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Messages - Doppleganger
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261
Pixel Art / Re: [WIP] Starting From Step One
« on: March 17, 2007, 03:13:01 am »
I, for one, find this topic rather interesting. And by for one, I mean for many, because it's blatantly obvious that this is "thee" topic.

While my say probably doesn't mean much, I'm going to practice my rights as an american citizen and say that this topic has become incredibly pointless. It has been reduced to back and forth nitpicky arguments due, simply, to arrogance.

There's no real reason that a below average building should warrant 60 posts unless that person, of course, is seeking help and reposting revisions very often. But no, there's none of that going on here. This topic should probably be locked or moved to general discussion with the new title "Hawk is arrogant and lacks experience". Which is what this topic has diminished to.

I think by now Hawk, hopefully, has an idea of the way things work around here and if he decides to stay and interact the way everybody else does, he should start a new topic and do things the way they ought to be done. Post some work worthy of critiquing and then take those critiques into consideration.

This is a rather mature community with highly talented artists Hawk, and if you can't accept those facts then it's not worth your time to be here.

While this topic was quite amusing originally, I think that it's just getting to be out of control now.

262


Those were some pretty fun lines Serena. I almost took on one of Surt's dragons until I saw this one. I'm stuck cropping over 100+ doll articles I did so this was a fun intermission.

263
Pixel Art / Re: Rainy Pathway
« on: March 15, 2007, 07:22:37 pm »
Fry: Thanks!

JJ Naas: That's originally what I had thought, when I tried it it got rather busy rather quickly. Which is how I came to the conclusion that less is more. Given the small space that the water takes up you can't really give off the impression of clouds reflected upon it. Well, you could but, it'd take a fair amount of colors with shades very close to the water's base colors. Else it wouldn't be subtle enough. Given this piece's very nice and complete feeling palette more colors would only hurt it.

264
Pixel Art / Re: Rainy Pathway
« on: March 15, 2007, 07:05:48 pm »


I took a stab at the water aspect. I think in this case, less is more...or however the saying goes...more is less? Anyways, since you're right, there is little for the water to reflect I simply reflected the stones where they meet the water. I put in some browns slightly darker than the water in the water to give the illusion there are bricks underneath which gives the water some sort of substance rather than a flat plane. Although it still looks like the water is just a flat plane it also looks as detailed as the rest.

Edit: I realize now that the water is meant to be over the stones where I have shaded it to be below them. Which is a bit easier. With that being said, it is unnatural for puddles of water to collect on generally flat ground so that is probably where half the trouble is coming from, it's just not something we're used to seeing in a natural environment.

265
Pixel Art / Re: Rainy Pathway
« on: March 15, 2007, 06:31:20 pm »
That's a nice edit on the stones Fry. I think the water kind of looks like a simplified different colored version of the stones now though. Perhaps some brighter highlights and a glossier feel would help that out. Maybe the issues is that the water has some heavy shadows outlining parts of it.

266
Pixel Art / Re: [WIP] Starting From Step One
« on: March 15, 2007, 05:30:43 pm »
Kind of off topic but you say we can expect something of similar quality to your avatar but, what do you base that on other than it being something you're striving for? Your avatar has over 9100 colors in it. Judging from the responses you're getting, your color use is already a bit overboard. Point being, I don't personally see your tower turning into a realistic building based on your other works and it's current state and I don't understand why you'd opt to use pixel art when the graphical style you're going for uses 9100 colors.

267
Pixel Art / Re: RPG tileset mock-up
« on: March 15, 2007, 04:39:08 pm »
Apparently, this is a Tsugumo redeux funfest! I too did an edit after seeing Helm's post. I'll agree with him indefinitely on his comments.

As someone who started off pixeling by reading your tutorials and as someone who saw your mage knight dump and was in awe at your skills I was a bit surprised to see that this was done by you. I know how making pixel art as a profession affects how you do it professionally and your tileset reflects that. The difference in my tilesets I do professionally versus the ones I do as a hobby are quite evident. When somebody is paying you 20+ dollars an hour to do something you tend to want to get it done quickly and efficiently rather than beautifully and timey. Fortunately for me I am impatient and am usually able to find a balance between time and beauty. With tilesets that is. I've done countless amounts of them and they're the reason I was able to make it as a freelancer for the past year and a half. Once again, your tutorials played a part in my skills.

The main problems I noticed with the tileset were; lack of unity, sketchy/unreadable objects, and glaring dirt and grass tiles.

I did enjoy the fall version best so I took a stab at redoing that one. The first thing I did was redo the dirt/sand tile. It tiled rather poorly and had too much contrast for the huge expanse it covered. As Helm said, it's better to go with several variations, which is something I normally do. If I'm doing 16x16 tiles I'll usually make one 32x32 tile for tiles that cover large areas. In tradition of old school RPGs and in fairness to you I went with one tile though. Whether or not it was meant to be sand I couldn't very well tell so I went with more dirt like colors.

Next up was the bush. It looked like a grainy square shaped blob to me. I'm not sure how many colors were in it but it felt like too many for it's size. I reduced it down to 5 and focused on details that stood out rather than numerous details. Which I feel is where the granularity came from most likely.

The grass, I feel, suffered most by the choice of colors. While it's cool to hue shift and all that jazz, grass usually isn't the place to do it. The blue stood out too much against the greens and overpowered the whole thing. Originally I tried to recreate your texture in a less contrasty way but, it's just not my style so I went with my traditional method of drawing in blades with the darkest color, thinning them out with the midrange color and then use highlights to break up any tiling. It's an enduring process that usually has me going back and forth between steps but it works fairly well every time. I don't have much else to say on this other than most of the dirt/sand comments apply here.

Finally, there is the tree. Basically your "shortcut" butchered any hopes the tree may have had. It certainly works best in the fall colors but the other color sets create an undistinguishable mass. The lighting, while making sense is too sporadic to lead the eyes to believe that it's where it's supposed to be. The vines blend in too much to be seen as vines and look more like sketchy protrusions. I did like the trunk and I would've left it except I wanted to maintain the sense of style I had "created" up to this point. There's not much to say as to what I did. I basically took the silhouette of the tree and took the time to shade the whole thing rather than stamping it. I have no doubt that this is something you could achieve had you took the time to do so.

The whole image uses 20 colors, as opposed to 38 was it? I managed to get rather low because I shared the paltette between things. I know that's usually a bad thing when making tilesets or any other game art because you can't easily change a certain aspect if you need to but, since it's for hobby reasons and you have ultimate control, there is more lenience. I tried to maintain your sense of saturation and desaturation while creating more fall like colors that worked together. I feel that it turned out fairly well.

I think that pretty much covers everything I wanted to cover. I usually don't go so indepth with critiques but I felt that this was probably a once in a lifetime opportunity and as someone who looks up to you in some way shape or form, it'd nice to hear your thoughts on my thoughts. Haha... K enough of that.




268
General Discussion / Re: Goblins Of The Game Industry
« on: March 10, 2007, 09:32:39 pm »
Quote
Working on titles you like, or titles that you are proud of is a rarity, for the above reasons. Freelancers and in-house artists have little or no input in what titles they work on or indeed the design of the title itself. Unless you are working for a small company and you are part of the start-up team that is.

I agree with that whole-heartedly. I've freelanced for about 2 years now and your input varies entirely on who it is you're working for. While I've had the fortune of working for smaller development groups and company's starting up for the most part, there are also the gigs that place as you a small aspect of a larger scheme. Here, you rarely have a say and have to match several artists work. You probably will get placed in an area where you have the most experience but don't necessarily like to do what it is you're good at. Making tiles, usually, in my case. Making quality pieces that tile is a rather difficult ordeal and since I've spent so much time in the past on them, it's my specialty in situations where there are several places I could be used. I don't particularly like making loads of tiles though. The point here is, the more ornate a project the less chance there is that you'll have a say in it or be happy doing it. And with ornate projects comes higher pay, so you are basically sacrificing freedom in exchange for money. That's a drab way to look at it, but it's kind of the way it goes.

If you're lucky enough to strike a good deal with a company that's just starting up, you'll certainly have a lot more say and room for advancement. The pay might not be as great as it could be with a bigger company but, if you're lucky you can find something that can pay you close to what you could be making. Companies like these are not without their problems either though. The afore mentioned obviously, and then there are a few other things. The main thing I've noticed amongst small companies or indy developers is that usually it's just one person doing all of the artwork. And if you're working for them it's probably you. Haha, of course! With that being said, you may find your self with an exorbitant amount of work. There may be deadlines imposed, and there may be new projects starting in between other projects deadlines. In other guides/topics talking about making it in the freelancing business, they talk of taking on as many jobs as possible in order to survive during an off period. The same applies to dev companies. In the beginning they're trying to make enough money to stay afloat and keep their help happy and so they take on as much as they can chew. So, you might end up doing things you don't want for job security reasons. XD The other thing worth mentioning is game quality; since smaller developers don't have as many resources, you can't expect the quality of the game to be that of fully staffed companies. While it's possible, that a determined group of indy developers might produce something of utmost quality, the norm will usually be games that never see the light of day, or games built around current funds and resources.

Basically, I just addressed the two main routes that I've come across in my days as a freelancer. One could use this as a loose guideline of what they could probably expect when they're past the stage of taking up as many jobs as possible in order to survive and at the stage where they need to make up a decision of how to progress their career, if they want this as a career.

A larger company generally offers higher pay and security, whereas a smaller company offers less pay, less security, but more freedom. And by security I mean the lastability of the company.

269
Pixel Art / Re: Crits on my robosuit sprite guy
« on: February 09, 2007, 12:54:15 am »


I decided to play devil's advocate here and say that outlines aren't necessarily bad. Especially on a sprite this size. Either you're going to want to use something like 3 colors with high contrast or use outlines. If you don't, you'll end up with a muddled mess. The former option is best reserved for nes sprites though.

Anyways, I used some high contrast high, high saturation colors, and the same general dark outline color. Although, I did outline some areas lighter than others to give it a less 2d look.

Please note that I butchered the perspective on his right arm since the original pose looked prety peculiar and confusing. But now his right arm is raised up a bit more and therefore kind of kills it. I didn't really realize it or else I might've pushed it down a bit. XD

270
Pixel Art / Re: (WIP) I've got a PHD in "suck at anatomy"
« on: February 08, 2007, 08:04:59 pm »
The face was anime-ified in the last moments before the developer opted to go a cartoonish route. Maybe an attempt to save face for all the work I had done. Either way, it never got to the point where I was able to show him. Anime is what got me into this mess in the first place. Ages ago I bought a few how to draw anime books in an attempt to get better at anatomy. Unfortunately that was an awful choice I can never take back. XD

You're right about lack of understanding in legs and arms, it's always been my biggest concern.

As far as the 3d plane goes, perspective is my other problem. How unfortunate that some of the most important aspects of art are the ones I've yet to comprehend.

I was going to ask what book it is that serves as the artist's bible for anatomy but you beat me to it. I've heard that book so many times it's a wonder why I still don't own it.



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