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Messages - Willows
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Pixel Art / Re: Need some help with pixel pulled paper
« on: August 20, 2013, 02:32:46 am »
The biggest and best thing to learn from that reference is that the paper is sold as paper in its folds and edges! The curled, iconic paper corner in the top right is no accident, and the crinkles, wrinkles and seams heading into Kirby's mouth do well to show you how thick the paper is, how firm it is and other such papery attributes.

That said, you're not far off now! The idea's already pretty clear.

General Discussion / Re: Greyshifting
« on: September 15, 2012, 11:34:59 pm »
The way you are thinking of color is by identifying the construct of those visual phenomenon that layer together into a blended impure state.

Again, you cannot claim to know such an absolute. It posits that you have an absolute knowledge and understanding of ptoing's mind through some sort of prescience or his perfect communication. Neither can be true are consistent with (my) common understanding of the world as sufficient evidence has not been provided to verify their existence. Neither the ability to read minds nor the ability to communicate purely (doubly so through internet forums!) are things that I believe could exist.

So grey-shifting is hue-shifting in which one color at some point is neutral?
That seems a bit overly specific to warrant its own term.

That actually gets me excited. I know Helm did some writing about using grey as a sort of magic tone, as something that plays off the colours around it to seem to take on a hue that it doesn't actually take on. That is an idea I'd like to see explored / explained, but it probably isn't as intricate or complicated as I want it to be :(

General Discussion / Re: Am I going crazy here?
« on: September 14, 2012, 02:34:58 am »
Alex! This is why I ask if you allow yourself to be wrong! You're in a situation where it is fair to say the majority of people have a fundamental disagreement with at least one aspect of your interactions with others. It is fair to say that you're controlling your interactions intentionally, but given the evidence sitting in front of you it is FACT that your current methods of communication are -not working-. Your reaction to this truth is not (as far as I can tell, given your posts on a forum) to look internally and try to discover where you are wrong, but to concrete yourself into your position and declare everyone else the problem(s).

This is not a practical way to live life. It is you wronging yourself.

General Discussion / Re: Am I going crazy here?
« on: September 13, 2012, 01:49:53 pm »
It was the inconsistency in AA that Carnivac was complaining about, yeah? He was objecting to the AA of the hair in one location forcing a stark contrast between two elements of the same object (hair), which stuck out as a sore thumb, to him. To ask him to do an edit and then criticize specific aspects of the edit without considering the application of the concept he's portraying across the whole image just reinforces in me the idea that you're disinterested in the outcome of the argument and sustaining the argument for the sake of itself.

I am of the opinion that Carnivac's edit would produce a more pleasant image were the concept extended across the whole. There are quite a few high contrast / banded pixel edges that could use love and are the way they are because they are, right now. Either that, or push the image the other way and bring everything to the same level of un-smoothness. To have the lock of hair hanging contained by the sprite be very soft and AA'd and the other consisting mostly of two un-AA'd 3x3 blocks of white is definitely something that needs more attention, and most probably not a happy accident.

Alex, as a thought : Most everyone (myself included) assumes they're always right. A healthy person will also allow themselves to be wrong. Do you allow yourself to be wrong?

(My line of questioning here is fairly heavy. If you don't care to respond or this isn't something you want to get in to, I fully appreciate that. If you -are- interested I will happily explain every bit of where these questions come from in a common pursuit of truth! )

General Discussion / Re: Am I going crazy here?
« on: September 12, 2012, 04:48:01 am »
For the sake of clear communication, Alex:! I'm not driving at anything. I'm presenting you with how I view the way you've presented yourself in this thread. It's the same as if you were to personally show me a picture of a teapot and my comment were "It looks cute." I'm not presenting a slant or interjecting my own personal opinion of what the teapot should be; I'm simply telling you my initial reaction to seeing the teapot. If that information is not useful to you or how it is useful to you or whether or not you even deign to acknowledge my input (:P) is none of my business! As a member of the audience, I'm providing you with feedback. There isn't any motive or direction!

Also, I'm familiar with the idea of pushing -something- (or in this case arguing for the sake of arguing) because not pushing anything is unacceptable. However, I've recognized as a truth for myself that in all situations there are goals I could identify and pursue, and until that stops being true, pushing for the sake of pushing feels just as unacceptable as not pushing used to.

On the topic of making new topics : I don't think any subject of discussion that has come up so far actually necessitates its own separate thread. This is just where the discussion has evolved to... BUT if anyone wants to make a helm-esque massive post of knowledge or what feels like it, I would gladly read every bit of it :D

General Discussion / Re: Am I going crazy here?
« on: September 11, 2012, 11:50:10 pm »
@semantics argument:

Alex, you come off as someone who is arguing not towards a goal or understanding, but arguing for the sake of itself. Not that that's against the law or anything, but neither is shouting at no-one in particular in the middle of a road. Similarly, though to a lesser extreme, it is odd and probably unfruitful.

Your arguments show obvious bias like an overswing to defend your point such as "amped up hue splurg that lacks consistency" or "since this game doesn't use any crazy "hueshifting"" or other cases in which you propose an exaggerated idea of what you understand as hueshifting to reinforce the idea that you wish to project it as a bad thing. It feels like you simplified the argument down into a FOR OR AGAINST HUESHIFTING and are attempting to bully the opposing argument out of the ring, rather than letting your points stand on their own for what they are (purportedly as truth). I don't hope to fully discredit any of your arguments in this! You're obviously bringing up a lot of good thoughts (Though again I'd debate the fruitfulness of them in the first place, in certain instances) and are definitely contributing to a good discussion... I suppose this is just a personal aside to maybe allow you insight into why some people are turned away by your attitude, provided I'm in a position to provide insight in the first place.

More on-topic, couldn't we all use a stronger theoretical knowhow on a whole lot of common pixel art terms? What suddenly makes "hueshifting" a hot point?

Take "Shading". Fairly ambiguous general term that, while it blankets a phenomenal wealth of information, typically to beginners means "Things should have light and dark spots". It serves as the first step to learning! When I first shaded something (and I'm tempted to speak for most people here) I wasn't thinking particularly hard about the value of the light that was hitting the object nor did I have a fundamental understanding of what I was doing, how light interacted with different surfaces or any of the actual science involved in what I was attempting to replicate. It didn't matter. I was wrong and dumb and completely incompetent, but someone saying "You should shade that better" was a simple use of an almost meaningless term that enabled me to forward my own learning and broaden the simple word's definition. The term used was simply reference to an idea that I would benefit from exploring further. It didn't mean I couldn't do anything until it was understood, but meant that I needed to include it in my progressive understandings.

In that light, I don't understand why there is an argument against a tool (Hueshifting) being bad because the tool is being used without knowledge or improperly. Even if it is used without knowledge or improperly, the crime isn't that in itself, but that the artist fails to recognize his own failure and doesn't take steps to correct his act. Though things don't HAVE to be hard, I would find it hard to stomach a serious argument that hueshifting teaches a bad habit that stunts an artist's growth.

General Discussion / Re: Am I going crazy here?
« on: September 06, 2012, 11:14:58 pm »
It's not a belief. It's a truth. Tell me how it is destructive? Or actually.. make another thread about it, and I can respond to it there.

You cannot declare it to be a truth, you can only declare that you believe it to be one!

Though you're right, and the endless philosophy debates are probably best left in another thread, if not avoided entirely.

General Discussion / Re: Official Off-Topic Thread
« on: September 06, 2012, 01:23:50 am »
Alex, that comes somewhat ironically given the posting exactly before it :D

General Discussion / Re: Am I going crazy here?
« on: September 06, 2012, 01:23:07 am »
If their artist would hang around this place, he/she would improve immensely..
Because I think they're just not used to the medium.. I mean obviously the artist has experience but he's skipped on the basics and never learned "proper" techniques.
Much like myself before I found this place, I was not aware of all the mistakes I was making.

The question, then, is whether or not they'd actually be "better" if they used the "proper" techniques. There is a -ton- of strength in simplicity and while "proper" techniques would likely be applicable and useful in specific situations, I don't think they'd absolutely make it better.

I like this discussion, though. I'm now wondering how people register visual information, and if everyone instantly and involuntarily applies a binary like/dislike to any visual information they receive... and what affects that snap judgement.

I mean, compare Owlboy to Grindia! I find myself looking at screenshots of either and in both cases at the core only concluding that they're pleasant to look at. My artist self knows that Owlboy is technically far more masterful and impressive and that Grindia... isn't... but if I were forced to make an argument that Owlboy is unambiguously more pleasant to look at, I don't think I could do it.

Maybe there is something to learn, here. Maybe a lot of our pursuit of art is actually extremely vain, and that we're making art for ourselves that WE want to look at because that's much, much easier than trying to figure out what someone else would prefer and making that, instead.

I feel like this line of thought will quickly have me making statements that have me sounding like a stoner. "We need to remove ourselves from the art, and let only the art remain!"


General Discussion / Re: Official Off-Topic Thread
« on: September 04, 2012, 02:48:24 am »

A friend of mine is embarking on the crazy journey of becoming an artist supported entirely by her artist-ness. I've got my own package of warnings and excitements and considerations, but if anyone has any personal thoughts or bits of advice on the subject (or links to discussions on the subject; I'm sure we've had at least one discussion on pixelation about surviving as an artist) it would be greatly appreciated!


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