AuthorTopic: Burned Grass  (Read 12622 times)

Offline Jorund

  • 0001
  • *
  • Posts: 87
  • Karma: +0/-0
    • View Profile

Burned Grass

on: March 08, 2010, 05:15:01 pm
I have to make a burned grass tile for a friends game (128x128), since he needs it soon, I'm not going to work with pure pixel (I'm still learning).
He told me: "I need black burned grass" So I search some images in google:
http://img13.imageshack.us/img13/3392/copyof13072resize.jpg
http://img192.imageshack.us/img192/7803/copyof1820534ee639a9abr.jpg
http://img651.imageshack.us/img651/9897/copyof6262541550x550mba.jpg
http://img294.imageshack.us/img294/9110/copyofburnedgrass1resiz.jpg
http://img52.imageshack.us/img52/6262/copyofprairiegrassresiz.jpg

This is what I got for the moment:

I don't know I thinks is waaaaaaaay too dark, but the one that he showed me (and wanted redone because it was an edit from another game), was also really dark.

I don't know how to make it better. Its just a noise effect with some tweaking and texture.

Any help will be much appreciated  :)
« Last Edit: April 07, 2010, 02:28:27 pm by Jorund »

Offline Lizzrd

  • 0010
  • *
  • Posts: 273
  • Karma: +0/-0
    • View Profile

Re: Burned Grass

Reply #1 on: March 08, 2010, 07:13:41 pm
Have it more in clusters with black soil showing between.
Photocopier: the fact that arne can also code so well
Photocopier: is horrificly unfair

Offline Jad

  • 0100
  • ***
  • Posts: 1048
  • Karma: +0/-0
    • View Profile

Re: Burned Grass

Reply #2 on: March 11, 2010, 11:43:25 pm
remove the green, it's not needed - just keep it black with the grass displayed as ashy gray strands and possibly add some green tint in some of the value ranges.

That's all I've got for now!
' _ '

Offline Jorund

  • 0001
  • *
  • Posts: 87
  • Karma: +0/-0
    • View Profile

Re: Burned Grass

Reply #3 on: March 12, 2010, 01:28:09 pm
I completly changed it. No black. At least not that much. I'm gonna use black/brown for the path and other details.
Here's the new version. Its more of a grass ashes tile. Made it with some grass photo, and some tweaking and some brushes:


It tiles pretty well:
http://img133.imageshack.us/img133/75/75677324yth.gif
« Last Edit: March 15, 2010, 03:39:25 am by Jorund »

Offline Jorund

  • 0001
  • *
  • Posts: 87
  • Karma: +0/-0
    • View Profile

Re: Burned Grass

Reply #4 on: March 15, 2010, 03:44:50 am
Now, I need to do something similar to this (but with my tile):

This one was made out of this tile:


Does anyone know how to do that? I thought it was just some kind of bevel and emboss effect done with Photoshop, but it's not, since that effect doesnt deformed the image just adds shadows and highlights.
I don't know... maybe I'll just try to create that effect manually deforming the tile :sigh:... but it's gonna take time, and I don't think its gonna look nice.

Any ideas will be appreciated.  :)

Offline EyeCraft

  • 0011
  • **
  • Posts: 597
  • Karma: +2/-0
  • What are you scared of?
    • View Profile
    • Death By Dev

Re: Burned Grass

Reply #5 on: March 15, 2010, 05:35:21 am
It looks like a high poly 3d render to me. The sides look like they're normal-mapped a little.

To get that effect I would make a high poly plane in a 3d app, then start sculpting it... maybe even try zbrush, create a normal map, then do an orthographic render of it with the lightsource pretty much where the camera is, actually a tad below the camera.

Offline G_Dragon

  • 0001
  • *
  • Posts: 54
  • Karma: +0/-0
    • View Profile

Re: Burned Grass

Reply #6 on: March 16, 2010, 02:23:14 am
Alright, quickly mocked up how they could have done it.



If you use Blender, here's the blend file.
http://indreams-studios.com/g_dragon/tiles.blend

Offline Jorund

  • 0001
  • *
  • Posts: 87
  • Karma: +0/-0
    • View Profile

Re: Burned Grass

Reply #7 on: March 16, 2010, 02:59:07 am
Thanks a lot to both of you!

Today I being trying ZBrush, watching a looooooooot of tutorials, got a headache, then another one. There's still some things, that I think it should be easy to find in Zbrush. but... I... just... CAN'T! (When I stop editing/sculping and go back to the other -don't remember the name- mode, then I can't return to continue sculping the other "object". I'm always creating a new one from the last one i made and continue sculping it. // Now I'm getting some problems with masks (actually mask related), when I finish creating the mask (which I don't understand why I can make a square selection from outside the object, but not from inside) and want to start sculping, it mades me create a PolyMesh3D, and by doing that i lose the mask)

Enough with the ramble!

So, this is what I got so far:


It's reaaaaally messy. I don't know how should I set the mesh in ZBrush, so that when I import it with Photoshop I don't have to make it bigger.
There where other things, like:
- Lighting: don't know how to set it. The light appears to change when i rotate the model. I know there is a Light option, but it isn't changing anything.
- Exporting Object: when i export this:

I got this in PS (the mesh without the colors, maybe also without the material, I really can't tell, should try with some strange material so I could notice if there's any difference):

So to make it work I put the tiles in a layer on top of that in Color Dodge Mode, and erase everything, except for the elevations.

Ok. So again... thanks a lot for the idea!  ;D
Even though I didn't finish with it and it took me the whole day, I'm really happy that I finally give a 3d program some consideration :). The last time I downloaded Blender, I open it, created a sphere, look at it for a while and thought: nah, too complicated.

Tomorrow, I'll try Blender. Now it's too late, I don't even want to see that GUI again before going to sleep.
I just hope I'll have a dream in 2D.  :D

Offline EyeCraft

  • 0011
  • **
  • Posts: 597
  • Karma: +2/-0
  • What are you scared of?
    • View Profile
    • Death By Dev

Re: Burned Grass

Reply #8 on: March 17, 2010, 01:34:28 am
Yeah I wouldn't try just working in ZBrush. I see it more as a detail program than a full 3d suite. My recommendation would be to sculpt in Zbrush, then export the mesh and import it into something like Blender or Max, and use that program to set up your lighting, camera and materials, then render an orthographic projection. Those programs will give you much more parameters for defining how large you want the render image to be, etc.

Then just open the render in photoshop and tweak and perfect it.  :)

Offline Jorund

  • 0001
  • *
  • Posts: 87
  • Karma: +0/-0
    • View Profile

Re: Burned Grass

Reply #9 on: March 18, 2010, 12:55:50 pm
I end up doing everything in Blender, with the help of the file that G Dragon posted. Thanks again :)
This is what i got at the end:

Offline Jad

  • 0100
  • ***
  • Posts: 1048
  • Karma: +0/-0
    • View Profile

Re: Burned Grass

Reply #10 on: March 19, 2010, 01:10:12 pm
I hate not having the knowledge enough to be constructive but:

It really looks like a perfectly smooth surface, plastic, even, surface with a grass texture imprinted upon it.

Which is what it is - so it makes sense. Now the problem is that I can't offer you help on how to avoid that so I'll just say: are you content with it?
' _ '

Offline Jorund

  • 0001
  • *
  • Posts: 87
  • Karma: +0/-0
    • View Profile

Re: Burned Grass

Reply #11 on: March 19, 2010, 01:17:44 pm
Which is what it is - so it makes sense. Now the problem is that I can't offer you help on how to avoid that so I'll just say: are you content with it?
Not really, but the other grass tile had a very similar effect and I needed as soon as possible. Maybe when I have a better control over Blender (ZBrush or Maya), I'll make it better. For now this will do.
I actually don't like having this "half" done, but the person who ask me for it needed right away. I told him, if I learned how to make it better I'll change it, but it's just for me :P

Offline Pawige

  • 0010
  • *
  • Posts: 293
  • Karma: +0/-0
    • View Profile
    • The Noisy Sanctum

Re: Burned Grass

Reply #12 on: March 19, 2010, 05:38:26 pm
It looks like you would probably just be able to dial down your specular highlights and it would remove almost all of the plastic look.

Kerpow! http://wiki.blender.org/index.php/Doc:Manual/Materials/Properties/Specular_Shaders

Offline G_Dragon

  • 0001
  • *
  • Posts: 54
  • Karma: +0/-0
    • View Profile

Re: Burned Grass

Reply #13 on: March 20, 2010, 06:18:48 am
Jorund. Sorry, forgot to take the specularity out. Just go to the material settings for the object and find the specularity slider. Turn spec to 0.

Offline ndchristie

  • 0100
  • ***
  • Posts: 2426
  • Karma: +2/-0
    • View Profile

Re: Burned Grass

Reply #14 on: March 20, 2010, 03:35:43 pm
Quote
It really looks like a perfectly smooth surface, plastic, even, surface with a grass texture imprinted upon it.

What are you using this for?  A lot of this would easily be solved with a normal map if you have the ability to apply one...
A mistake is a mistake.
The same mistake twice is a bad habit.
The same mistake three or more times is a motif.

Offline Jorund

  • 0001
  • *
  • Posts: 87
  • Karma: +0/-0
    • View Profile

Re: Burned Grass

Reply #15 on: March 20, 2010, 05:57:48 pm
Sorry again! I've founded the Specular setting and changed it in the one that I posted earlier. But I didn't removed it.
This one is with 0 Specular and a little adjustment on the light direction:


What are you using this for?  A lot of this would easily be solved with a normal map if you have the ability to apply one...
Is for a 2D game written in VBasic, I think. Don't know what you mean with normal map, sorry :(
I was asked to do a similar effect of the normal grass tile, but with the burned grass I did.

Offline G_Dragon

  • 0001
  • *
  • Posts: 54
  • Karma: +0/-0
    • View Profile

Re: Burned Grass

Reply #16 on: March 20, 2010, 09:08:37 pm

http://indreams-studios.com/g_dragon/tiles.zip

Few modifications to my original file-
-Better texture system. Now any signs of tiling should be harder to notice. Also, specular maps and normal maps are quasi-automatically generated. If you want sharper/ higher contrast highlights and bumpiness, then go to the colour ramps in the texture node window (top rightish) And play with the position of the makers on the colour ramp. If you want to change the texture too, then there's a texture node in the same window. Everything else should work perfectly if you don't change the base mesh.
- Finding the specularity slider should be easier to find. Feel free to turn it to 0 or whatever works.
- The mesh now has a displacement map. In other words, the mesh is also bumpy. You can change it in the mesh edit menu.
- The scene supports "linear workflow". In other words, when the scene renders, the scene will be really dark then it'll lighten up at the last moment. That is normal.
- If you change the camera angle, then do this.
    1- Make sure the mesh is selected and clear the scale (alt+s)
    2- Pull out a scientific calculator. Plug in this formula- (1/sin(cameraangle))*meshscale
        - If you didn't scale the mesh, then ignore the *meshscale
        - If you want the camera to use the typical pixel isometric camera angle, then you'll need to clear the rotation on the camera (alt+r) rotate the camera 90 degrees on the x axis (r x 90) then pull out the scientific calculator and plug in atan(0.5) and go back to blender and rotate the camera again without clearing the rotation (r x - then the number). After that, scale the mesh's y axis with this formula (1/sin(90-atan(0.5)))*meshscale.
    3- Scale the y axis with the calculator's output (s y then the number)

Hopefully that all makes sense and works for you.

Offline Jorund

  • 0001
  • *
  • Posts: 87
  • Karma: +0/-0
    • View Profile

Re: Burned Grass

Reply #17 on: March 30, 2010, 05:55:43 pm
I forgot to tell you G Dragon. The blend file you gave me work perfectly! Thanks a lot again :D

I end up using this:


Then with a little bit of edit in PS I made them tileable with the rest of the thing I had.
But really, it was great. I didn't even know Blender could create tiles based on an image.

Thanks again!  :)

Offline G_Dragon

  • 0001
  • *
  • Posts: 54
  • Karma: +0/-0
    • View Profile

Re: Burned Grass

Reply #18 on: March 31, 2010, 01:45:00 am
No problem, glad I could help.