Pixelation

Critique => Pixel Art => Topic started by: Adam on October 08, 2015, 09:09:44 pm

Title: Hellgate to Baator
Post by: Adam on October 08, 2015, 09:09:44 pm
Hi!

After some 300 FRUA (Forgotten Realms Unlimited Adventures) combat icons I did this year, I decided to put together an own module.

These are the first wallset templates for the 3D view (daub and wattle houses with thatch roof), and I'm not very satisfied.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v157/pembroke/Pixels/pixelation/FRUA/PJ_HtBaator_Village_WIP1_zpsjfgx2cla.gif)

Es you see its 16 color EGA (#67F79B is transparent). The first row is a simple representation, the second row is a bit more detailed.

Though I really like the simple look of the first version, I feel it lacks a bit of spice. My try of detailed version looks a bit noisy though.

Any thoughts, critiques, advice?
Title: Re: Hellgate to Baator
Post by: heyguy on October 09, 2015, 10:21:12 am
I know nothing about FRUA or 16 color EGA but I think you should try and tone down the bright yellow of the thatched roof. Something about it looks blinding to me but I'm unfamiliar with FRUA and 16 color EGA palette. I personally like the detailed versions. I don't think it looks noisy at all. I do think that the nearly pure white and pure yellow are looking too intense on the image, if that makes any sense.

Daub and wattle. I just learned two new words.
Title: Re: Hellgate to Baator
Post by: Gil on October 09, 2015, 10:53:44 am
you should try and tone down the bright yellow of the thatched roof
The only thing you need to know is that he can't edit those colors you see, so toning down the yellow would involve adding extra darker detail, or some sort of pattern, like dithering.
Title: Re: Hellgate to Baator
Post by: Adam on October 09, 2015, 10:09:03 pm
As Gil already mentioned the 16 color palette is given.

Pool of Radiance had some images of thatched roof houses using the red colors, so I had a try at it:
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v157/pembroke/Pixels/pixelation/FRUA/PJ_HtBaator_Village_WIP2.gif_zpscpkytdly.png)

And here are the icons I made. The style shoud be consistent in the game.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v157/pembroke/Pixels/pixelation/FRUA/PJ_refanim_zps7ldmzcd9.gif)
Title: Re: Hellgate to Baator
Post by: surt on October 10, 2015, 05:14:09 am
Always love your EGA stuff.
The red thatch doesn't look right to me. I'd reserve that for a tiled roof.
Title: Re: Hellgate to Baator
Post by: Adam on October 19, 2015, 07:44:21 pm
Always love your EGA stuff.
The red thatch doesn't look right to me. I'd reserve that for a tiled roof.

As I became an EGA-only pixeler lately, this means you love all my stuff! I hope at some point in the far future I'll be as confident with those 16 colors as you are.

I settled with something like this right now:
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v157/pembroke/Pixels/pixelation/FRUA/VILLAGE%20sheet%201_zpsrsyjuwok.gif)

Been working on the title screens, all of them are finished but this one:
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v157/pembroke/Pixels/pixelation/FRUA/title_portal_zpsiov4xikb.png)
This is like the tenth iteration, but I'm not a bit satisfied. It should be dramatic. I'm really unexperienced with composition, as you can see. Any suggestions what could be done there?
Title: Re: Hellgate to Baator
Post by: Decroded on October 20, 2015, 12:35:39 am
Love the sprites I'm just trying to understand how this stuff fits together into a game scene.
can u tell us more about the game and the perspectives etc?
Title: Re: Hellgate to Baator
Post by: Adam on October 20, 2015, 09:41:17 am
Love the sprites I'm just trying to understand how this stuff fits together into a game scene.
can u tell us more about the game and the perspectives etc?

Certainly. FRUA is a RPG game maker with which you could create AD&D adventures like the good old SSI Goldbox games.

It has two main views. One of those is the "3D exploration" view: a grid based pseudo-3D first person view of the village/dungeon your party is exploring. It draws predrawn wall tiles over each other to simulate the first person view effect.
Pool of Radiance (the first Goldbox game) example:
(http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-cDqGLn9tfeQ/TfBgfBjJ_OI/AAAAAAAAEcM/Bgk70qx1fnY/s1600/start_210.png)
/this particular version has even harder restrictions, all the wallsets are built by using a set of 200 or so 8x8 pixel tiles!/
The village sets ar drawn as bases for the wallsets.

The other is the tactical combat screen. An orthographic (cabinet projection) view of the battlefield where the turn based combat happens.
Pool of Radiance example:
(http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-EpKz20oDG4U/TexOFxJBXyI/AAAAAAAAERE/JJet3O4fEYo/s1600/start_131.png)
The combat icon sprites are used there.

Though FRUA already supports VGA; for aesthetical reasons and for the sake of simplicity I stick to the standard EGA colors.

Images taken from the CRPG Addict blog.
Title: Re: Hellgate to Baator
Post by: dpixel on October 20, 2015, 04:04:26 pm
Here's a roof idea:

(http://i.imgur.com/BFI4sxK.png)
Title: Re: Hellgate to Baator
Post by: Adam on October 22, 2015, 09:54:03 pm
Here's a roof idea:

(http://i.imgur.com/BFI4sxK.png)

Thanks! I like the idea of the highlights, and the red base color of the wood is also working suprisingly good. I'll consider taking over some elements, though I already started to clean up the 3D projections.

Meanwhile I returned to the last title image, and started to clean it up too. Despite the fact that the composition still bothers me...
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v157/pembroke/Pixels/pixelation/FRUA/title_portal_wip1_zpsktlwqiwm.png)
Title: Re: Hellgate to Baator
Post by: Gil on October 22, 2015, 10:40:47 pm
Maybe that portal ring is too thin? It makes it feel like the character coming out is not grounded in the scene and it seems to skew the composition. Also, I would put the black foreground bush on the other side, right now you've got two dominant black areas and they're working against each other, if you move the bush, it'll blend into the black portal and augment it. Lastly, I'd crop the image closer to the portal on the left side. The figure seems to gesture towards the right, so the space to his left kinda feels awkward, if that makes sense.
Title: Re: Hellgate to Baator
Post by: Adam on October 23, 2015, 09:18:05 am
Thickening the ring is a great idea, this I'll surely do.
I've put the black bush in the right corner to balance the black portal, but - as said before - I have no idea about composition.
I'd be a bit sad to lose the tree foliage (I like how it turned out) by shifting the devil/portal to the left, but I've adjusted it a bit.

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v157/pembroke/HtB_Title_portal_WIP_2_zpsklhkacrp.png)
Is it getting better? Or do you feel the same?
Title: Re: Hellgate to Baator
Post by: Johasu on October 23, 2015, 03:31:21 pm
I've been thinking about this one for a few days.
Individually each component seems really strong.  I like the way that bush feels.  I like the way the landscape feels.  The portal and demon feel like a very strong representation.  I love the way the portal feels like a pool, the ripple around his extruding parts.

But I am struggling with a couple things.  The bush feels too dark.  Too no space heavy for the piece.  The remainder of the piece is so bright.  It's pulling my attention towards it in every version.

The demon's pose is also problematic in my mind and I find myself focusing on a tail.  It is so hunched over coming through there.  Obviously much taller than the gate.  But how can it maintain that pose.  One foot that far forward, it's torso bent towards it's forward knee and the other leg off the ground presumably stepping through.  It feels incredibly awkward and unbalanced.

The thicker portal is looking great.  I had some thoughts on allowing the portal and demon to feel more separated as it is breaching the boundary.

I made an edit.  Sloppily took out the bush.  Pulled the leg closer to under his body. (again sloppy) and played around with some portal to demon variations.
(http://i.imgur.com/AnJwjmf.png)
Title: Re: Hellgate to Baator
Post by: Gil on October 23, 2015, 07:43:00 pm
I find that new one to be better yeah. If you want to save the foliage, can't you mirror the background? Or would that introduce more problems?
Title: Re: Hellgate to Baator
Post by: Adam on October 23, 2015, 11:09:24 pm
So I followed what Johasu suggested and dropped the bushes. Also changed the devil pose a bit:

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v157/pembroke/Pixels/pixelation/FRUA/HtB_Title_prtal_WIP3_zpsfmugmvu7.png)

After that I played around a bit, and discovered how much more menacing the whole piece looks in grayscale with harder contrast:

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v157/pembroke/Pixels/pixelation/FRUA/HtB_Title_prtal_WIP3bw_zpslkspcj1q.png)

And I thought: why not merge the two somehow? And it turned out like this:

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v157/pembroke/Pixels/pixelation/FRUA/HtB_Title_prtal_WIP3mix_zpsacgg0ynr.png)

I think I like it. What do you guys think?
Title: Re: Hellgate to Baator
Post by: dpixel on October 24, 2015, 12:13:33 am
That last one looks great.  It just feels right.
Title: Re: Hellgate to Baator
Post by: Adam on November 21, 2015, 12:15:20 am
I'm working on some stone house tiles right now. These are my first experiments (for now mirrored to save me the work):

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v157/pembroke/Pixels/pixelation/FRUA/stone_walls_WIP_zpssm7ihd9j.gif)

Any suggestions? Nice references with ega stone walls?

Edit: Or a more simple one with less contrast maybe?
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v157/pembroke/Pixels/pixelation/FRUA/stone_walls_WIP2_zps25nhlbp1.gif)
Title: Re: Hellgate to Baator
Post by: Gil on November 23, 2015, 10:06:31 am
I think I prefer B & C out of those five. D might work in a different context, like a dungeon, given a palette swap.
Title: Re: Hellgate to Baator
Post by: Adam on November 24, 2015, 07:21:57 pm
I think I prefer B & C out of those five. D might work in a different context, like a dungeon, given a palette swap.

Thanks for your opinion Gil! Right now I'm also a bit biased for B.

Meanwhile I started to work on the NPC portraits. For this one I've used a photo of Naomi Watts as a reference, but in the end she turned out to be totally different.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v157/pembroke/Pixels/pixelation/FRUA/EilsysDuskwalker_zpseka4xwcn.png)
I'm not sure if the gray highlight works. There are not much skin tones in EGA. Though I've seen some really weird color combinations to work, I'm not sure I can handle these colors well enough to try.
Title: Re: Hellgate to Baator
Post by: Gil on November 25, 2015, 09:09:30 am
Yeah, sure, that left one works. I've always been a bit weary of the red-heavy skin-tones like the right one. I'll also give you the biggest compliment one can get: seeing all your stuff makes me want to play your game :)
Title: Re: Hellgate to Baator
Post by: Adam on March 22, 2016, 07:40:20 am
Hellgate to Baator is on hold now, but I'm still working on a FRUA module, this time a collaboration project where I only do the art. Right now the wallsets are under progress, and I struggle for days now to achieve a proper looking stone wall.

This is the current state of the wallset concept sheet for Phlan slums:
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v157/pembroke/Pixels/pixelation/FRUA/slums_WIP_zpsznbczm4x.png)

Walls 1.5, 2.4 and 2.5 are my main issue there. I tried some methods, but none looks really satisfying. Here is one of of the wip sheets:
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v157/pembroke/Pixels/pixelation/FRUA/slums_stonewall_zpsj1uqxdvm.png)

Any ideas, suggestions, nice EGA references?
Title: Re: Hellgate to Baator
Post by: fskn on July 18, 2016, 03:46:35 pm
Any ideas, suggestions, nice EGA references?
How about having some plants growing up on walls, flower boxes on windows, some broken stuff here and there..?
Looking at some real castle walls on Google Street View (!) might also help you come up with different stone patterns.