AuthorTopic: [WIP] Character Animations (Need Critiques)  (Read 7922 times)

Offline Akhirat

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[WIP] Character Animations (Need Critiques)

on: April 20, 2014, 09:26:20 am
Hello again, everyone.
I had another topic about a fountain in a forest to see if there were any critiques to it, and then i'd put it into my game.
But the thing is, I needed animations for my character before everything. So I stopped making the scenary and I started making the character animations
Now, I need critiques on it. I'm really new to this animation thing, and I really need critiques to get to understand it better, and to make the animation better, too.

Before everything, this is a "2D Up-To-Down" graphics game. I really don't know how to call it, but it's basically RPG Maker's perspective, and it has 8 direction movement with sprites for only 4 directions (I think thats enough sprites)

So, here are my animations:

Ryan Attack Combo [WIP]
This one has 14 frames. 7 for one attack, and 7 for the second combo one.


Ryan Walk To the Right (Sorry for the background. I made this GIF in a program and the opacity was bugging the gif, so I just added a pink background)
Here I used 13 frames. I wanted a smooth walking animation, so I just did this.


Sorry if my english is bad. I'm not a native speaker. And thanks for reading
« Last Edit: April 21, 2014, 02:13:05 am by Akhirat »
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Offline jams0988

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Re: [WIP] Character Animations (Need Critiques)

Reply #1 on: April 20, 2014, 11:48:38 pm
Quote
I really don't know how to call it, but it's basically RPG Maker's Hyper Light Drifter's graphics, and it has 8 direction movement with sprites for only 4 directions (I think thats enough sprites)
Fixed. X'D
Not that being inspired by something is a bad thing, but it might be a little too obvious in this case...
For the attack animation, I can't tell what it is he's doing, sadly. Is that his head down near his stomach? That's what it's reading as, but his sword is above where his head should normally be, so it must be his stomach that's showing, right? You have a blue head with a white headband, and a blue stomach with a white belt, so it's a little hard to tell what's going on with such fast movement. Maybe try a different color for his tunic to fix that? =)

For the walking animation, it looks like his feet are just teleporting around, instead of him walking. I can't get my walk cycle to look correct, either, but a good reference is the Animator's Survival Kit. It has a bunch of basic walk cycles in it. For now, maybe making his back leg darker would make it easier to spot the problems?

Offline Decroded

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Re: [WIP] Character Animations (Need Critiques)

Reply #2 on: April 21, 2014, 01:05:46 am
Timed close to similar thread http://wayofthepixel.net/index.php?topic=16527.0

Anyway the perspective is wrong it looks more like a sidescroller.
Refer to more rpg sprite and see what they do with the feet.

Its weird how he ends the sword animation with sword right up in the air.
Try animating the walk in blocks of colour with no detail (to free you up) and get a good motion before you build up all these details.

Offline Akhirat

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Re: [WIP] Character Animations (Need Critiques)

Reply #3 on: April 21, 2014, 02:08:24 am
Quote
I really don't know how to call it, but it's basically RPG Maker's Hyper Light Drifter's graphics, and it has 8 direction movement with sprites for only 4 directions (I think thats enough sprites)
Fixed. X'D
Not that being inspired by something is a bad thing, but it might be a little too obvious in this case...
For the attack animation, I can't tell what it is he's doing, sadly. Is that his head down near his stomach? That's what it's reading as, but his sword is above where his head should normally be, so it must be his stomach that's showing, right? You have a blue head with a white headband, and a blue stomach with a white belt, so it's a little hard to tell what's going on with such fast movement. Maybe try a different color for his tunic to fix that? =)

For the walking animation, it looks like his feet are just teleporting around, instead of him walking. I can't get my walk cycle to look correct, either, but a good reference is the Animator's Survival Kit. It has a bunch of basic walk cycles in it. For now, maybe making his back leg darker would make it easier to spot the problems?
Timed close to similar thread http://wayofthepixel.net/index.php?topic=16527.0

Anyway the perspective is wrong it looks more like a sidescroller.
Refer to more rpg sprite and see what they do with the feet.

Its weird how he ends the sword animation with sword right up in the air.
Try animating the walk in blocks of colour with no detail (to free you up) and get a good motion before you build up all these details.
Yes, I was inspired by Hyper Light Drifter :p, and I really liked the style and wanted to keep it for my pixel art, but I'm too bad at pixel art yet, so I couldn't make my own style with it...

About the walking animation now. Now that you say it, it really looks strange. I'm gonna try what you said. (and what Decroded said, too).

And the attack animation. It's actually his head going near his stomach, but the color under the head is the pants' color, so it looks strange. I'll try to fix that. And the reason that the second attack stops in mid air is because it isn't finished (as I stated WIP), I'll do another combo finisher next (and probably give more frames to the animation)

About the perspective, now. Is the reason because it looks a sidescroller is because there's no shading at all? And I'll try the idea about making the walk in blocks of colour with no detail. It looks like it's gonna make things easier!
Any hints on how to make the animations/sprites better? (other than chaning the colors)
And should I change the style of the art?
(And it's not a headband. It's actually headphones, haha)

Thanks!
« Last Edit: April 21, 2014, 04:04:42 am by Akhirat »
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Offline Rosier

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Re: [WIP] Character Animations (Need Critiques)

Reply #4 on: April 21, 2014, 02:22:27 am
Timed close to similar thread http://wayofthepixel


Ohaither

But if you want to go HLD inspired, I've learned that a smaller scale wouldn't hurt.  I see the beginning of pretty good animations, but if you want to learn how to improve them, working on smaller animations is far simpler and easier to perfect.

Offline lachrymose

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Re: [WIP] Character Animations (Need Critiques)

Reply #5 on: April 21, 2014, 02:52:28 am
Pretty sure RPG maker uses a top down orthographic projection.
-EDIT-

For some reason I had 2.5D projection in my head. Disregard.
« Last Edit: April 21, 2014, 03:07:47 am by lachrymose »

Offline Akhirat

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Re: [WIP] Character Animations (Need Critiques)

Reply #6 on: April 21, 2014, 03:37:13 am
Pretty sure RPG maker uses a top down orthographic projection.
-EDIT-

For some reason I had 2.5D projection in my head. Disregard.

Haha. I was going to tell you that just now.
Well, thanks for trying to help, at least.


Timed close to similar thread http://wayofthepixel


Ohaither

But if you want to go HLD inspired, I've learned that a smaller scale wouldn't hurt.  I see the beginning of pretty good animations, but if you want to learn how to improve them, working on smaller animations is far simpler and easier to perfect.

Can you give me an example of scale size? Thanks.


Timed close to similar thread http://wayofthepixel.net/index.php?topic=16527.0

Anyway the perspective is wrong it looks more like a sidescroller.
Refer to more rpg sprite and see what they do with the feet.

Its weird how he ends the sword animation with sword right up in the air.
Try animating the walk in blocks of colour with no detail (to free you up) and get a good motion before you build up all these details.

Quote
I really don't know how to call it, but it's basically RPG Maker's Hyper Light Drifter's graphics, and it has 8 direction movement with sprites for only 4 directions (I think thats enough sprites)
Fixed. X'D
Not that being inspired by something is a bad thing, but it might be a little too obvious in this case...
For the attack animation, I can't tell what it is he's doing, sadly. Is that his head down near his stomach? That's what it's reading as, but his sword is above where his head should normally be, so it must be his stomach that's showing, right? You have a blue head with a white headband, and a blue stomach with a white belt, so it's a little hard to tell what's going on with such fast movement. Maybe try a different color for his tunic to fix that? =)

For the walking animation, it looks like his feet are just teleporting around, instead of him walking. I can't get my walk cycle to look correct, either, but a good reference is the Animator's Survival Kit. It has a bunch of basic walk cycles in it. For now, maybe making his back leg darker would make it easier to spot the problems?
I took a screenshot from in-game, to show how the perspective is for now (please don't mind the background, I just put some objects there to test them)


Is it really that strange? I really thought it was natural..
Anyways, what can I do to make the perspective look better, then? (I'm working on the walking animation and sword animation already, too)
Thanks!
- "Dreams are what keeps us awake"

Offline Rosier

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Re: [WIP] Character Animations (Need Critiques)

Reply #7 on: April 21, 2014, 04:08:53 am
The one facing the right (The bottom right one) should have the body more facing the side.  Right now it looks like he's showing his torso to the screen while his head is facing the side.

As for size, look at the videos and weapon animations.  The one you have should look a bit more like that. Try shrinking your animations by half, then improving them before doubling their size again.

Offline Decroded

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Re: [WIP] Character Animations (Need Critiques)

Reply #8 on: April 21, 2014, 05:13:29 am
And the attack animation. It's actually his head going near his stomach, but the color under the head is the pants' color, so it looks strange. I'll try to fix that. And the reason that the second attack stops in mid air is because it isn't finished (as I stated WIP), I'll do another combo finisher next (and probably give more frames to the animation)
Oh lol ok.
I'm having trouble reading what he is doing at that point there's lots of black stuff up the top which looks like it shouldn't be there.
Its also confusing to just replace the blue head with similar shaped black stuff then just slam the head down very quickly like that.
Does he switch from two handed to single handed for the second attack?


Perspective of feet is where you should start.
They shouldn't line up with each other horizontally.
Study some references as suggested.

Offline Akhirat

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Re: [WIP] Character Animations (Need Critiques)

Reply #9 on: April 21, 2014, 06:01:30 am
And the attack animation. It's actually his head going near his stomach, but the color under the head is the pants' color, so it looks strange. I'll try to fix that. And the reason that the second attack stops in mid air is because it isn't finished (as I stated WIP), I'll do another combo finisher next (and probably give more frames to the animation)
Oh lol ok.
I'm having trouble reading what he is doing at that point there's lots of black stuff up the top which looks like it shouldn't be there.
Its also confusing to just replace the blue head with similar shaped black stuff then just slam the head down very quickly like that.
Does he switch from two handed to single handed for the second attack?


Perspective of feet is where you should start.
They shouldn't line up with each other horizontally.
Study some references as suggested.

He's actually one handed in both attacks, but I didn't put to show the second hand. And the "black stuff", is his "coat", it's pretty hard to manage a coat, but I'll try to fix the wrong allignments. I'm working on the sword animation now.
And, here's my new walk animation. I tried to fix the perspective, as everyone said! And I'm really thankful for all your attention.



The one facing the right (The bottom right one) should have the body more facing the side.  Right now it looks like he's showing his torso to the screen while his head is facing the side.

As for size, look at the videos and weapon animations.  The one you have should look a bit more like that. Try shrinking your animations by half, then improving them before doubling their size again.

I really didn't understand much about the scale you said. But I think I shortened the horizontal/width(?) scale in this new sprite I created. Is it better?


Is the perspective right, now? And what else should I fix?
Thanks!
(Working on the sword animation now, as I said!)
- "Dreams are what keeps us awake"

Offline Rosier

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Re: [WIP] Character Animations (Need Critiques)

Reply #10 on: April 21, 2014, 06:31:55 am


I really didn't understand much about the scale you said. But I think I shortened the horizontal/width(?) scale in this new sprite I created. Is it better?


Is the perspective right, now? And what else should I fix?
Thanks!
(Working on the sword animation now, as I said!)

Walk - He looks a bit chubby/blocky and the legs are a bit wonky, but it's definitely an improvement.
Scale -   I made my animations at this size, then made them twice as big to show everyone.  It's easier to make it like this, and makes the final product a bit less inconsistent.  Every 1 pixel in the small one equals 4 in the bigger version, but yours has a bit of extra ones.
Perspective - Definitely better, but he's a bit blocky again.  Also, it's a rule I totally made up, but the arms should be distinct from the cloak.  Otherwise they look like blobs rather than limbs.

Offline Akhirat

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Re: [WIP] Character Animations (Need Critiques)

Reply #11 on: April 21, 2014, 06:39:36 am


I really didn't understand much about the scale you said. But I think I shortened the horizontal/width(?) scale in this new sprite I created. Is it better?


Is the perspective right, now? And what else should I fix?
Thanks!
(Working on the sword animation now, as I said!)

Walk - He looks a bit chubby/blocky and the legs are a bit wonky, but it's definitely an improvement.
Scale -   I made my animations at this size, then made them twice as big to show everyone.  It's easier to make it like this, and makes the final product a bit less inconsistent.  Every 1 pixel in the small one equals 4 in the bigger version, but yours has a bit of extra ones.
Perspective - Definitely better, but he's a bit blocky again.  Also, it's a rule I totally made up, but the arms should be distinct from the cloak.  Otherwise they look like blobs rather than limbs.

Ah, I get it about the scales.
Edit: Sorry, forget what I said here. I'm tired and I didn't read 'Walk' :p
Soon uploading new animation and sprite.
« Last Edit: April 21, 2014, 06:54:56 am by Akhirat »
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Offline Decroded

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Re: [WIP] Character Animations (Need Critiques)

Reply #12 on: April 21, 2014, 06:56:01 am
Is the perspective right, now? And what else should I fix?
I'm not that into HLD style but here's a quick edit without changing much:

The main point is the feet.

Offline Akhirat

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Re: [WIP] Character Animations (Need Critiques)

Reply #13 on: April 21, 2014, 07:25:36 am
Is the perspective right, now? And what else should I fix?
I'm not that into HLD style but here's a quick edit without changing much:

The main point is the feet.


I really didn't understand much about the scale you said. But I think I shortened the horizontal/width(?) scale in this new sprite I created. Is it better?


Is the perspective right, now? And what else should I fix?
Thanks!
(Working on the sword animation now, as I said!)

Walk - He looks a bit chubby/blocky and the legs are a bit wonky, but it's definitely an improvement.
Scale -   I made my animations at this size, then made them twice as big to show everyone.  It's easier to make it like this, and makes the final product a bit less inconsistent.  Every 1 pixel in the small one equals 4 in the bigger version, but yours has a bit of extra ones.
Perspective - Definitely better, but he's a bit blocky again.  Also, it's a rule I totally made up, but the arms should be distinct from the cloak.  Otherwise they look like blobs rather than limbs.

Ah, I get it about the scales.
Edit: Sorry, forget what I said here. I'm tired and I didn't read 'Walk' :p
Soon uploading new animation and sprite.

Thanks for the hint!
I tried to give perspective to the stand now, and tried to fix blocky parts and wonky legs on the walk animation.

Stand Sprite Without Perspective (Before)


Stand Sprite With Perspective (After)


Walk Animation


Any hints on how to make it better? Or should we pass to the next trial of animations: The Up & Down Walk Animations?
Or maybe both? :p
Thanks!
- "Dreams are what keeps us awake"

Offline Decroded

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Re: [WIP] Character Animations (Need Critiques)

Reply #14 on: April 21, 2014, 07:31:59 am
Idle perspective is fixed.

If I were you I would trash that walking/running animation and start again.
Consider the perspective, block in basic shapes, forget about the cape until you have some decent motion, then start worrying about details.
Leave the cape until the end or it will dominate your workflow, let its motion flow from the character's movement.

Offline Akhirat

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Re: [WIP] Character Animations (Need Critiques)

Reply #15 on: April 21, 2014, 08:32:14 am
Idle perspective is fixed.

If I were you I would trash that walking/running animation and start again.
Consider the perspective, block in basic shapes, forget about the cape until you have some decent motion, then start worrying about details.
Leave the cape until the end or it will dominate your workflow, let its motion flow from the character's movement.

Right. Tried that and here's the result. (Please don't look at the cape yet, I didn't give attention to it (and I wont until the end))
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Offline Decroded

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Re: [WIP] Character Animations (Need Critiques)

Reply #16 on: April 21, 2014, 10:12:02 am
I think you should start with a skeleton and build your animation off that.

Offline Akhirat

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Re: [WIP] Character Animations (Need Critiques)

Reply #17 on: April 21, 2014, 05:47:05 pm
I think you should start with a skeleton and build your animation off that.
I tried that. It didn't work so well. I don't know how to make the skeleton, or draw over it later.
Last time I tried that, the skeleton was too small to fit anything, so I had to draw over it.

Edit: Tried again. Here is the result:
« Last Edit: April 21, 2014, 07:56:24 pm by Akhirat »
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Offline SharpKing

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Re: [WIP] Character Animations (Need Critiques)

Reply #18 on: April 21, 2014, 11:06:13 pm
For me, part of the problem with your run animation is that his feet seem to disappear off the bottom of the frame.  There is no sense of ground.  The eyes want to follow the feet all the way through the cycle and I can't do that here.

Offline Rosier

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Re: [WIP] Character Animations (Need Critiques)

Reply #19 on: April 21, 2014, 11:30:37 pm
I would look more closely at the actual HLD run animations.  Check the Kickstarter page and look for it.

Offline hobbler_toppler

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Re: [WIP] Character Animations (Need Critiques)

Reply #20 on: April 23, 2014, 05:29:17 pm
I think you should start with a skeleton and build your animation off that.
I tried that. It didn't work so well. I don't know how to make the skeleton, or draw over it later.
Last time I tried that, the skeleton was too small to fit anything, so I had to draw over it.

Edit: Tried again. Here is the result:


Hello. I actually think this is a very decent run animation, but it is more suited to 2d/platformer style. As I was reading through the thread the first thing I noticed about your runcycle was the lack of vertical movement, making the character seem as though he/she were gliding over the ground like a ghost. It's good that you managed to catch that issue on your own.

I'm not very good at 2.5d art. I just thought I'd give you some encouragement. Keep it up!

Offline Akhirat

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Re: [WIP] Character Animations (Need Critiques)

Reply #21 on: April 26, 2014, 03:31:15 am
Sorry for late response. I was really busy this week.
So, how do I make it, then? I made the second feet (with the lighter shade) 3 pixels under the darker one. So I thought I made the perspective right.
What can I do to fix it? I get that I don't have sense of ground, but I don't know how... "have it".

Thanks!
- "Dreams are what keeps us awake"

Offline Lanarky

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Re: [WIP] Character Animations (Need Critiques)

Reply #22 on: April 26, 2014, 05:10:31 am
Here's one of the best walking tutorials I have found, it's made by Ptoing.  :y:

Offline Akhirat

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Re: [WIP] Character Animations (Need Critiques)

Reply #24 on: April 26, 2014, 06:22:18 am
https://s3.amazonaws.com/ksr/assets/000/899/899/e05c1db2fd5f0f4133084b18f37f08e7_large.gif?1378652027

If you want to emulate the style, might as well look at this as well.
Here's one of the best walking tutorials I have found, it's made by Ptoing.  :y:


I think now I understand the problem I had. Thanks! I'll try and post as soon as possible.
- "Dreams are what keeps us awake"