AuthorTopic: [WIP] Another portrait (nudity)  (Read 5865 times)

Offline Zizka

  • 0010
  • *
  • Posts: 464
  • Karma: +0/-0
  • Keep on smilin'
    • View Profile

Re: [WIP] Another portrait (nudity)

Reply #20 on: January 05, 2014, 11:54:12 pm
Well, there's no doubt your version looks better.

I'm finding it difficult to choose the right color. I see a color but I have trouble to identify which one it is when it comes to reproducing it. Hopefully this is something which gets better as you constantly observe things.

I'll still work on it, but I'm taking a little break from it.

Offline Zizka

  • 0010
  • *
  • Posts: 464
  • Karma: +0/-0
  • Keep on smilin'
    • View Profile

Re: [WIP] Another portrait (nudity)

Reply #21 on: February 15, 2014, 06:25:45 pm
Sheeeeeeeeee’s back.

So I decided to follow up to Facet’s advice and go back to drawing from life. I have some serious shortcomings when it comes to create stuff so practice will do me a world of good.

List of changes this time around:
- Lowered her left boob by quite a few pixels.
- Removed some of the border on the left side.
- Made the hair thicker in some areas.
- Tried to curve her left arm further (ParkerBaby)
- Messed about with the lights/shadows on the breasts.
- Reshaped her right breast to make it bulge more towards the bottom (ParkerBaby)
- Messed with the nose further (using ParkerBaby’s edit as a reference)


 
I have a couple of questions for this version.
#1: On my picture, the distance of her but to the side of the canvas is about right. If you look at the reference picture, you’ll see the extremity of the butt is more or less aligned with the left shoulder. On my picture though, the shoulder is really far from the side of the canvas. Why is that?
#2: Is dithering the only way to make the transition from the various colors on the breast more harmonious? I don’t like the way it looks right now.

Offline Kcilc

  • 0010
  • *
  • Posts: 217
  • Karma: +2/-0
    • View Profile

Re: [WIP] Another portrait (nudity)

Reply #22 on: February 16, 2014, 02:13:32 am
Her shoulders are too small compared to her head according to the reference. That's why it's not exact right now. Maybe a gif will help!



As for the dithering, I would suggest not taking that route. While it can look good if you put enough time into it, it really has diminishing returns. I'd say just add some more shades if you think it's not smooth enough. However, keep adjusting your placement first—see if you can't make it work without dithering or more colors. It's really surprising how much difference a little (or a lot since you've been working on this piece for a while) tinkering can make.

I case you want to try dithering anyway, I think it usually works best if you pick a direction you want your dithering to go. Don't dither all four sides of a color, and try to keep to the grid. I'm not all that good at dithering myself however, so it certainly won't hurt to play around with what you think might look better.
Here's a quick example:



Also, I don't know if you've been doing this already, but mirror your piece and reference and work from that perspective sometimes. It'll really really really help with correcting her proportions.

Offline Zizka

  • 0010
  • *
  • Posts: 464
  • Karma: +0/-0
  • Keep on smilin'
    • View Profile

Re: [WIP] Another portrait (nudity)

Reply #23 on: February 17, 2014, 02:24:57 am
So I stuck to v. 13 this time around because admittedly I didn’t change much the previous time (sorry about that). It’s because I had some questions.
So, here’s a list of new changes for this time around.
So after reading “Kilc” I made a few more modifications.
- Considerably shortened the neck.
- Messed about in the neck, some major problems there.
- Redid the mouth entirely. The colors were off and so was the shape of the mouth.
- Slightly widened the width of the face.
- Tweaked the eyes some more.
- Tweaked some shadows here and there. Especially on her chest.
- Further modified the color of the nipples
- Added some more shades for the transition between the shades on the breasts to be smoother.
- Reshaped her butt entirely. Was waaay too big before.
- Made her left shoulder bigger.
There are still some issues with her stomach however.
I think I’m going in the right direction but it’s still messy in the current state. I won’t give up though.

v. 13v.14

Went back to those 1 pixel outline... I keep them then I remove them... Can't find a good middle ground. Looks off without and off with.

Offline r1k

  • 0010
  • *
  • Posts: 270
  • Karma: +0/-0
    • View Profile

Re: [WIP] Another portrait (nudity)

Reply #24 on: February 17, 2014, 05:29:05 am
mostly a face edit.  The features are basically in the right places.  You made the shape of the face too round though.  And youre showing the face too much from the front, should be turned slightly to one side.  Shape of mouth is off, and you could darker the shadow areas more.  looking at it now, you could also make the width of the hair on the left side smaller.



also I noticed the shape of the breast on our right is off.  see here



whats the middle ground between 1 pixel outlines and no outlines?  AA the outlines so they blend more with the surrounding shadow.

also, the areola isnt flat, is curving with the breast, so a little shading will help it.

you also have alot of contrast on the shading of her stomach.  but in the ref the shadow is basically pretty solid, with some subtle darker spots.  I tried to make the shadow more unified there in my edit.


EDIT:

I was thinking it might help you more to show you whats wrong with the mouth:



so I just traced a higher res version of your ref, then blew up your mouth and traced it and put it on top.  You can see clearly the difference in shape.  Now the challenge is how to translate that shape into a smaller number of pixels.  Of course it wont be perfect but it can still be closer than what you have now.  Hope this makes it clearer.
« Last Edit: February 17, 2014, 08:51:21 pm by r1k »

Offline Facet

  • 0010
  • *
  • Posts: 425
  • Karma: +3/-0
    • View Profile

Re: [WIP] Another portrait (nudity)

Reply #25 on: February 19, 2014, 02:28:18 am
So I decided to follow up to Facet’s advice and go back to drawing from life. I have some serious shortcomings when it comes to create stuff so practice will do me a world of good.

I feel like I have to clear up that this is actually what I was trying to advise against (in a previous thread) for a couple of major reasons, them being: this isn’t from life(?) and detailing, making alterations to existing work surely can’t help with process? I might’ve jumped the gun talking about constructive stuff there anyway ‘cos it’s dependent on observational stuff that you are working on.

Quote
I want the final version to be super realistic.
     
A few people have asked why you wouldn't just trace some of this kind of stuff if you’re not really aiming at much interpretation; a lot of the crit you've received (like just now) is via direct comparison/sampling/overlay and really you shouldn't need a lot of that done on your behalf; the source is the solution.

You’ve deflected tracing as being ‘cheating’, but what skill is it that you’re cheating yourself out of? It’s basically shape recognition; learning to see past semiotic value (what you know the image to represent) and instead as the pattern of coloured shapes that it is.

Putting the right patch of colour in the right place is clearly a lot harder than it sounds but rationalising like that (along with working big to small), might allow you to stop getting hung up throughout on very specific and situational problems like the following:

Quote
On my picture, the distance of her but to the side of the canvas is about right. If you look at the reference picture, you’ll see the extremity of the butt is more or less aligned with the left shoulder. On my picture though, the shoulder is really far from the side of the canvas. Why is that?

All the answers to those kinds of issues lie in measuring and comparison whether it’s physically doing so or conceptually (by eye), and actually this isn't the kind of stuff that benefits much from a lot of forum nit-picking to achieve some polished work if the goal is to build skill; it’s a case of personal study and a lot of repetition.
« Last Edit: February 20, 2014, 02:43:51 am by Facet »