AuthorTopic: Payment  (Read 17539 times)

Offline ptoing

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Re: Payment

Reply #10 on: December 17, 2010, 10:54:36 pm
Thing with tiles is that you do not need 100% unique tiles as such.

What I mean by this is that you need you need tiles which transit from dirt to grass for example. and if you already have a grass and a dirt tile doing some grass/dirt mix tiles will be pretty fast usually.

And depending how pure pixelart you want to go you can do stuff very fast if you play if a bit loose.



These are 5 64x64 floor/ceiling tiles for Doom I made for a level I am working on when I got the time.
Anyway, the tiles on the far left and right were existing tiles from Doom and the 3 inbetween are simply blended using a function in Promotion and then cleaned up a tiny bit. This would work reasonably well in a grid based stategy game, if you want to have clear borders for each tile.
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Offline Osteel

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Re: Payment

Reply #11 on: December 17, 2010, 11:28:17 pm
Yeah I understand what you mean, meshing to form the variants needed for the ground. However within this ~200 tile list, there are also objects needed which will probably be very unique from one another. But with what you guys have said, I'm surprised at how short the time estimates are!

Offline DaCarterMan

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Re: Payment

Reply #12 on: March 01, 2011, 12:13:34 am
Dont mean to hijack your thread but how long do you estimate it should take to make 40 - 50 tiles, not all unique?  It probably differs on style in which it is a cartoon-like style.

Offline Geti

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Re: Payment

Reply #13 on: March 02, 2011, 01:45:45 am
1 week tops, Could be done easily in 2 days full time or 4 days part time, especially if  "cartoony" and therefore low colour count, where you can just focus on getting the form described and each cluster as beautiful as possible.

Offline big brother

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Re: Payment

Reply #14 on: March 02, 2011, 05:25:32 pm
How can you assert your estimation so confidently without even knowing how big the tiles are? They can be done "easily" AND "as beautiful as possible?"

It seems like a lot of artists/clients forget about the revision process. Most producers double the time of an artist's estimate to account for this, since even good artists rarely nail exactly what the client wants on the first try.



Offline Lizzrd

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Re: Payment

Reply #15 on: March 02, 2011, 07:19:54 pm
It depends a lot on style, size and most importantly the artist.
Not everyone has the same workpace.
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Offline Helm

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Re: Payment

Reply #16 on: March 02, 2011, 07:46:05 pm
Yes, it is prudent to not calculate final times based on how much time you spent pixelling tiles for your own projects. I'm not saying that's what Geti did above, but just in case. When you draw something for yourself you're faster because there's no misconception as to what you're trying to do. With a client, there might be many revision cycles.

Offline Atnas

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Re: Payment

Reply #17 on: March 02, 2011, 08:10:03 pm
Very much so. My first few jobs, I wound up completely underestimating the revision process. Thankfully I had an understanding client who adjusted the price based on my new time rather than my uninformed estimation. It's more economic, I think, to give the artist one assignment to begin with, for both of you to get a proper idea of how long it will take.

Also, not all freelancers can work full time, so what is a 2 week job for some full time freelancers may double if they have another job or school to balance. I think Geti's original 1 week estimation for 50 tiles is more realistic than 2 days, however it really should be said that at least another half week is the safest timeframe imo. This is coming from a relative beginner, I am sure that ptoing could get it done in two and a half days. But work speed is VERY variable, and I doubt I would be able to do 2.5 original tiles per hour (more like 1.5), and full time is also not an option for me.

Offline Geti

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Re: Payment

Reply #18 on: March 02, 2011, 09:10:37 pm
How can you assert your estimation so confidently without even knowing how big the tiles are? They can be done "easily" AND "as beautiful as possible?"
By assuming the worst case scenario (32x32, few recolours) and making a realistic estimation from there.

Cartoon styled tiles are excellent to work quickly on because you can block out a large chunk of the tileset in one go (say, all the tiles for a grassy area), quickly outline and two-tone shade any required forms (for our example, rocks sticking out of the ground, larger clumps of grass, some larger stone blocks and bushes, etc etc) so you can build a small mockup using all required tiles. From there it's easy to pick what forms don't work and where more variation is needed. From 1-2 hours work, you've then got a rough draft you can send to the client, and while you're waiting for feedback you can start on another part of the tileset.

The only thing that would make that take longer than a week is if he required some larger objects with various facing directions to match the tiles, or animation in some of them.

I can't work full time either (full time uni student), but I can draft ~8 original 32x32 tiles in an hour and polish them in 3, so I suppose I'm just under the 2.5/hr level. For smaller tiles (What I'm better at) I expect that count could be quite a bit higher than 2.5/hr though.

Getting feedback before you've done the hard yards (optimising those clusters, tweaking colours, etc etc) lets you cut down on wasted pixelling time a lot, so I think 1 week is reasonable for 50 tiles with some copypaste variation tiles, but because of possible revision issues I'd quote a longer time to a new client to give myself some breathing space.
If I was working with someone I had experience with (and therefore knew more accurately what they wanted) I'd give them a less lenient time frame.

It's all pretty context sensitive, but from what I've heard from DaCarterMan in a Personal Message just now I wouldn't have been too far off the mark with his requirements.

Offline CodeGeorge

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Re: Payment

Reply #19 on: March 02, 2011, 09:48:54 pm
I'm really questioning what people are saying here.  I'd challenge anyone to make like 8 freakin' great quality unique tiles that work seemlessly with all past present and future tiles. 

I can easily spend hours on just a few tiles to make 'em really pop. 

Granted if it's really toony it would not take nearly as long but in order to put out a really good tree or other objects and have great diversity you've gotta spend a heck of a lot more time on them then these people are saying.  At least I do.  I'd wonder what quality of tile would go out at a rate of 8 per hour quiet honestly...


I'd usually charge probably $5-10 per unique tile mattering on style.  If it's super cartoony or simple less (like NES style or Zelda grass).
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