at hand is a very comforting feeling indeed.

Offline flaber

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Re: I hate iso

Reply #17 on: September 03, 2008, 06:08:11 am
This has really come to my attention.
I shall give this proper attention.

I will begin with the grass..
your underlying base color is too dark and laced too much with a blue hue. Grass has a more yellowy tinge, where as leaves and pine needles have the bluer tinge to them. It is also a medium range color - true in this example it is your darkest green, but in essence it is still a mid range color.
When working with details/textures, the only instances they disappear is during deep shadow or extreme highlight. Deep shadows have less to no detail because there simply is not enough light hitting that spot to reflect the proper look. Extreme highlights end up washing out the detail with an abundance of light.
Since you have a medium tone for your darkest green on the grass, that is why it seems abit odd or empty. The green itself is suggesting it is recieving a fair amount of light to give that nice rich color, where as your detail is suggesting it is a lack of light.
This causes a contradictory image to the eye.

Looking at the actual details of it now. you have rather large oblonged shapes that you are trying to illustrate as blades of grass. Keep in mind though, we are not face to face with the grass. It still has some distance on us and we will not be able to see the blades of grass that large. The thinest and most refined you could make the grass would be 1pixel wide.. the other method would be to suggest it through clever shading.. but right now these large oblong shapes appear to be more of leaves on the ground than grass.

Grass is a tricky thing to decide upon. Whether to have it long, short, or medium. How to portray it, and when to portray the depth. But dont have a mix on your main repeating tile. You have short grass (where there is no detail) and long grass, where you have shaded your oblongs all on the same tile. When tiled, your map looks like it has small bulges in the ground every where. Try to keep your blade length the same throughout the tile, and then make transistor tiles. generally with grass, you have 2 options. Either the simplistic approach where not much grass detail is seen at all on your short grass.. and then just subtle suggestions as it increases in length on the next tile - but the entire tile shares the same amount of detail.
The other option is to create largely complex detailed grass patterns. The reason for these is to eliminate the grid. The simplistic approach you end up grouping large areas of same color together, and the complex detailed way cant have the eye focus on a specific spot to determine grid (if matched edges).

Then you have black lines on some parts of grass. Dont forget though you are slightly above the tile and not straight onto it. All your black lines are as if you are looking closer to straight on. Bring some black line detail downward too.

Rocks.
They are not simply a cutout that you can place ontop of your already premade tiles. you have no shading beneath it, and some half grass blades poking out that are obviously covered. You can still use those same tiles, but quickly edit them to show abit of shadow beneath the rock to indicate it is sitting on the grass, instead of simply a black line suggesting it was just placed ontop.

Tree.
lets take alook at your tree now.
why is it slanted? hmm a good question you may ask. it is not the detail at the moment. It is your perspective. and i know.. i know.. like you already told me when i spoke to you earlier - you do not want to fix anything related to perspective problems. But well... im still gong to bring it up here again in a more explanatory fashion.
you have a contradictory tree again. The base/roots are struggling to be seen in an iso perspective, where as the trunk and the top of the tree is seen at a straight 2d sidescroller fashion.
Isometric is seen from above and from 2 sides. REMEMBER THIS. you seem to like to forget about seeing things from the top. The trunk of your tree should be foreshortened quite significantly. Probably about to where you have the lowest back leaf. This is because since you see from the top-down.. you would see the canopy first which is covering the trunk.
the way you have the canopy currently also looks like a cotton ball that has been caught on a twig on just the very edge of it.. The leaves are huge and in large mass behind the tree but absolutly nothing in front or to the sides really.
Like I said before, with the trunk of the tree. You will see more canopy - from the top and the side. So instead of shading it straight on, you then have to add depth to indicate the top and the sides of the canopy. Shouldnt see any branches. Like i said with the grass we are quite far away.. and dont have our eyes right by the tree. The leaves should hide most of the branch details.
So you need to bring the canopy forward, over top of the trunk in a sphere shape (unless you make many spheres like seiken densetsu 3) and make sure they are spheres, instead of circles.
I will leave this for now.. and see how you will change it.
oh, actually one last thing. Those are some MIGHTY large roots for the tree. they are 1/2 or larger than the trunk itself. should be shrunken in width. Main roots end up becoming the different sections that 'wrap' around the tree. Not 1/2 the tree entirely.
again though. I will wait till you fix perspective before i comment on details/textures/colors.

Sprites.
These are in need of a total perspective overhaul. It absolutely saddened me to hear you would not fix them. That you feel 'they look fine, and that you can pull it off without changing it.' It is not in proper perspective, and it should not matter if you feel you can pull it off. It simply does not work, nor fit the perspective.
Example: It would be like placing a mario platformer sprite into a zelda world. True they both have side run animations, but zelda has a slightly top down perspective, and mario is straight on sideways. It would not fit - although both are simply running sideways.
Or placing the link sprite into a mario world.
Yes you can make it work.. I suppose, if you really stretch it and are stubborn. But it is not right, nor proper. Something always seems alittle off or funny about it, no matter how convincing they try to make it.
Anyways. back to your sprites.
The large sprites you have in the iso boxes... Just because you have them drawn within the bounding box of the iso tile does not make them isometric. if you take those very same sprites you can simply draw a straight on 2d rectangle bounding box around them.
Now I see you are trying to use the smaller sprites. You attempted to add somekind of a perspective on them.
all you did though, unfortunately was keep the straight on perspective and slightly rotated them.
yet again you forgot that iso you are looking down. Meaning bodies and legs are shortened, and you will see the tops of head and shoulders.
the rotation you added to them was very minor. About 1/5 off from straight on.
Isometric, as you illustrated that you understand with your tiles, is a 2x1 ratio.
The sprites you have (neglecting the fact they are still straight on) is roughly about a 9x1 ratio.
It is not close to iso, and you should not feel good about wanting to leave it.
The rotation is not proper, nor is the top down aspect of it correct either. Actually, the stance you gave them is near proper for a megaman style. He never actually stands straight sideways, or straight front. He has that slight twist in him. But lets remember, Megaman is a sidescroller platformer, not an isometric game.
I will not critique your sprites until you correct perspective.

It should not matter if you do simply do not want to fix it or edit the sprites 'yet again.'
If there is a blatant issue, and not simply a 'style disagreement' then you should try to correct it. Artists will constantly try to correct whatever is wrong, and shouldnt settle simply because they dont feel like editing the mistakes they created.
If you want to make this project worthwhile, which it seems to be the plan (since you have been working with these characters and ideas for quite some time now), then shouldnt you do it properly?
It will not only make your project and finished product better, but it will also improve you as an artist.
It irked me when you told me that on msn, and I do hope you decide to change that notion of yours.

I will see how your new updates turn out, and perhaps I will continue my critique with you.
But until then, this all for now.

--Extra addition--
I just realized, perhaps at somepoints I may have been unclear, or you simply do not understand what I mean.
If you need clarification ask.
Also, if you are unsure on how to turn the sprites into an isometric perspective I will help further with that. But Im assuming you understand that perspective.
« Last Edit: September 03, 2008, 06:10:21 am by flaber »

Offline Souly

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Re: I hate iso

Reply #18 on: September 03, 2008, 09:14:42 am
Flaber, at some point in time I will reply to that that post.
It's 3:00 AM so now is not the time...


Based off of Dopplegangers edit I tried reworking the tree a bit.

Offline Sabata

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Re: I hate iso

Reply #19 on: September 03, 2008, 11:54:50 am
Flaber, at some point in time I will reply to that that post.
It's 3:00 AM so now is not the time...


Based off of Dopplegangers edit I tried reworking the tree a bit.

I think that the problem whit tree at this point is the lack of depth... it seems like right now light is hitting it everywhere, maybe it would be better to chose a light source and shade the tree on edges?
I presume that since you'll probably have rotation (SW,SN..) it would be better to keep light just on the top middle of sprites, this way you wont need to change the shading when rotation is made.

I hope that was clear enough... I usually have a hard time expressing that kind of stuff in English  :blind:

Offline randomagain

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Re: I hate iso

Reply #20 on: September 03, 2008, 01:34:30 pm
I might have missed it. what platform are you using?

I have some useful links/code in flash for ISO, you might be able to figure out and reapply for you needs.

Looking pretty good! Not much of an elf fan.





Offline Froli

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Re: I hate iso

Reply #21 on: September 03, 2008, 02:48:52 pm
Made an edit, and it turned into something creepy so I stopped. Anyway, you really should go for this perspective because for a "big" sprite, I belive it's easy to put clothes on them. Consistency is important, and basic fundamentals should be followed so you won't get confused later on <note that what I made is not perfect>.

You can also stray 1-2 pixel away from the guide when making this characters, you just have to eyeball them, and see if the stance is not so awkward.



Edit - Aligned them properly -



« Last Edit: September 03, 2008, 03:26:29 pm by Froli »

Offline Indigo

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Re: I hate iso

Reply #22 on: September 03, 2008, 08:05:22 pm
Froli, I'm really enjoying your awesome critique around the forum - A great contribution to pixelation.  Keep it up

Offline Souly

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Re: I hate iso

Reply #23 on: September 03, 2008, 08:50:38 pm

Yay for super muscular midget people.
And overly large deformed boobies.

I took a stab at trying what froli had done.
Hope I didn't reference the orc too much.

I might have missed it. what platform are you using?

I have some useful links/code in flash for ISO, you might be able to figure out and reapply for you needs.

Looking pretty good! Not much of an elf fan.

AJAX, a mix between php and java
This is going to be a web based game.
www.battleforcesonline.com
This game is going to be upgraded into my game.

My game doesn't have elves.
« Last Edit: September 03, 2008, 10:18:23 pm by Souly »

Offline Cure

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Re: I hate iso (updated first post)

Reply #24 on: September 04, 2008, 01:28:54 am
Their right eyes seem too high.  The female's left breast may look better one pixel lower.
Is there a reason they're so muscular?  The chick looks especially manly, very powerful legs.
« Last Edit: September 04, 2008, 01:34:44 am by Cure »

Offline Souly

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Re: I hate iso (updated first post)

Reply #25 on: September 04, 2008, 02:08:10 am




A sword and shield. :]

Edit: and a goblin.
« Last Edit: September 04, 2008, 06:29:27 am by Souly »

Offline Souly

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Re: I hate iso

Reply #26 on: September 04, 2008, 09:19:13 am
Sorry for the double post, large update.



« Last Edit: September 04, 2008, 11:41:20 am by Souly »

Offline Fatalis67

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Re: I hate iso

Reply #27 on: September 04, 2008, 02:29:28 pm
Wow, nice update, but a few problems. First of all, I'm assuming a "Skalywag" is a pirate, but that doesn't look like a gun a pirate would use. It should be bigger and maybe look more like a flintlock pistol. Also, is the Herbalist intended to look like a stoner hippie? This seems WAY out of place in the theme of your game.
In the words of Shakesphere: "Villian! I hast done thy mother!"

Offline Souly

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Re: I hate iso

Reply #28 on: September 04, 2008, 05:56:53 pm
Wow, nice update, but a few problems. First of all, I'm assuming a "Skalywag" is a pirate, but that doesn't look like a gun a pirate would use. It should be bigger and maybe look more like a flintlock pistol. Also, is the Herbalist intended to look like a stoner hippie? This seems WAY out of place in the theme of your game.
Dude there is no theme to my game.
This game is a bunch of realities combined.
Herbalists bring in the modern day clothing, so things such as t-shirts and pants.
Drugs are the magic in my game.

The gun is just a place holder, I made it so I could see if it could be done.

Update: New gun, and helmet

« Last Edit: September 04, 2008, 06:43:15 pm by Souly »

Offline Souly

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Re: I hate iso

Reply #29 on: September 05, 2008, 03:54:31 pm

Offline Souly

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Re: I hate iso

Reply #30 on: September 05, 2008, 08:55:07 pm

Introducing the Hulk, and a few other things.

« Last Edit: September 05, 2008, 11:33:20 pm by Souly »

Offline Souly

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Re: I hate iso

Reply #31 on: September 06, 2008, 05:48:18 pm
Wow... 4 posts no replies, not even on the orc. :(


I erased everything that was on the inside of the lines.
Started over and got this.

« Last Edit: September 06, 2008, 05:59:40 pm by Souly »

Offline leroy

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Re: I hate iso

Reply #32 on: September 06, 2008, 06:13:57 pm
what the heck is going on with that orc's weapon?

Offline Souly

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Re: I hate iso

Reply #33 on: September 06, 2008, 06:15:15 pm
Oops I uploaded the wrong file.


« Last Edit: September 06, 2008, 07:41:51 pm by Souly »

Offline Skull

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Re: I hate iso (updated first post)

Reply #34 on: September 06, 2008, 10:09:55 pm
The chick looks especially manly, very powerful legs.
Well, as we all know - everyone wants to get with Chun-Li.  :o

Those large monsters look brilliant. The hammer with a slight twist is excellent. I really like how the armour fit them aswell. Really looking forward to this, man!

Offline Souly

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Re: I hate iso

Reply #35 on: September 07, 2008, 02:46:40 pm

Changed up a couple of things.
Moved their heads three pixels forward.

Offline dfcastelao

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Re: I hate iso

Reply #36 on: September 07, 2008, 11:47:38 pm
Their faces are a bit off perspective. Just compare the height difference between her eyes (4 pixels) and between her nipples (2 pixels). I've raised their eyes and ears a little bit.

Offline Souly

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Re: I hate iso

Reply #37 on: September 08, 2008, 11:05:51 pm
That's what I had before with the old characters.
It's out of perspective.
That being said then clearly the nipples are out of perspective in my version..

Offline Redshrike

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Re: I hate iso

Reply #38 on: September 08, 2008, 11:21:03 pm
To be honest, your new bases look a bit messy to me.  Froli managed to pack a lot of detail into his rendition of the orc, but he did it neatly.  Yours has a lot of the same details, but also a number of stray pixels, some parts which look misshapen, and jaggies.  I think you might well be better off to look at other anatomical references than just his orc (his is excellent, but also very convenient; you don't have to think about and interpret his changes so much as imitate them) and to take another look at your anti-aliasing.

Offline Sabata

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Re: I hate iso

Reply #39 on: September 09, 2008, 12:22:20 am
I believe that what Redshrike said is true... that is what everyone is trying to tell you, and the point is that we know that you can make amazing art, speed is good but quality is better... also think of this the following, you only need to make base once... then its only items.

Another thing is that while you have everything in iso you still have a clash in perspective...why? Well judging by your characters feet position and eyes its like 4 pixels iso? so the further leg is much more up than the front one... its not wrong, only that while you make details they should be on that iso view as well meaning eyes, hands, muscle details should be that way too... while you have pose on 4 pix( or something) your details are like on 1 pixel difference..or 2.... Look at your latest chest plate, its isometric only that its 1 pixel while your pose is 4... thus it makes it look bad.

Hope that helps you.  :)

Slight edit on chest to show you what I mean....
From left to right... yours, mine, lines showing isometric view... try doing it whit yours and you'll see how out of view was your chest.

« Last Edit: September 09, 2008, 12:51:05 am by Sabata »

Offline dfcastelao

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Re: I hate iso

Reply #40 on: September 09, 2008, 12:59:55 am
Sabata has exposed the problem much better than me. He has hit the jackpot and I was completely wrong indeed. I did my crytic without examining the sprite as a whole. I just looked at some details (chest and shoulders) and updated the eyes according to what I thought that was the perspective line. I feel ashamed because of that. I'll try not to be so fast in the future  :-[.

So you're right, their eyes are at the right height (albeit I think that they would look better if you raises their left - our right - eye one pixel :)). I suggest you to add some rotation to their eyes. They seems to be drawn in a less tilted perspective (no inclination at all). I don't really know how to explain myself better with my pesky English :P. Just look at the green dude drawn by Frolly to match the difference.

Please, check her hip (both sides at the same height) and their shoulders, they look to be out of perspective.

Hope it helps.

Offline Souly

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Re: I hate iso

Reply #41 on: September 09, 2008, 01:35:56 am
Yeah the shoulders are all kinds of wrong.
The one showing on the male is HUGE holy hell.


I realize what you mean with the orc guy's leg.
I did an edit on the base.
I'll do the work on the chest plate like you mentioned.

Offline $ymbol

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Re: I hate iso

Reply #42 on: September 09, 2008, 09:23:46 am
I agree with redshrike, especially on the orc :-X


Also, the perspective on the metal hammer is off, and woman's lower body looks sorta flat.

 
« Last Edit: September 09, 2008, 09:26:10 am by $ymbol »

Offline Souly

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Re: I hate iso

Reply #43 on: September 10, 2008, 10:34:32 am
The metal hammer is the old hammer.
Not sure if I wanted to use it or not.
Though I am aware of how bad the perspective is, thus the log was made from the new template.

->
I was going through Larwick's gallery and his mushroom and bomb inspired me. :]
Which mushroom do you like best?
Or do they all just suck uncontrollably?


Skullbomb
« Last Edit: September 10, 2008, 12:52:44 pm by Souly »

Offline Souly

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Re: I hate iso

Reply #44 on: October 04, 2008, 11:25:19 pm

Offline Sabata

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Re: I hate iso

Reply #45 on: October 05, 2008, 01:35:53 pm


What is going on whit their shoulder? It looks like a bunch of meat was placed on it...if you know what I mean, old shoulder shading was better...
Now on smooth looking thing, problem whit old was that it was rough, huge difference in colors making an impact on viewer that made it look like WIPish while on this one it looks smooth, I say TOO SMOOTH I would like to see some more darker shades there to outline and show form a little more. I am especially referring to body/belly.

Offline Joseph

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Re: I hate iso

Reply #46 on: October 05, 2008, 08:53:44 pm
I think the smooth ones are a lot better.  the others were too busy.

shoulder and arm edit:

Offline Souly

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Re: I hate iso

Reply #47 on: October 05, 2008, 11:15:47 pm
Holy crap my arm is so weird.
Anyways, I started trying a back view...


I'll make some changes to the arm.

Offline tehwexxl0rz

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Re: I hate iso

Reply #48 on: October 06, 2008, 04:57:01 am
Edit:



The broken outlines are doing you no favors. Hope this helps. :)

Offline tocky

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Re: I hate iso

Reply #49 on: October 06, 2008, 09:31:25 am

Edit over wexx's edit, mostly just colour suggestion - I think the skin ramp isn't fleshy enough, needs more variety in hue/saturation.

Offline ndchristie

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Re: I hate iso

Reply #50 on: October 06, 2008, 02:44:30 pm
the good news is that you tend to be off by only two or three pixels in any direction.  the bas news is that nearly everything is off by this much, and for something like a hand, or a breast, or an eye, or a foot, two or three pixels is about 40-50% off.

here's a quick large-scale edit :



basically the red lines are measurements, and you got the knees right!  :y:

Iso is hard if you aren't invested.  If i make any suggestions, it's not to change the piece since they are all in the same not-really-2:1-more-like-3:1 perspective, it would be to change the title of this thread.  you'll never make anything work if the first thing you do is say that you hate it.
A mistake is a mistake.
The same mistake twice is a bad habit.
The same mistake three or more times is a motif.

Offline Souly

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Re: Terra Tactics Online

Reply #51 on: October 28, 2008, 12:35:32 am
Okay, sorry for the lack of updates.
I released an entire forum for this project.
(I made a crappy FFT type logo I was lazy)
http://tto.siteburg.com/forums/index.php
Go here if you want updates on the progress of the game.


I tried to re-do them accordingly, made their heads smaller fixed the arm on the right.
Next up... Skin palettes, little help guys?
I think the negro isn't dark enough.

Also the ring is going to be a stand type thing that each unit will go on top of.
It's color will represent the units class, or an icon on them, iunno yet.

Class stands for each unit

Sword, Shield, Target, Spear, Skull, Music note, Wrench, Bong
« Last Edit: October 28, 2008, 02:17:05 am by Souly »

Offline Souly

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Re: Terra Tactics Online

Reply #52 on: October 29, 2008, 03:55:39 am

Tried re-doing the colors.
Could be this monitor.
« Last Edit: October 29, 2008, 03:57:17 am by Souly »

Offline Raytheon

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Re: Terra Tactics Online

Reply #53 on: October 29, 2008, 09:50:17 am
In the latest one his right leg (our left) seems to be broken and disproportionate after you changed the angle of his upper body. The shading and pose is great, but its the perspective that needs a little work.


I'd give it an edit but id either screw it up or make myself look like an idiot. Plus its late.
i am a computern

Offline Yuho

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Re: Terra Tactics Online

Reply #54 on: November 01, 2008, 01:14:39 am
why gotta use the n word  :(

Offline Souly

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Re: Terra Tactics Online

Reply #55 on: November 01, 2008, 01:22:18 am
I could say black guy but he isn't black he's like brown.
So negro it is, I wasn't being racist. :/

Offline tehwexxl0rz

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Re: Terra Tactics Online

Reply #56 on: November 01, 2008, 01:50:14 am
I could say black guy but he isn't black he's like brown.*
So negro it is, I wasn't being racist. :/

Do you call caucasian people "blanca" because they aren't the color white? Dude, "negro" means "black" in Spanish. In English vernacular, the word has only ever been used to refer a person of African descent. However, the term is very outdated, and politically incorrect. I wouldn't call your usage racist, just ignorant....

Anyway Souly, you "borrowed" almost all of my original pixels for the female's torso.... I'd appreciate if you took a whack at it yourself.
« Last Edit: November 01, 2008, 03:52:25 am by tehwexxl0rz »

Offline Kazuya Mochu

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Re: Terra Tactics Online

Reply #57 on: November 01, 2008, 03:06:11 am
negro is not only spanish for black, but it means black in most latin decendent languagues. in fact, the usage of the term "negeroid" has been used to describe the common physical characteristics of african decendent people. the same way caucasian means white. black people are not only from africa the same way black people arent only from europe. Negro has got a racist reputation because it has been used racistly. to me "nigger" isnt a racist word, because the people I hear sayin it are black comediants, and they actually make it sound super cool. I think its all about context. and i'm guessing no one here was in to offending anyone else.

anyway, the black couple looks way too saturated. specially on the highlights. you can leave some saturation on the midtons, for a warm skin look
Image size doesn't matter! It's what you do with your pixels that counts!

Offline tehwexxl0rz

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Re: Terra Tactics Online

Reply #58 on: November 01, 2008, 03:50:35 am
Kazuya Mochu, if you don't take issue with anything that's been said, why post that first paragraph?? Since you brought it up, whether you find it offensive or not, the word "ni**er" was originally popularized in this country with a racist agenda. If you're a fan of black comedy, I'd think you'd be aware of the difference between that word and "nigga." Personally, I don't even feel qualified to use that word though, since I'm not black myself and thus have never been a susceptible target of the original slur. IN ANY CASE, this is NOT an appropriate forum for an open-ended discussion about racist terminology!

Sorry, everyone else.... GETTING BACK ON TRACK:

Souly: The skin tone of the 3rd from the left pair is really desaturated. Also, the contrast on the 4th pair is really low.
« Last Edit: November 01, 2008, 09:20:22 am by tehwexxl0rz »

Offline tehwexxl0rz

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Re: Terra Tactics Online

Reply #60 on: November 01, 2008, 09:05:50 am
Whether you find it offensive or not, that word was created with a racist agenda.
No it wasn't.
"Negro" is not the word to which I was referring. Sorry, if I was unclear.
« Last Edit: November 01, 2008, 09:08:09 am by tehwexxl0rz »

Offline Kazuya Mochu

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Re: Terra Tactics Online

Reply #61 on: November 01, 2008, 02:49:18 pm
Quote
Kazuya Mochu, if you don't take issue with anything that's been said, why post that first paragraph??

so if I'm not having a problem with what has been said, I dont have a right to say anything about it? way to shut me up! well done.

Image size doesn't matter! It's what you do with your pixels that counts!

Offline Opacus

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Re: Terra Tactics Online

Reply #62 on: November 01, 2008, 04:34:53 pm
Those icons on the stands are really hard to read.

Offline Sherman Gill

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Re: Terra Tactics Online

Reply #63 on: November 01, 2008, 06:41:52 pm
Quote
Kazuya Mochu, if you don't take issue with anything that's been said, why post that first paragraph??
so if I'm not having a problem with what has been said, I dont have a right to say anything about it? way to shut me up! well done.
He never said that. He was questioning your motivation behind it. Please, don't take anything in a debate personally or it will shift into an argument :(.

Souly: Why is pair 4 so desaturated? ??? What ethnicity are they modeled after?
Oh yes naked women are beautiful
But I like shrimps more haha ;)

Offline Souly

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Re: Terra Tactics Online

Reply #64 on: November 01, 2008, 07:11:40 pm
I think I was going for an afgan color.

« Last Edit: November 01, 2008, 07:38:21 pm by Souly »

Offline Sherman Gill

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Re: Terra Tactics Online

Reply #65 on: November 01, 2008, 07:21:02 pm
Then maybe something more like this?
:hehe:
Oh yes naked women are beautiful
But I like shrimps more haha ;)

Offline Souly

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Re: Terra Tactics Online

Reply #66 on: November 01, 2008, 07:38:40 pm
wexxl0r, I'm sorry if it looks like that.
But I did place each pixel, yours were just in very convienent places that worked.
I'm sorry if it appears that way... I may have referenced it a bit too much.


I changed the females tits

Those icons on the stands are really hard to read.
I think I'm ditching the stands...
I would have to make stands for each monster if I did it this way.
« Last Edit: November 01, 2008, 07:42:40 pm by Souly »

Offline tehwexxl0rz

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Re: Terra Tactics Online

Reply #67 on: November 01, 2008, 08:11:45 pm
No worries. I actually like your new version much better! The breasts look a lot more natural. The consistent outline on both characters is also a big improvement. Hmm... I know this hasn't changed in a while, but the male's pecs and abs look sort of messy. Especially in comparison to the female's smooth anatomy. (It sounds so sleazy when I put it like that.... haha) Minor, but I'm noticing a bit of a banding issue around the girl's ass. You might want to change that, might not; I know it's a nitpick.

Offline Souly

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Re: Terra Tactics Online

Reply #68 on: November 01, 2008, 08:25:34 pm

Better on the male chest? And fixed the bum issue.

Offline ptoing

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Re: Terra Tactics Online

Reply #69 on: November 01, 2008, 08:26:03 pm
The breasts on the women are very odd, the one on the right is too much to the side. Like stuck under the armpit. I suggest you look at some reference. Otherwise you are coming along nicely. Perhaps you could make a few different sized versions as well. Everyone being the same size and such is a bit odd. Works at smaller resolutions but at what you have it looks a tad odd.
There are no ugly colours, only ugly combinations of colours.

Offline tehwexxl0rz

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Re: Terra Tactics Online

Reply #70 on: November 03, 2008, 04:35:51 am
Better on the male chest? And fixed the bum issue.
That's the same pic, yo.... ???

Offline Raytheon

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Re: Terra Tactics Online

Reply #71 on: November 03, 2008, 06:05:04 am
legs are still out of place compared to each other. move his left one in or make his right one longer or something.
i am a computern