AuthorTopic: Pixelation Complaints  (Read 13036 times)

Offline Helm

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Pixelation Complaints

on: July 29, 2005, 08:21:40 am
Among several others. I took issue with a lot of stuff going on at Pixelation. I always felt it was a terrific forum, particularly in that it was well-known enough to bring occasional visits from publishers and developers. Because of that it's also the reason I got my first paid pixel gig. But the moderating was downright juvenile at times, and usually overbearing. I guess I always kind of hoped for a forum with the renown of Pixelation, and the atmosphere of Pixeldev.

I am quite curious on what stuff you took issue with on Pixelation and I'd like you (and anyone else who feels the same way) to discuss these issues openly so we can hope for a better pixelation when it comes back online. I didn't want to potentially derail and also negatively charge the welcome thread, but it seems we have baggage that I do feel should be resolved. I personally never saw pixelation moderation go juvenile, although I can see the overbearing aspect, I guess. Morganne, you sals or whoever else felt pixelation had problems, be it with the mods or the attitude of the boards or anything else, this is be the place to constructively discuss them.

I note that I am not currently a pixelation moderator, just another pixelation user, so this isn't a 'mod trap' hehe or anything of the kind. As long as it's a civil discussion, anything goes. I can only hope we can resolve the issues that arise. Pixelation shouldn't just be a 'popular board' as you say, to score pay gigs, that's not it's function. Pixelation should be a place old-standing members like sals should feel welcome to, and maybe even at home in.

Offline Evan

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Re: Pixelation Complaints

Reply #1 on: July 29, 2005, 01:46:24 pm
Well, I think the one thing that turned me off to pixelation was it's overwhelming size.

At pixeldev, you could make a post about a new piece of art and get 3, maybe 4 meaningful replies.

At pixelation, you would either get absolutely no replies, or you would get like, 16 replies (most of which were "That's cool, is it for a game??")

So I'd like it if people were active with the report function, and there wasn't much tolerance for lots of spam. Maybe keep an eye on users who have an overwhelming balance of useless posts. If it gets too bad, give 'em a temporary ban.

Offline Negative Gravity

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Re: Pixelation Complaints

Reply #2 on: July 30, 2005, 04:14:00 am
That sounds a bit harsh dont' you think, StairwaytoEvan? Although, I guess it's the only thing left to do to actually make people post useful and relavant posts or complete leave the community and never ever ever come back.

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Offline Rox

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Re: Pixelation Complaints

Reply #3 on: July 30, 2005, 04:59:26 am
Yeah, spamming at Pixelation wasn't bad at all, at least I don't found it bad. There was a bit problem going on with actual critique in the later ... stages, but I think that was just because of that enormous influx of newbies that appeared from nowhere. I know I was active about telling people off and trying to prevent unfitting comments, and from what I saw the other mods (and many regular members) did a good job with it as well.

Of course critique is very much encouraged, as that's what Pixelation was about, but I don't see a need for it to be constantly enforced.

Also, that theory that giving someone useful comments would encourage them to comment on your next piece... that really does work in a lot of cases.

Offline Rydin

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Re: Pixelation Complaints

Reply #4 on: July 30, 2005, 05:18:21 am
I think that pixelation always had people who just just want to get there post counts up, and wouldn't take much time to actually appreciate the art. It started to become like a mainstream thing; "yeah, my friend's signed up, and so is the rest of the 'cool' kids from my school". Well, it was never that bad, but it seemed like people where joining just to say they did.  Also, there was a point when almost nobody thought the art had any imperfections, and would always say that the art was perfect, which is a complement, but provides no help to improve the artist's skills.

Another big thing about pixelation, which I think was its ultimate downfall, was the rants.  I think that when people start to challenge a society with opposing views, it can possibly work out for the good of the community. But seriously, its an art forum; instead of taking 30 minutes to type up a big opinion, why not just make some art expressing these views.

Also, a small thing I felt was a bad move was to make a bunch of different sections. In the old days there was serious and general critique, and that was it. I don't feel a board just for announcements or another board just for off topic threads was really necessary.
I believe that do to the combination of ranting and 'gizmos' on the site, pixelation started to lose quality  content, and considering that a forum is based on content, it was probably not a positive thing for pixelation.

Now, I must get back to pixeling :P.
Man cannot remake himself without suffering for he is both the marble and the sculptor.

Offline Mercury Rising

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Re: Pixelation Complaints

Reply #5 on: July 30, 2005, 03:05:31 pm
Quote from: Rydin link

Another big thing about pixelation, which I think was its ultimate downfall, was the rants. I think that when people start to challenge a society with opposing views, it can possibly work out for the good of the community. But seriously, its an art forum; instead of taking 30 minutes to type up a big opinion, why not just make some art expressing these views.
It was for a contest, an essay contest... there was no graphical choice.  If that wasn't directed towards me, oppsie.   PS Judging for the contest will start in a week!

Also just to point this out,
Quote from: General Discussion board
Feel free to talk about anything and everything in this board.
« Last Edit: July 30, 2005, 03:12:31 pm by BrotherInWar »
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Offline Evan

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Re: Pixelation Complaints

Reply #6 on: July 30, 2005, 09:46:05 pm
That sounds a bit harsh dont' you think, StairwaytoEvan? Although, I guess it's the only thing left to do to actually make people post useful and relavant posts or complete leave the community and never ever ever come back.

I don't think it's harsh at all. I mean, would you want somebody (or in this case, hundreds of somebodies) making useless posts? I say give them a warning, and if they don't comply, give 'em a temp ban. If they come back and make no change, permaban 'em.

It seems like the obvious solution to me...

Offline Alex

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Re: Pixelation Complaints

Reply #7 on: July 31, 2005, 06:10:35 am
ummm as long as Pep isnt there im cool.

</JOKES JOKES>

I was talking about this earlier this week with darion but i think alot of us have taken pixelation for granted really. It really got me started into my art and everything and i met loads of cool people and made some great friends really. I just hope too see the place as happy and as cheerful as it used to be. Hopefully a new layout going because that brucelee kinda got to me after a while rofl. The community we had there was strong and still is even behind the forums but throughout the members themselves so i have no doubt that this will be a good thing. I myself arent as absorbed into pixels as much anymore i dont think, i still enjoy it but i find myself to approach pixels in a much different way and i hope that i dont get bashed if i post my junk lol. I find myself painting with pixels now instead of literally making lines and colouring them. its a different feel and i like it better. I have no complaints about the old pixelation really, other than the strict rule of having to C+C because personally i like c+c and all but like give us a break, its an art forum...how about we have some fun. If the person wants c+c give it but dont freak if one person doesnt. these are my views. thanks for you time.
alexander

Offline Rox

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Re: Pixelation Complaints

Reply #8 on: July 31, 2005, 10:01:01 am
I don't think it's harsh at all. I mean, would you want somebody (or in this case, hundreds of somebodies) making useless posts? I say give them a warning, and if they don't comply, give 'em a temp ban. If they come back and make no change, permaban 'em.

It seems like the obvious solution to me...
It's not that simple. It never is. First of all, we never did have hundreds of people all making useless posts. Second, if people did go out of their way and bump, say, half a page worth of old threads (has happened), they'd always recieve a warning, and if they kept it up, a post-count zap or a ban.

So... in actuality, I guess Pixelation always worked like what you're suggesting now, except the temp ban was replaced with a zap.
And you can't disencourage people from giving positive comments. Even if "cool, keep it up" is more worthless than not, it's just something that happens. I know several of my 2000 posts were a lot like that. It's just fun to give a piece of one's mind without having to spend 5 minutes thinking up three paragraphs of critique that might not even matter that much. Trust me when I say that the Pixelation mod crew did a LOT of warning and zapping that other members never got to see.

Offline Peppermint Pig

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Re: Pixelation Complaints

Reply #9 on: July 31, 2005, 10:50:46 am
Just wanted to make some comments about posting:

I don't think it's bad to reply to old posts. Secondly, if someone's posting new material to one of their own posts, and it ages to the point where it falls off the page, I think that double posting is the more responsible action to take, versus creating a new thread that only adds to the 'noise' on a forum.

When we use the term bumping, it takes on a shade of negativity. The general feeling seems to be that if a thread falls off a page, it's obviously done with, and that new posts deserve the attention. But when a forum grows large, there's so much topic movement that it's just a natural part of the chaos that we have to get used to. Granted, a larger forum means more inexperienced artists posting works which, quantatively, means that the forum has less 'good' art, and such people might be better off doing more studying before they post (a more strict/helpful signup quiz could resolve this?).

It sounds like some people are of this mindset: When old posts are getting 'bumped', my posts lose visibility and that takes away from my chances to get a reply. That's more than likely true, but it's also a theoretical perspective of an individual wanting to get their own needs met.

You might want to only give quick praise in a reply. That's great, nobody should dissuade you from posting at all, unless that becomes a habit, because people may tend to ignore that if they see someone who's always praising but never criticizing! It is best to at least try to focus on the ideal of constructive criticism. Good critique is just as challenging as creating good pixel art and it's something to practice at.

When I give more effort into a critique, I am benefitting the forum on the whole:
1. The chances that the artist learns something and improves are increased.
2. The resulting works from that critique are likely to be better, thus we now have better work on the forum by a better artist, who through solid critique has learned how to judge art as well, rather than how to suck up to someone.
3. The quantative value of good art on the forum increases, creating more interest, as well as friendly competition to self-improve.
4. But most importantly, the number of available 'good' artists available to respond to threads is increased, which cuts down on the delay before demand is supplied. We surely can't all be here all the same time to answer someone in need, but at least more people who have benefitted by your wisdom ought to be there.

So, to conclude: Critique isn't ever easy, but whether you feel like giving it or not, it's worth it.