Pixelation

Critique => Pixel Art => Topic started by: Cakeprediction on May 01, 2014, 03:25:57 pm

Title: [C+C]Some small sprites
Post by: Cakeprediction on May 01, 2014, 03:25:57 pm
Hi there :D,

After browsing some months as a guest I decided to finally make an account so I can make my pixelart better, so here I have some sprites i'm working on for a small Roguelite i'm working on as a side project:

(http://g2f.nl/0oru7h1)
The main character dude thingy

(http://g2f.nl/0wqdhq7)
Him drinking

(http://g2f.nl/0l2ys2q)
Getting hurt/scared

(http://g2f.nl/0haeaz6)
His starting sword

(http://g2f.nl/0t3u0hc)
a tiny shield

(http://g2f.nl/0756n9o)
And the base wall tile

The sword and shield will be added to the player ingame, so it will look like this:
(http://g2f.nl/01laesj)

I actually have a lot more I'd like your opinions about, but I think this might already be too much for a first post  ;D.

anyway, thanks for reading this i'll be glad to hear your opinions :)
Title: Re: [C+C]Some small sprites
Post by: Johasu on May 01, 2014, 09:39:48 pm
There is only so much you can do with sprites that are so small.  Critiquing these are a bit difficult because of that.
You have bits of color that are very close together as in the two gray's on the shirt and the tones on the head.  If you widen the contrast between those colors they will stand out more.  Also the black lines you are using on such a small creation will make them seem even smaller.  Attempt to use a much darker version of a similar color as the content of the sprite.  For example: DARK gray border on the shirt instead of a black line.
Title: Re: [C+C]Some small sprites
Post by: PixelPiledriver on May 01, 2014, 11:04:21 pm
He's cute.
Are they just 1-2 frame animations?
Or these are just design images?
Title: Re: [C+C]Some small sprites
Post by: HarveyDentMustDie on May 01, 2014, 11:11:21 pm
This was first thing that crossed my mind.
https://explosm.net/comics/3542/   ;D

I like it. You can't gone wrong with stickman. :)
Title: Re: [C+C]Some small sprites
Post by: Alp on May 02, 2014, 01:30:19 am
Oh! Such a charming little sprite! :D

Am I the only one who looked at his sword-holding pose, and thought of the Maze of Galious?
...I was?! Um, okay... >.>

I have done a small edit to show you some ideas, take from it what you will.
I was going to re-do the wall tiles, but I forgot. Oh well. XD
Tossed in some tile ideas, and a slime, because I got carried away. Heh.

(http://i.imgur.com/yEr0Q64.png)

@Johasu
Lies and tomfoolery! If 16x16 was so limited, people wouldn't still be developing new ways to draw characters at that size!
Title: Re: [C+C]Some small sprites
Post by: Cakeprediction on May 02, 2014, 08:15:43 am
-Snip snip snip-
I can understand it might be a little hard to critique, but thanks for still doing it(Thank you as well to everyone else :D). I did what you advised and got this:
(http://g2f.nl/0wql6lc)
I think it looks a little better, but sometimes I have some mixed feelings about the coloured outlines(don't know why).

This was first thing that crossed my mind.
https://explosm.net/comics/3542/   ;D
I like it. You can't gone wrong with stickman. :)
hehe, thanks :).

He's cute.
Are they just 1-2 frame animations?
Or these are just design images?
They are indeed 1-2 frames animations, except the attack stance(that one is done ingame by swinging the sword). I can Always expand the animations though, just got some inspiration for the drinking animation :)

-snipsnipsnip-
Oh man, I really, really like what you did there, especcialy the sword and the player and just everything :D.
If I have some time again to work on this project(which is probably tomorrow or maybe today, but just not now), I'll definetly try to add some of your ideas to it :).

Thanks everybody  :lol:


Edit:
(http://g2f.nl/0ioixre)
I endend up with this. I'm quite happy with the new guy, but I'm sure there can be done something to make him look better, just don't know what. Anyways, I'll change the other things later today :)

Edit 2:
alrighty ^^
(http://g2f.nl/0r5jmz3)
Title: Re: [C+C]Some small sprites
Post by: Johasu on May 02, 2014, 11:06:29 am
Pixel art is as much about patience as anything else.  Trying different things is good practice.  It may look better before you try something, but you really can't know until you do.

@Johasu
Lies and tomfoolery! If 16x16 was so limited, people wouldn't still be developing new ways to draw characters at that size!
:'(  My apologies!  I was of the opinion that we had finally reach that point at which the 256^3(16!) approximate combinations were winding down.   :lol:

Title: Re: [C+C]Some small sprites
Post by: Cakeprediction on May 02, 2014, 01:57:30 pm
Pixel art is as much about patience as anything else.  Trying different things is good practice.  It may look better before you try something, but you really can't know until you do.
That's true.

Anyway, after alp's post i've also made a tileset and Walls:
(http://g2f.nl/0qzhy55)
this one looks a lot like alp's, mainly because I wanted to try and do the background without a lot of shading and things like bricks without are hard to pixel in an other way than the inspiration. I'll probably redo it because I'm not really too happy with the tileset.

(http://g2f.nl/05krca3)
same with the wall ground thingy, but i'm a little more happy with this one. Will probably still make another one

The tileset looks okay ingame btw, but there is definetly room for improvement

Edit:
(http://g2f.nl/0ci9x1u)
This one tiles a lot better, but ingame it looks worse
Title: Re: [C+C]Some small sprites
Post by: Alp on May 03, 2014, 08:11:06 am
Ah, you've got the right idea, guy!

If it helps you, the cracked brick look, I went for with the wall edit was based off of the standard bricks from Zelda II. Those breakable ones. I just winged it from memory. Hmm... I should have done some indented bricks as well, now that I think about it. Oh well!
http://www.spriters-resource.com/nes/tloztheadventureoflink/sheet/41974/

If you're having trouble with bricks, you should take a look at how some 8-bit games do it.

@Johasu
It's all well and good, guy! You just need to keep in mind that somebody will ALWAYS find a new way to draw something. Artistic differences/style, and all. I've found 16x16 is a great starting point for beginners, too many starting artists go too big with their art.
Title: Re: [C+C]Some small sprites
Post by: Cakeprediction on May 03, 2014, 03:14:01 pm

snipsnipsomuchsnip
Thanks :). I've looked a little bit at some stuff and ended up with this:
(http://g2f.nl/0mdxvi8)
This one works really well ingame, and I might be adding some random cracked things ingame on some places, but for now this is done(I think) :)

also, I've started editing the tileset a little bit:
(http://g2f.nl/06uouc4)
Still need to do the pillars and arch-thingy though.

Also, the beginning of a little skeleton as enemy:
(http://g2f.nl/0qpt2jc)
Definetly not finished, but I don't really know how to make him look better :/
Title: Re: [C+C]Some small sprites
Post by: Johasu on May 03, 2014, 09:41:24 pm
I like that the new tiles are cleaner and don't feel as noisy.  They were quite distracting before.
The skeleton color tone could maybe go a light gray to shaded blue(maybe?) to help differentiate the sprites more.  The yellow/orange color didn't read immediately as bones to me.  Gray would probably blend too much with your already gray elements but if you go highlight and move towards blue in the shade it might stand out in a fun way.

@ Alp
It's in mind.
I did some 16x16 retro play a month or two ago and it turned out to be a great learning experience. I have found that limitations are usually better for learning than giving yourself unlimited resources. When I said that there was only so much you could do with sprites that were so small, I only meant that it's not as easy to apply "rules and concepts".  And by that I mean that the smaller you go the more interpretation you use on shapes and form.  It's harder to criticize the technique used in those cases.
Poor choice of words on my part and I own that. No harm done in calling me out on it.   ::)
Title: Re: [C+C]Some small sprites
Post by: HarveyDentMustDie on May 03, 2014, 11:16:35 pm
What do you think about this? This is based on your first sprite. It's cute and it's "skully". :)
(http://i.imgur.com/SLWBHve.gif)

Edit: Even if you are removing outlines you should stick with first character proportions. New version of character isn't very appealing to me. And in the sprite where he's Getting hurt/scared it's very hard to see his big white eyes, try to outline them with darker pixels (Maybe not from all sides, you should experiment with this :) ).
Title: Re: [C+C]Some small sprites
Post by: Cakeprediction on May 04, 2014, 05:23:01 pm
snipsnipsnip
I've tried the blue-ish, but it didn't really work out, so I went vor a less saturated yellow orange-ish, and it worked out pretty well I must say :)

snipsnipsnip
Wow, that's really a lot like I had in mind :D, This certainly helped me with this:
(http://g2f.nl/04kg7gb)

I still think my version could have a little bit of polish, but don't know where. Feels like something is missing though.

About the lil' guy, I gave the eyes some darker shadingoutline-thingies and this is what he looks like for now:
(http://g2f.nl/02k4t7v)
And I'll try change him  up a little bit, because I agree that he doesn't look as appealing as the first one, but don't have time to change him now. :)

Edit:
(http://g2f.nl/0u8i91f)

(http://g2f.nl/0t4863f)
oop! forgot to make everything black  :D
Title: Re: [C+C]Some small sprites
Post by: Cakeprediction on May 25, 2014, 06:15:21 pm
(http://g2f.nl/0mdh7r0)
:)

so I started from scratch with the character in the same size, and I think he looks way way better. The very happy eyes need to be changed though, they look a bit distorted
Title: Re: [C+C]Some small sprites
Post by: HarveyDentMustDie on May 25, 2014, 10:14:49 pm
I'm still voting for the first version :y:, for me everything after is just a pale copy.

Also skeleton in that last animation is pretty bad, I can assume that you forgot to erase those white pixels. Even without those white pixels it's still not right. Try to imagine your character without skin, that's how I created that edit based on first character version.
Title: Re: [C+C]Some small sprites
Post by: Cakeprediction on May 26, 2014, 01:06:23 pm
I'm still voting for the first version :y:, for me everything after is just a pale copy.

Also skeleton in that last animation is pretty bad, I can assume that you forgot to erase those white pixels. Even without those white pixels it's still not right. Try to imagine your character without skin, that's how I created that edit based on first character version.
Thanks for the reply :). I'll certainly remake the skeleton with its animation, but what can I change with this version of the character(who is obviously based of the first one :) ) to make him look better according to you?

Also, I made this:

(http://g2f.nl/0rb2h4g)
Title: Re: [C+C]Some small sprites
Post by: HarveyDentMustDie on May 26, 2014, 03:43:11 pm
How about something like this? (http://i.imgur.com/HAMslt8.gif)

Leg animation is good and fluent, but I don't like his arms and their movement.
Title: Re: [C+C]Some small sprites
Post by: Cakeprediction on May 26, 2014, 06:08:32 pm
Snipsnipsnip
That does look pretty good, although I don't want to make him too cute, because there wioll also be some pretty dark sides to the game(killing your co-op partners to open the doors of hell and such  :lol: ).

Anyways, after editing mine according to yours a littl ebit, I finally noticed that my character was a little too overshaded, so I made a ton of versions with more and less shading(some look very similar tho)
(http://g2f.nl/0acdrzo)
I personally like the third(from the right) the most, But i'd love to hear your opinions about it :)

Also, the hair of the last two guys is a little bit odd(the only difference between them is how tall they are)

Edit:
I made this grassy tileset:
(http://g2f.nl/0049z9g)

But I don't really like it and don't know how to make it better D:, so any critique is appreciated(as always) :)
Title: Re: [C+C]Some small sprites
Post by: HarveyDentMustDie on May 26, 2014, 06:35:53 pm
Heads in all versions are too distorted (especially last two because left eye is more left than his shoulder), at this resolution every pixel is more than important. Here is more serious version.
(http://i.imgur.com/eP0AdwT.png)
Title: Re: [C+C]Some small sprites
Post by: Ymedron on May 26, 2014, 06:42:32 pm
although I don't want to make him too cute, because there wioll also be some pretty dark sides to the game(killing your co-op partners to open the doors of hell and such  :lol: ).
If anything, cuteness makes the darkness even darker. It's basically about setting an assumption and then pulling the carpet from under your feet.
Of course, if you don't want to startle the player with the darkness, then need some foreshadowing of things to come.

I think the very first sprite was so liked because of the tiny eyes on a big blocky head. (however, it also calls to mind Fez... though there are only so many ways to do a mouthless noseless simplistic sprite... character.

Of the newest set, I think I like the third from the left maybe. Removing outlines entirely limits the type of backgrounds your character can be in front of, as the skin color merges with a light sky color.
Title: Re: [C+C]Some small sprites
Post by: Cakeprediction on May 26, 2014, 06:51:46 pm
Heads in all versions are too distorted (especially last two because left eye is more left than his shoulder), at this resolution every pixel is more than important. Here is more serious version.
(http://i.imgur.com/eP0AdwT.png)

Alrighty, This is what I came up with. Also, I gave one version a green scarf c:
(http://g2f.nl/0r9fl83)

although I don't want to make him too cute, because there wioll also be some pretty dark sides to the game(killing your co-op partners to open the doors of hell and such  :lol: ).
If anything, cuteness makes the darkness even darker. It's basically about setting an assumption and then pulling the carpet from under your feet.
Of course, if you don't want to startle the player with the darkness, then need some foreshadowing of things to come.

I think the very first sprite was so liked because of the tiny eyes on a big blocky head. (however, it also calls to mind Fez... though there are only so many ways to do a mouthless noseless simplistic sprite... character.

Of the newest set, I think I like the third from the left maybe. Removing outlines entirely limits the type of backgrounds your character can be in front of, as the skin color merges with a light sky color.
That's actually some really true and good advice about the darkness, I'll probably still make him cute after what yo've just said :).

About the first one, you're probably right about that. My intentions were t give him a kind of derp face, but as time progressed, I started to dislike the black outlines more and more, so I tried something entirely different. And then I repeated that process but with the second sprite :).

Btw, this is probably my template for the classes, so I'm still trying to keep him simple without too much laserbeams and explosions

And  about the outlines, there will only be sunlight/sky in the first two levels. after that you're inside the keep, But I'll certainly have to keep that in mind when making the sky. thank you :)

edit:
(http://g2f.nl/09lbuf0)
so i've tried something with the grass tileset+slime
Title: Re: [C+C]Some small sprites
Post by: cels on June 05, 2014, 07:53:12 pm
It's kind of hard to judge the merits of these tiles and characters without seeing them in a proper setting and seeing the complete environment. But right now, I think it's a bit weird how the rock / mud has a dark shadow on both vertical sides and on the horizontal side.  The slime looks a bit more like a rubber ball than slime, since it's not sticking to the grass, but I guess you could make it more slimey when you get to the animation :)
Title: Re: [C+C]Some small sprites
Post by: Cakeprediction on June 15, 2014, 06:01:08 pm
Hi there  ;D,

Sorry for not replying for a while, I was(and still am) busy participating in a contest, and didn't have a lot of time/motivation in general :/. My apologies

It's kind of hard to judge the merits of these tiles and characters without seeing them in a proper setting and seeing the complete environment. But right now, I think it's a bit weird how the rock / mud has a dark shadow on both vertical sides and on the horizontal side.  The slime looks a bit more like a rubber ball than slime, since it's not sticking to the grass, but I guess you could make it more slimey when you get to the animation :)
You're definetly about the siderockshadingthingymajigger, I'll change that. I am also planning to make the animation of the slime a lot more slimey, but when I made it I didn't really think of him sticking to the ground. I'll change that as wel :).

Also, I tried to do some human anatomy. This is my first time pixelling this so it's probably not that great :D. The pallette you see next to the guy is Dawnbringers palette(got it from here:-warp to another site 'n stuff- (http://www.pixeljoint.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=16247))

(http://g2f.nl/0dn2bf7)

I'd love some feedback and I'll probably edit this post with a mock-up(when I have some time)
Title: Re: [C+C]Some small sprites
Post by: Cyangmou on June 15, 2014, 06:48:33 pm
(http://abload.de/img/2014_6_15_figurexvubx.png)

think of what makes your girlfriend beautiful.
It's her long legs.
Even if your girlfriend is heavy, her legs are still long.

men usually have longer legs than women (women usually just have helpful shoes...)

What I did is about the minimal leg length, in order to make it look ok.
Try to play around with different torso arm and leg legths.
Title: Re: [C+C]Some small sprites
Post by: Cakeprediction on June 15, 2014, 07:25:28 pm
snipsnipsnip
Thanks ;D. This really helped out a lot(also with some things I wasn't really sure of how to do like the legs). I now have this:
(http://g2f.nl/08ua08u)

After this I think I'll try to make a man :)

Edit:
(http://g2f.nl/0kc06o3)

Edit 2:
(http://g2f.nl/0eg4vwp)
Decided to go for a dungeon type of look. Still need to make props though

Edit 3:
(http://g2f.nl/025mwka)
the question mark is just a placeholder. Kind of making the item pedestals a bit like in Boi(and the fire is also a placeholder). The green guy is probably gonna be an useless pet that follows you around :). Above the squid guy is a wisp btw(or it could be the beginning of an magic animation thingy, I don't know yet).

Edit 4:
(http://g2f.nl/0e10aul)
filled it some more :). The thing with the empty parts is the inventory that I didn't refill with the background colour and the fox is just a random thingy that doesn't really fit in with the rest, but I just made it c:

Edit 5:
(http://g2f.nl/01bs9m2)
Kind of runnin' out of ideas for the moment :/. Just made a walking pot guy and something that has been living inside of two pots. Also made an item(a hood),but I don't know what it'll do yet.
Also, a piggeh c:.

Still need to fill the background, but really don't know how D:
Title: Re: [C+C]Some small sprites
Post by: Cakeprediction on July 03, 2014, 05:53:43 pm
Whew, waiting 'till your tpic gets to the second page sure can take a long time :').

Anyway, Since I ran out of ideas for the other sprite sheet/mockup kinda thingy I started designing something else. I only made the main character so far(which will get some randomized stuff like hair, jacket and other stuff like that later),but I'm not sure what you guys think of it and if it's any good. I tried some kind of brighter but still mysterious style(which you can't really see yet since it's only one guy) that's a little bit out of my comfort zone and a little bit bigger.

Enough talking, here he is:
(http://g2f.nl/0m9660o) (http://g2f.nl/05w5fu1)

Some critique on the other sprites are appreciated as well, but I dpn't think I'll be using them in the close future.

I actually made a lot of progress whilst being on this site(a few months earlier I was still in the "Blocks with faces are perfect characters-phase"), Thanks ^^

*Flies away majestically*

P.S. He isn't that taller than the other guys, It's just that it's not my usual way of making people :)

Edit:
Also made a sideview, but it didn't exactly work out as I wanted. It looks okey, but I think it could look better, just don't know how :c
Title: Re: [C+C]Some small sprites
Post by: Ambivorous on July 03, 2014, 08:00:03 pm
Hi there,

See you added some nice stuff in Edit 4. I like the whole mockup really, and would be interested in seeing it with a background. You should probably get to practicing making backgrounds, 'eh?

Nice little guy. I actually prefer the side view, but I think we need more context before we can offer substantial advice. What's the view like? Slightly top down? What kind of colour scheme?
Make another mock up would you - I'm eager to see more stuff!

You definitely have potential.  :y:
Title: Re: [C+C]Some small sprites
Post by: Cakeprediction on July 04, 2014, 07:28:41 pm
Hi there,

See you added some nice stuff in Edit 4. I like the whole mockup really, and would be interested in seeing it with a background. You should probably get to practicing making backgrounds, 'eh?

Nice little guy. I actually prefer the side view, but I think we need more context before we can offer substantial advice. What's the view like? Slightly top down? What kind of colour scheme?
Make another mock up would you - I'm eager to see more stuff!

You definitely have potential.  :y:
Thanks for your reaction :). The problem with the first mockup is, I have no idea where to start D:, But I'll try something in the future(don't know when). About the second guy, I want the view to be kinda like in Crawl (https://www.google.nl/search?hl=nl&authuser=0&site=imghp&tbm=isch&source=hp&biw=1067&bih=755&q=Crawl+game&oq=Crawl+game&gs_l=img.3..0i19j0i5i19l3.1084.2405.0.2868.10.10.0.0.0.0.222.1168.0j7j1.8.0....0...1ac.1.48.img..2.8.1159.y5BB9ovGyAE), but not that kind of atmosphere(I want it to be a little mysterious, but also a vibrant world that screams out "ADVENTUUUUREEEEE"). The mockup I have now is far from what I have in mind, but I just don't know how to reacht that point, so maybe you guys could help me :):

(http://g2f.nl/06b9692)
I know it looks pretty bad(I am awful at tiling D:), But yeah... I just kinda told you :').

The guy in this screen has a basic sword(that I'll probably mess around with a little bit) and has a harcut which will be randomized every game(including colour).

Anyways, I hope you can help me ^^

Edit:
(http://g2f.nl/0t306g5)
I made some difefrent weapon types :). I'm planning to make more though


Edit 2:
(http://g2f.nl/0xk8e1b)
two basic slash animations in a follow-up. For some odd reason it misses some parts, but that's the converter I used. You also can't see the sword on the white background this site uses .

Edit 3:
(http://g2f.nl/0o7h4tp)
The hud that is always present. Wil change the font

Edit 4:
(http://g2f.nl/0d5zbpw)
8 directions of looking at the player. Just don't know if I'll add them all(could be possible that I just stay with 4 or even 2 directions), But I'd like your advice on it :)
Title: Re: [C+C]Some small sprites
Post by: Ambivorous on July 05, 2014, 04:10:22 pm
Really cool stuff man!

Before we go any further let's just talk about a few things.
You are going with a style that is very minimalistic. This means you need to make things iconic. For example, your faces are a blank colour with a big, bright red nose on it. That's all you're using to define that this is a human's face (and some hair). You'll need to use this kind of iconography throughout your game for consistency and because you have such a limited amount of space to work with.
You also won't have space for outlines and other things we sometimes use to highlight certain points of focus, for this reason you're going to have to rely heavily on your contrast and saturation to show the player what he/she should be focusing on.

Here's an edit to show a few of these things next to yours for comparison:
(http://i.imgur.com/xJJ5E6Q.gif) (http://g2f.nl/0o7h4tp)

Iconography - I made the hearts one solid colour and added saturation to them. Your life is important in games like this and the player needs to be able to see them quickly and clearly.
Saturation - Your HUD outlines don't need to stand out, just be there, so less saturation. Your backgrounds must not distract from the characters/spells/weapons/enemies going on, so we desaturate it. You'll notice this makes your character really pop off the screen. I added more saturation to some of the parts of your character as well to really make his stand out.
Contrast - You haven't made your textures properly yet, but for when you do make sure there is low contrast on things that aren't actually important. Here I added a simple, small pattern to the back wall. You can tell they're bricks, and there is some variation, but no one is going to become confused or distracted by it. Same with the small rocks on the floor. All low contrast, few colours so that the player doesn't see it. Hue changes work best for defining things when you have very little contrast/saturation to work with; which is why those stones are noticeable (compared to the bricks in the wall), but still don't distract.
I also removed pure greys from your palette - no one likes pure greys. Just make them slightly blue or yellow or something; it's just more interesting to the eye like that.

All these changes are made for readability and will greatly improve your final experience playing the game (and will help you make sure the player is always aware of what you want them to be aware of.
This is of course all assuming it's a game where you need to be able to discern things quickly.


EDIT:
Before you think this is the only way to do things (I realise I didn't actually say this, but the changes I made are simply a suggestion of how you could achieve clarity), I actually just spied a new piece of pixel art from PixelJoint (http://www.pixeljoint.com/pixelart/87346.htm) that uses minimalistic style, but has lots of saturation and still has easily distinguishable characters.
Title: Re: [C+C]Some small sprites
Post by: Cakeprediction on July 05, 2014, 04:18:42 pm
Wow, I really like what you did ^^. Currently don't have time to edit (and can't, this is typed on my phone), but I'll definetly take your advice. Those grays were just some placeholder colours that I didn't change bacause I am lazy (ehich isn't too good in pixelart :')). The bad thing about advice in minimalistic pixelart is that it'll be hard to make mine very different from yours, so my apologies if it looks like a copy D:
Title: Re: [C+C]Some small sprites
Post by: Ambivorous on July 05, 2014, 04:41:12 pm
Yeah sure, you're welcome.

What you can do is carry on pixelling as you would before you read what I said, and as a final step you can just tweak the colours as needed to increase readability.
That is basically what I did, and it really didn't take me long, so that's always an idea.
Title: Re: [C+C]Some small sprites
Post by: Cakeprediction on July 05, 2014, 08:04:19 pm
(http://g2f.nl/0khg27s)
after folowing your advice I anded up with this. I think I'll make some props now. These markings on the wall will be randomly drawn on the wall(It's gonna be prcodurally generated)

:)
Title: Re: [C+C]Some small sprites
Post by: Ambivorous on July 05, 2014, 08:25:16 pm
Looks good! I like the new hues. Makes your little guy stick out very well.

Only thing I feel is that you shouldn't have that much stuff on the wall or floor.
You just want to be reminding the player that it's a wall occasionally - you don't actually want them looking at your walls for details (unless you do want them to for whatever reason). You also don't want your floor markings to be in any way similar to the wall markings. That way the player knows immediately what's a wall and what's a floor.

This also means you don't need as much variation; just a few visually distinctive cues.
Few rocks here and there, maybe an empty can or some other pollution that would be on the floor and a couple of bricks on the wall, maybe the occasional pipe sticking out.

Anyways, looking forward to some props!
Title: Re: [C+C]Some small sprites
Post by: Cakeprediction on July 05, 2014, 08:32:38 pm
hmmm, you're definetly right about the walls and floor, But those are probably gonna be the only markings, but in less amounts when it gets randomizes, so I'm gonna leave that the same in this mockup(that way I already have all the variations I need). I actually made this guy first:(http://g2f.nl/0u0aet9)
, but he really needs some drastic changes. Tried to make him some kinda buffed black knight dude. Didn't really work out :').

About adding pipes and such, I don't really know if it fits in with the theme(kinda catacomby dungeons undera fantasy castle), But I might try it :).

owh btw, here is the mockup with some things erased on the floor. Now just some cracks and rocks are left.
(http://g2f.nl/007vhf8)

Edit 1:
(http://g2f.nl/0vu0dvk)
Made a tombthingy,a bottomless pit and a slime :)
Title: Re: [C+C]Some small sprites
Post by: astraldata on July 05, 2014, 11:17:47 pm
Not bad at all. The bottom of your slime's colors probably should be inverted (i.e. shadow color on bottom and bottom color as highlight on top) since it doesn't read too well as a slime right now due to those colors. At first, I thought it might be a sleeping bag or wad of dirty clothes but couldn't figure it out due to that bright color on the bottom of the slime. You also might want to add a little more contrast to the transition color between the light green and the dark green on your slime so it matches the style of your other stuff, otherwise that color 'transition' serves no purpose due to it almost being invisible at first glance.
Title: Re: [C+C]Some small sprites
Post by: HarveyDentMustDie on July 06, 2014, 12:53:51 am
Current design reminds me a lot to Crawl game, which is not very good for you if you want to create this, cause people will think that it's just a ripoff even if it isn't (hope it isn't  ;D). So you should try to add some personal touch. I like overall look of main character, but as I said at this low resolution similarities are inevitable, so try to add something unique.

Title: Re: [C+C]Some small sprites
Post by: Cakeprediction on July 06, 2014, 10:09:35 am
Not bad at all. The bottom of your slime's colors probably should be inverted (i.e. shadow color on bottom and bottom color as highlight on top) since it doesn't read too well as a slime right now due to those colors. At first, I thought it might be a sleeping bag or wad of dirty clothes but couldn't figure it out due to that bright color on the bottom of the slime. You also might want to add a little more contrast to the transition color between the light green and the dark green on your slime so it matches the style of your other stuff, otherwise that color 'transition' serves no purpose due to it almost being invisible at first glance.
did what you said and now I have this:
(http://g2f.nl/0uz172g)
Removed the transition color and messed a little bit with the brightest highlight and the slime indeed does look better :)

snipsnipsnip
I couldn't agree more on what you said in your post. I myself have noticed that my character indeed has some similarities with the guy from crawl, but I don't know how to make the guy more unique(everything I tried turned out to be very ugly). Gameplay-wise, I have a lot of ideas that differ from crawl(mainly adding a lot of sneaking in the game and some other thingies) , But I am really scared as well that it just might turn out to feel like a cheap Crawl rip-off, so I'm not really sure if I should make a game out of this or just finish the mock-up :/. If I don't make a game out of this I think I'll just make another mock-up for a roguelite :P(I am really obsessed with making one  ::))

Edit:
Well, I finally got a more Original idea for a roguelite that I'm happy with, and made a mock-up:
with HUD:
(http://g2f.nl/0ll7ox5)
and without HUD:
(http://g2f.nl/05g83km)
The minotaur and goat guy will probably need some kind of indication that they have hair/fur and the metal chains on the chandelier need some better shading as well. after this mock-up is done I think I'll make the starting screen or weapons :).

Btw, Still didn't change the player, but I'm happy with how he is, even if he may remind you of the guy from Crawl :)
Title: Re: [C+C]Some small sprites
Post by: Ambivorous on July 07, 2014, 06:57:58 pm
I really like the new look!
Especially those enemies! Good amount of cracks and the torches are a nice addition.

Few things (quick edit):
(http://i.imgur.com/eTP9hiU.gif)

I made the whole scene darker of course, and added light from the torches. Not necessarily a thing you should do, but I figured I'd pass on the idea.
You'll notice I also made the cracks on the floor lighter than the surrounding colour, I feel this will help the player tell which surfaces are floors and walls more quickly.
Reduced the saturation on your chandelier heavily because it is just there to be pretty right? If it is interact-with-able then I would still have desaturated it, but increased the contrast (started the chain out black and had sharp immediate highlights around the light) to make it stand out. Hue does work to make things stand out, but if you're going to go down that road you need to start applying that to all your pieces (which could be cool, so maybe give it a try) for consistency.

I was actually going to bring up the perspective thing the next time I posted (with the slime looking so flat in a 2.5D world), but since you've changed to side-scroller that's no longer relevant!
You did well on the slime edit though. Also your black knight is cool, I want to see him in this game!
Title: Re: [C+C]Some small sprites
Post by: Cakeprediction on July 07, 2014, 08:07:59 pm
-snipsnipsnip-
I made the whole scene darker of course, and added light from the torches. Not necessarily a thing you should do, but I figured I'd pass on the idea.
The darker looked pretty cool, so I figured I mdae it somewhat darker. I will definetly add light around the torch, but that will be done via some programming instead of immediatly on the sprite
You'll notice I also made the cracks on the floor lighter than the surrounding colour, I feel this will help the player tell which surfaces are floors and walls more quickly.
That's actually a pretty good idea. Didn't add that , but I have no idea why I didn't add that xd
Reduced the saturation on your chandelier heavily because it is just there to be pretty right? If it is interact-with-able then I would still have desaturated it, but increased the contrast (started the chain out black and had sharp immediate highlights around the light) to make it stand out. Hue does work to make things stand out, but if you're going to go down that road you need to start applying that to all your pieces (which could be cool, so maybe give it a try) for consistency.
I decreased the saturation as well, and you're right. It does make it look better :D. I don't really understand what I would have to change in my other pieces, I'm probably interpreting what you say the wrong way :').

I was actually going to bring up the perspective thing the next time I posted (with the slime looking so flat in a 2.5D world), but since you've changed to side-scroller that's no longer relevant!
You did well on the slime edit though. Also your black knight is cool, I want to see him in this game!
Consider it done :)(need some more advice on him though)
(http://g2f.nl/082njpk)
That tiny blade isn't going to help you... c:
Title: Re: [C+C]Some small sprites
Post by: Ambivorous on July 07, 2014, 08:34:43 pm
Good good. Keep at it!

If i were you I'd keep a close eye on this thread (http://wayofthepixel.net/index.php?topic=16906.0) for help with the knight.
Maybe offer an edit or two of your own just to practice. I find you learn a lot from helping others.

Oh, also about the HUD - you may want to keep it really simple (no extra lines). I suspect you will have space problems and that you won't be wanting extra distraction.
You can revisit your HUD near the end when you know exactly what information you're going to need and we can work on it then.

Btw, 9_6 posted this video (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pOK2sDLtu2Q) about making characters in your own style if you're still worried about being too similar to Crawl.
The basic idea is that you do a bunch of references (in this case of knights) and then try to come up with your own ideas from memory.
Title: Re: [C+C]Roguelite mock-up fest :I
Post by: Cakeprediction on July 08, 2014, 01:42:09 pm
Good good. Keep at it!

If i were you I'd keep a close eye on this thread (http://wayofthepixel.net/index.php?topic=16906.0) for help with the knight.
Maybe offer an edit or two of your own just to practice. I find you learn a lot from helping others.
The problem is that I really don't kno what to change on that guy, but you're probably right, I should try that. Maybe I'll get to it one time :)

Oh, also about the HUD - you may want to keep it really simple (no extra lines). I suspect you will have space problems and that you won't be wanting extra distraction.
You can revisit your HUD near the end when you know exactly what information you're going to need and we can work on it then.

Btw, 9_6 posted this video (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pOK2sDLtu2Q) about making characters in your own style if you're still worried about being too similar to Crawl.
Hmmm... This sounds like a good idea :D
The basic idea is that you do a bunch of references (in this case of knights) and then try to come up with your own ideas from memory.
I think this piece is done(maybe I'll add some weapons, but I don't know yet), but next time I'll definetly try that, thanks :)

After thinking a lot, I've decided that I'm still not too happy with the artstyle, so I finished this piece
with some lighting and shadows and I'll continue making more mockups in different styles 'till I find something I'm really happy with. this is the final thing:
with HUD:
(http://g2f.nl/0sd2c6k)
without HUD:
(http://g2f.nl/01xoay7)
There is probably something wrong twith the lighting and lighteffects, so any critique on that(and the other parts of the mockup) is appreciated :D.
Thanks for your help :)

Next mockup will come soon ^^

Edit:
(http://g2f.nl/063v9a5)
Got the main character done(which will get randomized hair, again :P)
Title: Re: [C+C]Some small sprites
Post by: Ambivorous on July 10, 2014, 03:41:11 pm
You and dat randomised hair... haha.

So I went ahead (punny) and changed a few things:
(http://i.imgur.com/Ai18M6E.gif)

Went for a more oblong head as a compromise between the previous guy and the round headed guy.
Moved his arm in because it kinda looked weird? Iunno.
Less noise on his scarf! It's cool you can add stripes to his scarf, but it's not always noticeable and animating that is gonna suck, so rather go with a plain scarf. Still looks good I think.

Looking forward to mockups.
Title: Re: [C+C]Some small sprites
Post by: Cakeprediction on July 12, 2014, 01:00:36 pm
You and dat randomised hair... haha.

So I went ahead (punny) and changed a few things:
(http://i.imgur.com/Ai18M6E.gif)

Went for a more oblong head as a compromise between the previous guy and the round headed guy.
Hehe, looks funny :). Still gonna keep it kinda round, because I think it looks a little bit better(did change the shape a tiny bit)
Moved his arm in because it kinda looked weird? Iunno.
You were definetly right on this. changed it
Less noise on his scarf! It's cool you can add stripes to his scarf, but it's not always noticeable and animating that is gonna suck, so rather go with a plain scarf. Still looks good I think.
Still looks good indeed. didn't think about animating yet so I kinda did not realise that when I made it. Now it has less noise though
Looking forward to mockups.

So I made a small hud with 3 stats(damage,defense and runspeed) nad a small mockup. Still don't know what to do for props and background, but I can figure something outwith the props(background I'm not so sure of D:). This was also my first try on making a larger portrait and I think it worked out pretty well :). Looking forward to any replies :D

(http://g2f.nl/0ag9ktq)

Edit:
(http://g2f.nl/02sey49)
added some paladin knight thingy :)

Edit 2:
(http://g2f.nl/02ggi14)
I played some with the background and the walls, although I might tweak the walls a little bit

Edit 3:
(http://g2f.nl/04oimhm)
getting closer to the style I want. Don't really know what to do with the bricks though. I kinda want some visible brick thingies on the edges but don't know how D:
Title: Re: [C+C]Some small sprites
Post by: Cakeprediction on July 27, 2014, 10:38:16 am
Alrighty, back from a week of vacation and ready to pixel  :lol:

Anyways, when I got back I decided to try and go a little bit bigger with my sprites and made this(you can see the progress):
(http://g2f.nl/0h7q9gc)
There's probably something wrong with the leg shading, but I am quite happy with the result of half an hour of pixelling or so :).

Also, I made this a week ago(some small sketchy practice thingies):
(http://g2f.nl/0a9cz6i)
Used the dawnbringer 16 color palette here

Edit:
(http://g2f.nl/03ler8i)

Edit 2:
took a small step back since I didnt really like the shiny eyes. Also Removed all the standard black and redid the legs a bit :
(http://g2f.nl/065w0vy)

Edit 3:
Moar edits :I
(http://g2f.nl/0170xw4)

Edit 4:
The whole thing again with some modifications to the arms(the last two images)
Don't know which looks better though(I guess the most right one):
(http://g2f.nl/0ii0j33)

(http://g2f.nl/0v9j096)

Edit 5:
Thanks to Arachne the stiffness is way less to none :D(you really helped me out there ^^):
(http://g2f.nl/07ycp4h)

Also started working on a mock-up. The far away Island looks pretty bad though:
(http://g2f.nl/06t841k)
Title: Re: [C+C]Some small sprites
Post by: Cakeprediction on August 25, 2014, 07:28:06 pm
(http://g2f.nl/0coa1uf)
Did something a bit out of my comfort zone :). Pretty proud of it ^^