Restoring the former glory of Pixelation!

[Seiseki]

So, having looked a bit at the stats on the bottom of the page, it seems like there's a steady decline in recent years.
I thought that the rise of indie games like Minecraft would have more of an effect, but I guess most of those guys go to tigs or PJ.

I doubt we could actually reach the former "glory days", which seems to be in 2007-2008.
But it would still be nice to boost the stats a bit, especially the amount of replies which are at an all-time low. So threads are still being made, but they're not getting much attention.

I think the first thing needed is to bring back the old skin! The forums lack the former serious/slightly intimidating aura that the skin brought.
The current skin is just so uninspiring, I can promise that there will be a stats boost when the new skin is implemented.

I also think we need more activities, the Totem pole was really fun and a nice initiative, but it didn't get any closure?
I'd love to start an activity thread, but I'd have to do some planning first.

Tile-based collaborations haven't been done in years it seems, would be awesome to have a new one of those.

[Corinthian Baby]

I'd like to see some more commercial critiques. I know I have some ideas for some. Or more stuff like Helm's cluster study from Altered Beast, which was awesome.

[PixelPiledriver]

the Totem pole was really fun and a nice initiative, but it didn't get any closure?

I apologize for that.
Just a case of bad timing for me.

[Seiseki]

the Totem pole was really fun and a nice initiative, but it didn't get any closure?

I apologize for that.
Just a case of bad timing for me.

Yeah no problem, it's was awesome anyways.
We just need more people to start activities.

I was actually thinking, since collaborations are quite popular.
What if someone would code a forum script, allowing people to select a tile and upload an image (or enter an address for remote hosted).
The tile would appear as 'reserved by <username>' and only that user could upload a tile in that place.
An overlapping tile system could be used for isometric.

I'm wondering what a coder would charge to develop something like that.
If people here are interested we could try some kind of donation drive to get a system like that in place.

I'd also be willing to pay someone just to get the forum skin in place

[Crow]

I'm wondering what a coder would charge to develop something like that.

Nothing, as I am the one coding here, and I could see myself implementing something similar in the future I do have some nifty plans for the forums, and ptoing is working on the skin, or so I hope. So far, I've done some talking with him, and I still need to talk with the others about my ideas and plans. Don't expect any miracles, though. I'm also quite busy myself, and big changes can take a while.

[Ryumaru]

I really enjoyed commercial critiques and the activities that coincided with them. It would be especially cool to take one game that was well received in it's time with mostly subpar graphics, and  have an activity where it's spruced up.



I might just be looking for an excuse to revamp pokemon red/blue.

[Crow]

I might just be looking for an excuse to revamp pokemon red/blue.

My god, I was thinking Pokemon Red/Blue when I read that last sentence of your first paragraph.

[Seiseki]

I might just be looking for an excuse to revamp pokemon red/blue.

My god, I was thinking Pokemon Red/Blue when I read that last sentence of your first paragraph.

That would be awesome in so many ways!

I'm wondering what a coder would charge to develop something like that.

Nothing, as I am the one coding here, and I could see myself implementing something similar in the future I do have some nifty plans for the forums, and ptoing is working on the skin, or so I hope. So far, I've done some talking with him, and I still need to talk with the others about my ideas and plans. Don't expect any miracles, though. I'm also quite busy myself, and big changes can take a while.

That would awesome. But I'd still be willing to pay for it and I'm sure others would too..

Which reminds me, wasn't there a donation button?
Would be cool if you could donate and receive a forum badge or something for a limited time, how is the forum funded by the way?

[Carnivac]

I doubt we could actually reach the former "glory days", which seems to be in 2007-2008.

I consider the 'glory days' to be way before then.  Perhaps around 2003 or 2004 back on the old blue and black site with the bruce lee banner.  But that may just be when I was more heavily into it all.  Perhaps one was a golden age and one a silver? 

And oh god I just felt so old then realising the era I mention is about a decade ago now... argh...

[Seiseki]

Woha, the stats do not go that far back..
And no wonder they were glory days, when the gameboy advance was the current gen handheld.
Not much going on for indies and the pc market though..

Haha, oh man..

Most Online:1626 - August 29, 2008, 05:22:34 am
Online Today:60

[Carnivac]

I doube the stats could go far that back.  I'm sure it was a different site back then.  Different address, different host, but still Pixelation.

[Helm]

The biggest thing with Pixelation slowness is that the mods are growing up and all have to deal with life. I can't pressure Ptoing or anyone else to finish up the skin when I barely have time to create new challenges and do critique myself. We add new people to the moderation team every once in a while hoping that the new blood will push the place and that does happen for a while but it doesn't seem to be enough.

For me the staple of what Pixelation's doing is on the critique board, when people ask for help and they get it. The rest is community building. I realize it's the community building that gets more people here, though.

[Corinthian Baby]

I was thinking of red and blue when I made my first post. Even back in 09 I wanted to take a look at how the pokemon style has evolved. Especially with new res and tech they've maintained that blocky look with some success over the years.

[ptoing]

The stats go as far back as Pixelopolis, after the hack/dataloss of the blue forum.

There is a skin which is quite far done already, but I need to make some more art for it and Crow needs to do more on it as well, but as Helm said, I do not have as much time as I used to anymore. But it will happen, eventually.

[tim]

I would like to be involved also.

As you may have seen, I have some free time and I would like a lot to help developping the community and making this forum more active.
Are we allowed to create participative topics like the totem one if we're not part of the moderation team ? What prevents us from creating
contests ? "Let's revamp Pokemon Red" / "Imagine a pixel art version of Abe's Odyssee" / "Reinvent 3D modern games you love in 2D pixel art".

There is so much potential.

[0xDB]

Maybe the Challenges & Activities board could be split into an official and an in-official board where members could create their own activities and challenges. It would be kind of self-regulated, interesting challenges would automagically bubble up to the top via user participation and the ones which aren't getting any attention... well... they'd just not get any. 

[Pix3M]

I would like to be involved also.

As you may have seen, I have some free time and I would like a lot to help developping the community and making this forum more active.
Are we allowed to create participative topics like the totem one if we're not part of the moderation team ? What prevents us from creating
contests ? "Let's revamp Pokemon Red" / "Imagine a pixel art version of Abe's Odyssee" / "Reinvent 3D modern games you love in 2D pixel art".

There is so much potential.

Contests. I support this notion. 

[Crow]

Idea: if you want to do activities, throw me a PM. If they're good/acceptable, you can do them. Not too many at once, so I'll regulate them. I'm assuming that's okay with the other members of the staff. If there's anything wrong with that, tell me please. I'd really like to see some activity in the activity forum though

[Dusty]

I really do miss the commercial critiques. Something about picking apart graphics we all know(and maybe love), and getting an insight into them and the thought process behind the pixels.

[Azuyre]

I would definitely be interested in doing some of the activities you guys have mentioned. Revamping the graphics of an old game seems like a pretty cool idea, Arne just did that with SML and it came out really well.

I've been coming here for a long time to read up on critiques and tips on pixel art in general, but I never got around to starting an account until while after the site changed to this basic theme. I really liked the old one though, are you guys planning anything similar for the new skin or is it going to be something completely new?

[Seiseki]

I'm sure we could crowd source the skin design if lack of time is an issue..
Would it be possible to add the skin in it's current state to the forums as a beta-skin you can select in settings?

[Crow]

Would it be possible to add the skin in it's current state to the forums as a beta-skin you can select in settings?

Nope.

[Ryumaru]

I might just be looking for an excuse to revamp pokemon red/blue.

My god, I was thinking Pokemon Red/Blue when I read that last sentence of your first paragraph.

I could start work on a pokemon commercial critique if you think there is enough interest.

[Helm]

The only way to get things moving is to do stuff, not deliberate it! Make the cc and if it flies, it flies, if it flops, it flops   

[Cure]

I could start work on a pokemon commercial critique if you think there is enough interest.

Yes please. That's the game that got me started pixelling. Custom Pokemon sprites are already 50% of all pixel art on the Internet so I'm sure the interest is there.

I wouldn't mind editing Blaine into something intelligible either.

[Ryumaru]

The only way to get things moving is to do stuff, not deliberate it! Make the cc and if it flies, it flies, if it flops, it flops   

Will do, boss! Also doing some video recordings of me remodeling the pokecenter C: full of minutes struggling with pixel clusters and readability while trying to hold charm, representation, and honor of the source material.

[PypeBros]

I'm pretty sure "junkboy's demake dump" (http://www.wayofthepixel.net/index.php?topic=10694.msg113560#msg113560) had drawn significant amount of visitors here. Of course, wotp's motto may not be to turn into a gallery, but some extra visibility wouldn't hurt, right ?

Maybe we could pick some of our favourite threads/posts (that is, those we admire, not necessarily those we're proud of) and promote them on our blogs/twitters/social network ... a #wayofthepixel friday evening, anyone ?

[Ryumaru]

PypeBros: I think utilizing social media would be great, for things such as commercial critique and activities, and just in general; no reason not to keep up with the times!

I've made a first draft of the pokemon commercial critique thread here in general discussion will work on the activity thread soon.

[Arne]

I was briefly thinking of doing a Pokémon (R/B) hack now when I have developed a tool for GB stuff. The original sprites were a bit quirky, but they actually kind of fixed them in later versions, and there are tons of hacks for Pokémon already, so I just dropped the thought.

I think the Commercial Critiques(/praise) are interesting and they're probably easy to post and manage for the organizer as well (s/he can just post a title and some links to screenshots periodically).

A larger community project has awkward quality control authority problems and has to face eventually failing/awol components. Otherwise, I think it would be fun to do a community game project since graphical tasks can often be parallized and eventually synchronized (moreso than programming stuff at least).

[Seiseki]

If we're making a community built hack for Pokemon R/B, then I'd be fine with any of the old pixel gurus here making the decision on what would go into the game and what wouldn't.

[Crow]

If we're making a community built hack for Pokemon R/B, then I'd be fine with any of the old pixel gurus here making the decision on what would go into the game and what wouldn't.

Rather, let the community decide~

[AzKai]

I didn't get to read everyone's replies so sorry if some of this is repeated information.

I'm actually new here! I just started pixel art two years ago and about a year in, someone told me there were two websites to go and get critique at so I could get better. First, they told me about Pixel Joint--and I quote: "You can try pixeljoint.com. They have a lot of people and activity over there but take everything they say with a grain of salt. A lot of them are elitists and they don't take kindly to newbies posting stuff." The second (and again I quote): "And than there's Way of the Pixel. It's not as active but the people there are really nice so as long as you can get someone to reply I'm sure you'll get lots of helpful critique!"

So, that is how I was introduced to each site 

I do agree with what someone brought up earlier: I didn't remember this site as much because the site itself is so bland looking. (The skin, I mean.) PJ is already very intimidating because of my introduction to it, but their black skin with a front page full of pixel art a lot better than mine was even more intimidating! It made me remember it, for better or worse.

It could be because I'm a web developer by trade, but, I do think I'd have remembered this site a lot more had it not been a default forums template.

Another thing that might be helpful is a forum area to introduce yourself. I just found this site again last night and I felt weird just posting out of no where... but there was no where to introduce myself! I did notice that a lot of people actually do say "I've been lurking and decided to post..." Maybe we can get some more of those lurkers out if we made them introduce themselves!

Those are a few ideas. By the way--hello! My name is Kai! Thanks for having me

[Arne]

It's not really practical to do a PKMN hack as much of the relevant graphical data is compressed and require rare expertise. Putting new gfx into the game will potentially overwrite old data since compressed data is variable in length. This require that the injector knows how to manipulate pointers and is intimate with the memory map structure of the game.

Also, such a hack wouldn't really accomplish anything which hasn't already been accomplished by others or the sequels/remakes themselves. The NPC and map tile data is simple and not terrible interesting to edit, and then there's the larger still illustrations which hinge primarily on illustration/drawing skill and much less on pixel optimization skill.

It would probably be more interesting to do something like a platformer (e.g. "Pixelation Worlds") where each participant gets to make his own world (i.e. graphical bank) and these worlds are connected Metroidvania or Contra style (sort of like how the... patchwork collabs here worked).  I feel it would give more useful practice as the author has to deal with atmospheric backgrounds, enemy and character animation sets, explosion effects and other generic stuff. There wouldn't need to be any theme, as it would probably be more fun if it was a mishmach of styles/self-imposed restrictions.

I'm not ready to code such a thing though, and I fear people would start requesting features that I can't implement. This could be avoided by keeping the contributions at a strict image level (even the map data and local physics and character dimensions). Maybe doable if kept simple, as a fun thing. Could also be used as a testing ground for people's own projects (testing tiling, run anims and such)

[Mr. Fahrenheit]

Another thing that might be helpful is a forum area to introduce yourself. I just found this site again last night and I felt weird just posting out of no where... but there was no where to introduce myself! I did notice that a lot of people actually do say "I've been lurking and decided to post..." Maybe we can get some more of those lurkers out if we made them introduce themselves!

I guess you missed this thread http://www.wayofthepixel.net/index.php?topic=6976.0

[Seiseki]

Another thing that might be helpful is a forum area to introduce yourself. I just found this site again last night and I felt weird just posting out of no where... but there was no where to introduce myself! I did notice that a lot of people actually do say "I've been lurking and decided to post..." Maybe we can get some more of those lurkers out if we made them introduce themselves!

I guess you missed this thread http://www.wayofthepixel.net/index.php?topic=6976.0

I did too, for like the first year I was here..
Would probably be better if it was here in the general board?

[Dusty]

I'm pretty sure "junkboy's demake dump" (http://www.wayofthepixel.net/index.php?topic=10694.msg113560#msg113560) had drawn significant amount of visitors here.

That had more to do with Notch tweeting(or did he blog it?) that he hired junkboy, and linking to that thread. He basically Colbert bumped it with his millions of followers.

[tyrannotorus]

The biggest thing with Pixelation slowness is that the mods are growing up and all have to deal with life..... We add new people to the moderation team every once in a while hoping that the new blood will push the place ...

^This definitely. We're all old now! Need new blood to get involved. Young bloooood....

As well, I agree (with almost everyone) that the forum needs a Pixel-themed skin. Is this even a skin we're using? When I came back, I thought this was a temporary skin implemented after another board crash. We used to have different pixeled "Pixelation" headers to the forum - Bruce Lee being the most famously remembered.

That could be the first collaboration to spice things up - accepting submissions for a rotating set of Pixelation headers for the forum.

[Mathias]

I'd love to see a Pix revival. Whatever creates momentum and I can help - let me know and perhaps I can lend a helping hand.

[Ambivorous]

I'll be honest, I never bother with introduction threads any more, but hi, I'm Ambivorous.

I didn't know this was a thing until I read in adcrusher's X-Ninja thread that some kind of revival was going on.
To get the obligatory things out of the way: I can program some and did web design for a few years - a lot of which was personalising forum software (mostly phpBB), so creating themes and adding little programs that automate collab creations would be right down my alley. That said, I'm sure there are others who could do better and are all ready part of your dev team.

Now to help with ideas.
When I first came here three years ago you guys had a pretty, pixel theme and those pictures at the top with links to impressive works and collabs really dragged me in. Then I got to looking at the most impressive works on these forums (from feature chest, etc.) and it inspired me greatly do get my pixel on. Then I started viewing other threads of works I found very appealing and finally I created an account and posted a work of my own.
And theeeennnn I didn't get a response for 5 or 6 days so I got kind of over it, sadly. Then I didn't really come around for 2 years.

So, assuming I am your average Joe visitor, I'd say more competitions, a pixelly theme and continued assistance in that pixel art forum should be enough (all things all ready mentioned, I'm just confirming they worked/would have worked on past-me).

That said, I'll start helping out on more topics to do my part.
Though to be honest, I am still very much learning myself, so I feel quite insecure about my suggestions sometimes.

[yaomon17]

What I think would really help is to get word of the activities out on places with larger communities. Say something like this guy:
http://johanvinet.tumblr.com/ does.

[Seiseki]

Maybe we could always have the last 5 activity banners on display? If they're closed down we could add "CLOSED" somewhere in the banner.
That way there would always be stuff you could check out as a new member or someone passing through.

[Ambivorous]

Any body for an RP section?
I'm sure there are a lot of creative ways of using pixel art inside some sort of role play. That should have the appeal of having lots of art in one place and keeping members active.

Why (and the pokemon critique thread is obviously to blame for this idea) we could have a pokemon RP where we all design our trainer sprites and accompanying pokemon. We could also do an RPG character from the Final Fantasy series or some such and role play them. The possibilities are endless! 

Use it, don't use it.

[Seiseki]

By the way, looking at the stats, it seems like they've gone up a bit since this topic was started.

I still think we should have more banners up there, for previous activities too!
Everyone likes banners and it makes the forum seem more alive with stuff going on
It's also nice seeing some art up there, which compensates for the lack of a skin a bit.

[Helm]

The pokemens threads are wonderful. Good job for everyone involved and extra thanks to Ryu for the initiative and work. Just seeing actual header images in the top right corner makes me happy. We need to get trucking on other fronts too.

[Cyangmou]

I am just curious if there were already demake-challenges or activities.
It could be a fun approach for a group of people to capture a well designed 3D style with 2D graphics and trying to build a mockup once there are some graphics.

[Seiseki]

A de-make thread would be awesome..

Dark souls seems to be pretty popular
Pretty tough to work with though, but I can't think of any popular games that have a really unique style.

I'd personally want to do a League of Legends de-make thread. Not sure how popular it would be, but I play League a lot so it would be fun.
Portal de-make could also be fun.

[Batzy]

A de-make thread would be awesome..
I'd personally want to do a League of Legends de-make thread. Not sure how popular it would be, but I play League a lot so it would be fun.

YEESSS! got my vote.

funny that we have pokémon threads going on right now as i happen to be in army doing mah conscription now and we count days we have left like original pokémons here.... 

[Helm]

De-make thread sounds good.

[Carnivac]

Demake sounds fine but not when restricting it to just one particular game/series.   Never even heard of league of legends.

[Seiseki]

Demake sounds fine but not when restricting it to just one particular game/series.   Never even heard of league of legends.

It's what the youngsters play these days, when they're not playing call of duty or listening to skrillex.

I think there's room for more than one de-make thread. A specific thread would be a larger project while a generic thread could be used for mockups.

But it's easier to get the ball rolling around one game or a theme and I like League of Legends since it has a wide array of characters to pick from.

[Cyangmou]

I personally think the interesting part about de-making is to try if a style and feeling can be brought down to a few pixels.
The Dark Souls style was pretty interesting because it's working with real proportions and lots of small details which aren't easy to translate to pixels. and it also needed a lot of version to get something acceptable. I am not sure though if anybody recognizes the sprite now as "Dark Souls" if it's without context. I fear that it also could be just read as a generic dark knight.

I think De-Making works best with established main-characters

I made an experiment quite a while ago where the subject was "Metroid Prime". I started with the Prequel "Super Metroid" which was my reference and I used the designs and the mood of Metroid Prime. The bad thing is that I weren't able to do more than a single sprite so far.


design ref: http://images2.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20100215035740/metroid/images/5/58/Mprime_07_big.jpg


The hard part of de-making something which hasn't a 2D preqel is that the gameplay of the 2D version also has to be envisioned before starting. The part of analizing the earlier 2D graphics and applying principles to new stuff won't happen - but I think from the educational side this is also pretty interesting. And it's cool to work with concept art which is intended fo rsomething completely different too.

LoL might be popular, but I personally never played it- from what I know it lacks a strong main character (there are dozens of heros), it has no 2D prequels and the environment is also very generic. I don't know about their concept art, they have digital paintings for each character, but I haven't seen turnaround drawings or environment concept art so far.

For a group activity it might be more successful to choose one single game and we try as a group collaboration to come up with at least one mockup - this wouldn't be that much work for everybody and we could analyze every aspect in a group too. 

Just my 2 cents

[Carnivac]

I think I may prefer remakes to demakes really.  Particularly remakes of old games that perhaps don't have a completely established style and environment like most modern games do due to the limitations of hardware of that time and it's up to the artist to come up with a style that they feel suits their own interpretation of it.   I'd like to see varying takes on character sprites (not just the done-to-death famous characters but perhaps lesser known ones from people's own personal favorites).   That's why I liked that Pixel Joint challenge back in 2007 where I did a mock up game shot remaking the old 8-bit game Werewolves of London I enjoyed playing from my own childhood and gave it a whole new look but still keeping with the basic gameplay style and theme of the werewolf in london (making it look more London-like, for one).

[Phlakes]

De-Making...

I made an experiment quite a while ago where the subject was "Metroid Prime". I started with the Prequel "Super Metroid" which was my reference and I used the designs and the mood of Metroid Prime. The bad thing is that I weren't able to do more than a single sprite so far.

Relevant. Although it's been 99% dead for a couple years.

[Argyle]

I've just not had a chance to be active beyond lurking once-a-week due to working on pixel art freelance work for clients. Keeps happening that before I get to finish the entire project for one, another job presents itself (heck, sometimes several!) and it's a game of catch up bounce tag.

I was able to get this work due to lurking here, getting critique on the forums/irc/doing challenges and improving from the whelpling I once was a few years back. So, in essence, my lack of activity here is directly related to the effectiveness of this pixel art community. I haven't even had a chance to properly update my portfolio thread or website with even mildly recent stuff due to always having freelance work to take care of first.

So I guess "thanks, hope to be back" and "sheesh get off my back" both fit the bill. You lovely jerks.

[Diggyspiff]

Heya,

I know I'm new here and all but this seems like a neat project getting some action recently. Would be cool to see some more people contributing little bits and helping refine what is already there.  It also encourages cross community action which I think is a cool idea.

http://www.wayofthepixel.net/index.php?topic=15462.0

Take care,

Diggy