AuthorTopic: Official OT-Creativity Thread 2  (Read 811816 times)

Offline ndchristie

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Re: Official OT-Creativity Thread 2

Reply #120 on: November 27, 2007, 03:31:17 pm
your style clearly has a number of conventions I don't know much about, so i won't try to work to it, but here's a quick alteration:


I've kept her in your pose, but i wouldn't necessarily suggest this.  Something more dynamic might not go amiss.  Right now it's stiff a bit.  One other thing is that the direction of the wind is making her look more hefty the way the clothes billow, it might be better to set the wind opposite.

finally, most importantly, gravity is the first force to act on a womans hair.  if you have it popping out strong then curving down, it's going to look shaggy, stiff, and otherwise masculine.  let it gently fall and then be pushed up by air rather than stuck up and pulled down.
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Offline Faktablad

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Re: Official OT-Creativity Thread 2

Reply #121 on: November 27, 2007, 10:35:44 pm
Larwicked Witch of the West: Those eyes are still pretty huge, though.  If you draw the whole eyeball in as a sphere, it'll turn out to be almost the size of a tennis ball.  Of course, I don't know if it's a stylistic choice.  Check out this reference (though don't rely on it, haha).

Opachyderm:  Nice character, but the pose is very stiff, like Miascugh said.  You should make a LEGENDARY pose!

Offline Larwick

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Re: Official OT-Creativity Thread 2

Reply #122 on: November 27, 2007, 11:36:17 pm
Crikey, long post;

BG: So true, i seem to have missed her shoulder when calculating since it was covered by her sleeve. Sort of an illusion i guess. Anyway i'll plan on fixing that.
Aelyrin: I really don't see that... :/ Even when i crop her face and take away her hair i can't see how she would look more like a man than a woman, but perhaps it's just because in my imagination i 'believe' it's a girl, so my opinion is biased. When taking into account the crits below i'll try and work on it. :)
junkyboy: Thanks man. I've always liked this way of draw folds in clothes (loops) but i've never really been able to do it, until now i guess :) I understand your edit, she looks alot more realistic and easy on the eye there. Made me realise how pointy her chin is (anime's fault) and shortening the gap between her nose and lips helps (although one thing i don't really want to do is to lose the personality i kinda see for her the way she looks atm, and that could change that significantly). I also like what you did with the nose, as subtle as it is. Shows how big i've drawn her eyes, but i still quite like them >_< I'll play around a bit though.
Adarias: Your edit seems to show a much older woman with a much more built up body. I'm unsure how much i'll actually use it. How you've drawn the hair really does show how puffy i've drawn mine, problem is, i really like messy hair D: Also, at the time of the image the two girls would have been travelling in a forest for a few days, and i need to show that somehow (of course you wouldn't have known so no probs). Of course i'll always try it out though, and will probs end up calming down the hair on the left of her face. I didn't notice that about the wind and her clothes but it seems to be true around her waist (or am i looking in the wrong place?) The direction of the wind is kinda important in relation to strengthening the feeling that what they're looking at is quite ominous, to me at least it helps bring that feeling across... right?
I'm probs being defensive because i dislike changing a drawing greatly after first drawing it, which is a problem more than anything i think - as i feel this way even though i know i can save a backup of the older version.
Faktablad: Haha i see what you mean. It's definetely a stylistic choice, since this is more of a comic drawing than a 'realistic' one. Thanks for the ref, i'll see what i can do to make them a comfy size.

Thanks so much for the help guys. I'm really glad i posted the pic now.
« Last Edit: November 27, 2007, 11:54:58 pm by Larwick »

Offline ndchristie

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Re: Official OT-Creativity Thread 2

Reply #123 on: November 27, 2007, 11:56:56 pm
the thing is, there's not a woman on earth that doesn't follow the same basic shapes (though they become smaller, tighter, looser, or more obscured with situation).  if you look, too, the edit is significantly smaller of frame (except in the legs, because I am Scottish and enjoy short, powerful legs).  Where she is more powerful is the hips, i kinda feel like yours are small and boyish (though this is also an age thing, i read this girl to be in her late teens or early twenties based on the height difference).  Also, the majority of those outlines are diagrammatic and not actual recesses, so if you work from the edit at all you can (should!!) smooth things out, but the structural changes IMO are pretty important along with some adjustments to the breasts. 

The whole thing right now is a teenage boy!  Form, stance, and face.  I didn't say it because aelyrin did, but now that you've dismissed it I feel the need to restate.

ragged, tossed hair should follow the same principals as clean hair, with more mess.  your hair, it isn't really natural hair, regardless of time in the woods.  you would need some crazy gel to get that shape you currently have.

As far as wind, remember that being sucked into a place you don't want to is actually more ominous than being blown away from it.
A mistake is a mistake.
The same mistake twice is a bad habit.
The same mistake three or more times is a motif.

Offline Faktablad

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Re: Official OT-Creativity Thread 2

Reply #124 on: November 28, 2007, 12:46:01 am
When I look at Adarias' edit, I have to admit that I've never seen hips like that on a woman.  Her whole pelvic area seems unnaturally huge, and her butt definitely looks kind of saggy from the small chunk of it we can see now.  I think all that's necessary is to alter her FACE, and maybe widen her HIPS a little bit. 

Along those lines, EDITZZZ!!!!1:

I just used the selection tool in Paint to move things around to where I thought they should go.

I took out part of the jaw line so that it doesn't extend all the way to the back of her neck; this does a lot to reduce manliness/age.  When something is younger, it is softer and smoother, which means it makes less harsh shadows (generally).  I also pulled up the chin towards the mouth.  That did a lot too.  I also resized the eyes, just so you can see what they look like...I know it's a "stylistic thing", but you could change, you never know... :D

Another thing I did was take out the part of her schnoz that connected with her brow, again to reduce manliness/age.  Younger people have smaller noses (generally).  I also reduced the size of the cranium. 

To make her body more womanly, I subtly increased the width of the hips, the size of the legs, the size of the arms, the width of the waist, the height of the breast, and the height of the collarbone.  All of the widening is because women have a higher fat-to-muscle ratio than men (generally).  All this combined makes her look more female.

Offline Larwick

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Re: Official OT-Creativity Thread 2

Reply #125 on: November 28, 2007, 12:56:34 am
Haha touché to the max.
Yeah she's meant to be around 17 years old. I did just make some changes to her torso which should help lessen her boyishness, i'm actually quite surprised how boyish i seemed to have made her - it could be me trying to get away from the OTT girls i used to draw. I'm gunna try my best to make her look more feminine, more research will probs help.
So okidoke, i'll take all that into consideration. Thanks!

PS. I just realised the little girl has really long legs.. perhaps. >_>

After reading Faktas post:

Ahah! She needs a butt. I apologise for missing that pointer in Adarias' edit, so i better get on and make that biggar.
Cranium size - step ahead of ya, changed that a few minutes ago :)
With the jawline etc that's a pretty good tip, and i'm gunna deff look into that.
I don't really want to squish her head too much, i think at the moment it helps convey the age difference between the two girls (yanow, apart from the fact shes twice the size as the other). Plus i guess i kinda like long faces and big noses lol >_>
What you've done with her chest is almost exactly what i've already done, which is great to see.

Anyway thanks alot!

Offline Faktablad

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Re: Official OT-Creativity Thread 2

Reply #126 on: November 28, 2007, 01:26:19 am
Nice job working so hard on this.  I totally understand that you want to make sure that people notice the age difference (her being the strong rock of the pair), but if you look closely, even at my edit (I don't want to toot my own horn too much), you can tell alot from the facial proportions.  You've already done a great job making the kid look like a kid, and it's not because her head is squished too much.  The way the nose is shaped does make a difference: smaller children have more turned-up noses with less of a bridge.  The chin line makes a difference: the kid's jaw is more pointy and diminuitive.  The size of the eyes in comparison to the head makes a difference: remember that eyeballs barely grow at all from childhood to adulthood.  The placement of the facial features make a difference: kids have big ol' brains, with the eyes, nose and mouth more squished to the bottom of the face.  Also the way you've done the mouth on the child is very subtle and nice, whereas the teen has fuller, more womanly lips.  So even without giving her a large nose or a long face, you can make someone look older through the placement of facial features, size of the eyes, shape of the head, and shape of the mouth.

These are all suggestions of course, I'm just warning you not to be afraid of change.  ;D

Offline Larwick

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Re: Official OT-Creativity Thread 2

Reply #127 on: November 28, 2007, 01:47:40 am
Thanks, i have high hopes for this piece!  :B

You're definetely right there, there are alot of things that go into showing someones age. Even though i said about it being a defining-the-age problem it's actually probably more to do with how i want the character portrayed, in terms of personality and generally how she looks.  :angel:

Here's an update now, since i've changed quite a few things. I think i'm getting there...  :-X
She has too much of a pout now perhaps, may just be the hair lines though.



And an anim showing the head editingness:


I feel quite invasive with all these pics >_<
« Last Edit: November 28, 2007, 01:57:25 am by Larwick »

Offline ndchristie

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Re: Official OT-Creativity Thread 2

Reply #128 on: November 28, 2007, 02:06:32 am
hair is still not her own.

my hips and rear are a little larger than they should be (heh, got away trying to make a point), but the point is more the shapes.  right now shes' nearly a straight line down armpit to ankle with only a little shape for the hips even in the newer versions.

fak - you say that edit of the face looks LESS like a man?  perhaps less like a boy, but certainly not at all like a woman.
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The same mistake three or more times is a motif.

Offline Larwick

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Re: Official OT-Creativity Thread 2

Reply #129 on: November 28, 2007, 02:16:07 am
Goddamn, you're right. Looks like a wig now i look again.
And hips, gotchya. About the armpit to ankle thing, i'm seeing a problem with the position of her high shoulder, how it's too flattened or pushed back. Hopefully i can solve some of it by fixing that. I'm gunna have to work on this more tomorow. Thanks for all the help again.