AuthorTopic: [WIP] Partisan Tactics Battles : Animations, woah  (Read 211543 times)

Offline ndchristie

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Re: [WIP] Partisan Tactics Battles : Animations, woah

Reply #550 on: May 24, 2008, 12:38:25 pm
One last thing though, a lance is more likely used to swing with.

All the crits are good but a lance is a defensive thrusting weapon first and foremost and is often merely positioned and braced against a charging enemy.  I'm not sure what lances you've been using.....but there's a reason we differentiate between these and other bladed/spiked weapons (like hammers, halberds, etc).
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Offline Sabata

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Re: [WIP] Partisan Tactics Battles : Animations, woah

Reply #551 on: May 24, 2008, 02:38:38 pm
Well, I agree that a lance is mostly used against charging enemy, but this all depends on the weapon we are talking about, Chinese spear for example is made more for swing attacks while European mediaval spears were mostly to stab.

As for attacking, is you want a stab animation for a spear you should make the character to advance forward whit his front leg, leaning his body forward as well.... his legs position would look a little like kiba-dachi on karate.

Offline TrevoriuS

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Re: [WIP] Partisan Tactics Battles : Animations, woah

Reply #552 on: May 24, 2008, 04:49:41 pm
One last thing though, a lance is more likely used to swing with.

All the crits are good but a lance is a defensive thrusting weapon first and foremost and is often merely positioned and braced against a charging enemy.  I'm not sure what lances you've been using.....but there's a reason we differentiate between these and other bladed/spiked weapons (like hammers, halberds, etc).

If you ride a horse with a lance, you wont get the time to swing so then yes, you stab and hope you hit.
If you stand in a massive battle with good armor, you can stab enemies that are not paying attention to you in particular, if you're less well armed you'd rather wound everyone around you instead of specifically kill one man so the others may hit through your defense.
If you stand in a one on one battle you get one chance to stab. If you don't kill your opponent there, he'll probably evade the lance and encounter you so close that you'd be off best if you throw the lance away and continue with the knuckles. If you DO stab the opponent but only wound him, it would've been better to swing your lance as it theatens more (keep enemy at distance) en has a greater impact due to speed.

Whe n carrying a lance, fight defensive, and only stab to kill.

Offline ndchristie

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Re: [WIP] Partisan Tactics Battles : Animations, woah

Reply #553 on: May 24, 2008, 11:33:43 pm
One last thing though, a lance is more likely used to swing with.

All the crits are good but a lance is a defensive thrusting weapon first and foremost and is often merely positioned and braced against a charging enemy.  I'm not sure what lances you've been using.....but there's a reason we differentiate between these and other bladed/spiked weapons (like hammers, halberds, etc).

If you ride a horse with a lance, you wont get the time to swing so then yes, you stab and hope you hit.
If you stand in a massive battle with good armor, you can stab enemies that are not paying attention to you in particular, if you're less well armed you'd rather wound everyone around you instead of specifically kill one man so the others may hit through your defense.
If you stand in a one on one battle you get one chance to stab. If you don't kill your opponent there, he'll probably evade the lance and encounter you so close that you'd be off best if you throw the lance away and continue with the knuckles. If you DO stab the opponent but only wound him, it would've been better to swing your lance as it theatens more (keep enemy at distance) en has a greater impact due to speed.

Whe n carrying a lance, fight defensive, and only stab to kill.

that all *sounds* great, but you need to do some research - what on earth are you basing this on?? - the European spear is a stabbing weapon, period.  history has a way of proving what works and what doesn't :).  things like halberds became a popular alternative because you could bring it down with force, offering a distinct advantage over normal spear weapons if you could pass Point.  Even so, side-side swinging of long pole weapons has never been a european thing (unless you count the ancient bulgarians and other steppe peoples, who probably picked it up from Tang merchants).

The european lance (and any other "true" spear) has a relatively small head, and it is not a good blade.  swinging it would only allow the wielder to lose control over it's one real benefit - the point. 

As far as the scenario where you fight one-on-one, yeah, you're right, you wouldn't bring a ten-foot weapon to the fight, lances are used to destroy slow-moving (or slow-turning) targets such as cavalry and other heavy infantry.  A swordsman or even a billman would, in open ground, quickly advance past Point and destroy his target (yet another reason spear ranks were often supplemented by skirmishers and swordsmen - they would keep infantry away while the pikes protected them from enemy horse.  As far as dropping the spear, this they also did when speed and mobility were with the enemy - they drew swords, in the same way that archers dropped bows, gunner dropped guns, and cavalry discarded lances as well, all for swords.

http://www.anselm.edu/academic/history/hdubrulle/WarandRevolution/graphics/Paintings%202004/mil%20rev%20pikeman.jpg

http://www.anselm.edu/academic/history/hdubrulle/WarandRevolution/graphics/Paintings%202004/mil%20rev%20arquebusier%205.jpg

http://exileonthewing.files.wordpress.com/2007/10/archer.thumbnail.jpg

http://www.allthequeensmen.com/images/vf2.jpg


As for the asian stuff mentioned, i know that games tend to be pro japanese fighting styles, and we have our assassin classes that use ninja stuff (to pander to that audience), but the majority of the game is european.

truly the footing would depend on the context, stepping back for a counter and forward for, well, an advance....but he can step back without adding frames so I think that will be the decision.
« Last Edit: May 24, 2008, 11:43:29 pm by ndchristie »
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Offline zuloon

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Re: [WIP] Partisan Tactics Battles : NPA CHAOS!!

Reply #554 on: May 25, 2008, 02:07:57 am
Theres a big clash in terms of level of detail between portrait and sprite. Almost like putting a stick figure next to a photo. I'd suggest simplifying the portrait to cartoony or anime.




I agree 100%.

Offline Sherman Gill

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Re: [WIP] Partisan Tactics Battles : Animations, woah

Reply #555 on: May 25, 2008, 02:23:03 am
I disagree 100%.
Oh yes naked women are beautiful
But I like shrimps more haha ;)

Offline ndchristie

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Re: [WIP] Partisan Tactics Battles : Animations, woah

Reply #556 on: May 25, 2008, 02:38:27 am
A mistake is a mistake.
The same mistake twice is a bad habit.
The same mistake three or more times is a motif.

Offline Anything!

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Re: [WIP] Partisan Tactics Battles : Animations, woah

Reply #557 on: May 25, 2008, 04:09:52 am
I agree with neither... or both. Whichever one.

While I do believe the style of the portrait would, ideally, be best if it matched the style of the sprite. But realism-- It would be very yummy in this.

Offline TrevoriuS

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Re: [WIP] Partisan Tactics Battles : Animations, woah

Reply #558 on: May 25, 2008, 06:54:12 am
Go for realistic and detailed. Let's explain the why with an example. While playing starcraft I (or seeing trailers of II), you will see the cool, broadly muscled, tattooed, foul mouthed, cigarette(?spelling) smoking marine. While in fact you don't see that reflected in the sprite. You DO see it in cutscenes and conceptart, these two give you the feel of what you're playing with, even though the actual thing is far less detailed. So the point is, if you add details to the large portrait of the character, you can show what he is like, in a detailed way that can not be done in-game.

Offline fil_razorback

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Re: [WIP] Partisan Tactics Battles : Animations, woah

Reply #559 on: May 25, 2008, 10:28:50 am
zuloon + following >> We've never been going for that style of portraits you quoted. As far as I remember it's something which randomly popped in the discussion.