AuthorTopic: Hobby art vs Production art  (Read 8752 times)

Offline Helm

  • Moderator
  • 0110
  • *
  • Posts: 5159
  • Karma: +0/-0
    • View Profile
    • Asides-Bsides

Re: Hobby art vs Production art

Reply #10 on: September 25, 2006, 12:47:10 am
Enichan, first of all, sorry if I offended you. Whereas I didn't mean to, I can see now how my post could do that. Sorry sorry sorry. I am not pushing for any confrontation. My mistake was taking a subtle point you were making and typifying it into a general attitude issue that I've come to dislike on critique fora and wanted to touch upon, making a strawman out of your argument in the process by mistake.  There's no need for that to happen, and there's no need for you to turn right back at me and do the same. I don't think you are arrogant or delusional and I didn't use that sort of terminology, so let's not make something I said into something I didn't, and I'll try to do the same.

Quote
the feeling of awkwardness grates.

Check. I see what you mean now. You say you don't have the time to make things perfect. I don't think there's any way to make anything perfect, but do you have the time to make things better? I think any piece of art posted in pixelation should be edited after posting by the artist at least once or twice (unless stated that the piece will not be altered due to critique) even if the edits take 5 minutes each. If those 5 minutes are out of the question for your time constraints, then that's a pretty harsh situation you've put yourself in, I think. Any piece of commercial art may go through a reasonable amount of revisions, not getting 'every hair perfect' as goat said, but significantly altering a big part of original design to fix errors and up the quality. Even employers will ask you to do this.

Quote
Oh and by the way, several people who've finished art school have told me that the way to improve speed on works is not to keep endlessly refining every picture to make it perfect, it's to do many sketchy things over and over and over and over, until you get faster enough at the basic techniques.

Having gone to an art school, I guess, I can tell you that improving speed is a process of yes, timing yourself and being ready to let go when the timer is out. But I said 'get faster, get better'. There should be a compromise between the two. Nobody is going to care (well, I can think of some developer shacks that will care, but you're best to steer clear of them) if you have become extremely fast, but also extremely messy. A balance is best.

Quote
But if game art isn't welcome to be posted here "for fun" or only to fix more obvious flaws on a piece, rather than out of a drive to perfect every single piece, I'll just keep to myself again. Wasn't aware things changed here. Oh, and if that's true, might want to change the "Pixel Art" forum description: Post your artwork for critique or fun.

Critique can be fun! Heh, I don't see what you're talking about here, really. Pixelation was a few uses, the primary one is for critique. Showcasing can go elsewhere, yeah, but usually it's a mixture of both in any given thread, that's ok.

Quote
It's ironic you'd attack me saying I should be THANKFUL for crits, when I am to the degree of feeling guilty when I DON'T follow up on them in the piece I posted.

Yes, it is ironic, and I didn't mean to put you in that spot. Sorry again.

Offline Frychiko

  • 0010
  • *
  • Posts: 211
  • Karma: +0/-0
  • Don't waste garbage here.
    • View Profile

Re: Hobby art vs Production art

Reply #11 on: September 25, 2006, 06:36:57 am
In reply to doing game art for 'production purposes':

Unfortunately, nobody knows how fast you are and what you are skilled at doing, and there's no way we can know just by looking at your art. In addition, we don't know frame limits for your games (or other limitations - color count etc.), and some people may not be knowledgable about the technicalities of game making. Only you know.

Some people are great at animating flowing smooth hair fast, some are poop slow (like me). Some people have no problem fixing 'odd' pixels, whilst others will say 'fack off' (goat?)

So, all we can do is offer our critique, and it's up to you to decide whether or not it's practical within your timeframe.

I know how you feel about the awkwardness of ignoring comments. As long as you try your best, and let everyone know your comments are appreciated, all's good.

Anyway nice to see you around again~



PS. I am guilty of posting art and then disappearing, boosting my frail ego with 'hey that's cool!' comments.
« Last Edit: September 25, 2006, 06:48:52 am by Frychiko »
Congratulation this story is happy end. Thank you. - Ghost & Goblins

Offline Willows

  • 0010
  • *
  • Posts: 223
  • Karma: +1/-0
    • View Profile

Re: Hobby art vs Production art

Reply #12 on: September 25, 2006, 09:11:07 am
Hah, I'm guilty of that, too, frychiko.

Excuse me for allegedly following the mold you've predicted, but I'm willing to say you can't take criticism "well". Forgive me, please, 'cause I don't hope to piss you off by saying that. All I hope to get across is the idea that if you're personally uneasy because of people's depth in crits, then that'd mean, to me, that you can't take criticism perfectly. That's fine, I don't know of a single person that does.

Mmmmmy strategy in light of crits, though rather imperfect and time-consuming, is to try everything once. I'll ask my friends for comments and criticism, and many of them aren't artists themselves. They'll say things like "I think you should widen the right eye" or something. My brain will go "What the hell? That's stupid!", but I'll try it anyhow, at least in rough rough sketch, just to see if it would actually change for the better. Nine times out of ten their idea is as much a failure as I thought it to be, but that one time out of ten usually teaches me something I'd never have seen myself.

Ha, got a little off-point there. My point is you should, if you have time, "log" any crits, especially repeating ones, and try them either quickly or in your own free time. If it doesn't work for you, and doesn't look better for its extra time, then keep that in mind, and feel justified in "ignoring" crits that ask you to do that thing. There's a chance that it WILL be worth it, in quality-to-time value, but even if it isn't, you at least have the peace of mind to know you tried.

Either that, or learn how to be more of a jerk. I suggest you talk to Goat, and ask him how he manages.

Hey, man, you said it, not me :)

Offline Enichan

  • 0001
  • *
  • Posts: 16
  • Karma: +0/-0
  • Rawr n__n
    • View Profile

Re: Hobby art vs Production art

Reply #13 on: September 29, 2006, 03:08:08 am
Just posting quickly to say I'm sorry about lashing out up there. I was having an absolutely dreadful week, so this thread was actually an attempt at at least alleviating some anxiety by telling my peers about it. So I didn't take Helms post all that well, and I said a bunch of stuff I probably shouldn't have. So, I apologize for that.

After that I just left the forum for a while until things got a little bit sunnier for me, and as I'm posting this I guess things are better enough that I felt up to checking again.

Thanks for the responses, everyone, too. They have been helpful.