AuthorTopic: GR#227 - Light Cavalry - Anatomy, Sprite Process Thread  (Read 10575 times)

Offline Cyangmou

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Started with the next sprite.
As in the description it will be the light cavalry, although I don#t have a concept art yet.
to get an impression of what I have planned you can look up this (big) image:

This time as I have said in the last thread I started with digital posesketches.
I made everything I usually do with pencil digitally, which was also quite an interesting experience, didn't took much longer, but already got a lot more adjustments compared to the pencil stuff.
Also took the time to test and play around.
I streamed the whole process, for everyone who wasn't there a short overview:

1-11 preliminary sketches to get a feeling for the new character
21-26 pushed poses from the preliminary stiff ideas
31-33 extremely overexaggerated poses, to get a feeling for how far I could go



decided then to work on 24/26 because imo that looked best with the restrictions of the chatterbox image (added cutted versions next to it)
In the process I envisioned that 26 was the much better solution if it comes to weapon readability

so I rendered a relatively quick muscle figure, and adjusted the proportions similar to the crow.

Here is the current first version of the render.
I am unsure if the supportive and playing leg approach is good readable without the cast shadow.
After overlooking it now after a break, I also think the rear uppe rleg (playing leg) should be longer.
Also don't really fixed all line alignments so far, but looking on bigger critique for the overall pose (arm lengths/leg lengths/overall weighting).



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Offline Cyangmou

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Re: Light Cavalry

Reply #1 on: October 05, 2014, 04:12:01 pm
After oversleeping it a lot more issues were obvious to me.

-adjusted the supportive leg that it carries the weight
-adjusted the proportions of the rear leg lentghts
-gave the hip a stronger tilt
-changed the front arm, that he grabs his sword.
-changed a lot of muscle detail stuff, mainly for practice.

think the weakness at the moment is the bend playing leg.
will turn it more forward and take out a bit of the bend later.



change-gif
« Last Edit: October 05, 2014, 04:19:26 pm by Cyangmou »
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Offline Night

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Re: Light Cavalry

Reply #2 on: October 05, 2014, 04:30:27 pm
31 is definitely the most interesting pose.  :lol:
The rest look very similar to each other in terms of arm and leg placement.
I like what you did with the legs in the first sketch; so I implemented it into my edit.
For the arms and upper body I think you should go with something like 26 (oops, just noticed you said that! that differs from mine with the fact that his front hand is rather clenched and placed on the hips/waist)


In all honesty, I don't think you should give much attention to perspective at all when it comes to figure drawing. It seems to be rather confusing than helping to you, in which case it's an obstruction.

All you really need to keep in mind, with perspective that is, is that some crucial points (shoulder-line, knees, elbows, ankles, etc.) are aligned properly (and that is usually when they're static and not in movement; so like in my edit).
« Last Edit: October 05, 2014, 04:35:14 pm by Night »
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Offline tim

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Re: Light Cavalry

Reply #3 on: October 05, 2014, 06:14:32 pm
I'm fascinated by how relentless you are when it comes to training. You're such a hard worker.
And at the same time, you still make very very basic mistakes that are so easy to see.

First : your body is totally distorted, especially the abs, while considering the pose, he should be very straight.


Second  : Your abs are far too much on the right, as if the character was 70° rotation (90° = profile).
But you character is more at a 30/40° angle.


Proposed correction.
Your left leg is too far on the back, and its muscles should have a lot of tension given they have all the weight on them.


Final before / after

« Last Edit: October 05, 2014, 06:29:38 pm by tim »
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Offline Facet

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Re: Light Cavalry

Reply #4 on: October 05, 2014, 07:49:26 pm
Agree with Night & Tim; the pose you chose is rather stiff and affected for something you've worked at and iterated so much (are you holding these poses yourself?). I actually find the doll construction thing a bit confusing for myself; quite hard to empathise/imagine yourself in the place of a weird box-doll. It does seem like a bit like you’re prioritising individual boxes/muscles and stuff and getting lost a bit at the cost of balance and a sense of the whole; you might try sketching a full body coffin-box (I sometimes prefer a cylinder) and then carving into that, finding important lines of action, or just free-handing with a scale of ellipses to reference for more organic stuff.

I get quite a Burne Hogarth feel from your figures, particularly the older stuff; his ‘dynamic figure drawing’ is pretty popular but advocates some pretty odd-looking stuff at times (kinda like those big naked white guys from Prometheus). I guess my point is to try and downplay some of the compartmentalisation of muscles and stuff that you seem to tend towards and draw more from life if you can.
« Last Edit: October 05, 2014, 07:53:08 pm by Facet »

Offline Cyangmou

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Re: Light Cavalry

Reply #5 on: October 05, 2014, 07:58:13 pm
@Night, made your pose, think it's not suited for the cavalry.
I want to have something more aggressive and fiery, since I can't have the horse in there because of the perspective lines, the pose should give that feeling.
It's a nice basic pose, maybe I will get back to it with another sprite which needs to have this silence and stiff attitude.

I didn't gave any thoughts to perspective, within the first sketches, as soon as I start with illustrating it, well I have to apply it I guess.

@Tim:
first: ribcage and pelvis move. Very basic anatomical mass shifts. Drawing everything stiff leads to liveless humans. Muscles move on top of hard bones and are flexible.
The abs and the obliques are muscles which can chance their shape easily. Both are like bands.
Then there is perspective applied to the collarbones and the pecs, so there has to be a distortion in lines.

second: the body is not a square. the ribcage as well as the attached muscles shape an ellipse seen from top. the basic projection shows how much the forms you imagine in the frontview are actually distorted. A very basic beginner problem in terms of deep space drawing.

On the other hand a lot of the muscles won't be visible since the figure is anyways wearing clothes, so at this stage it's anyways more about the positions of the limbs.
The forms for the muscles is just roughly thrown in, to give some hints, I did it out of mind, for practice purpose. Don't have in mind to draw a fully detailled naked figure and the thick cloth on top hides a lot.

@Facet:
Now I am really interested, why you think Nights pose is actually more dynamic.
Also the way the gun is held in Nights sketch doesn't make any sense at all.
I am restricted on really active figure poses, because if I will use them later in a chatbox, you can imagine what happens.
And yeah, Of course I am acting in the poses.
The groups of muscles usually get more natural once soft gradients are applied. If we jus thave clear cut big clusters it always looks technical, but as stated: won't be visible at all. The most important thing is for me to find the anchor points for the clothes.
You could be reminded of Hogarth because of the overall proportions - I am going for idealized ones, not realistic ones.


Quite Happy with the current positions of legs and arms.


« Last Edit: October 05, 2014, 08:17:14 pm by Cyangmou »
"Because the beauty of the human body is that it hasn't a single muscle which doesn't serve its purpose; that there's not a line wasted; that every detail of it fits one idea, the idea of a man and the life of a man."

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Offline wolfenoctis

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Re: Light Cavalry

Reply #6 on: October 05, 2014, 08:16:52 pm
Pose suggestion:

His front foot is obviously meant to rest on a crate or something similar

Offline Cyangmou

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Re: Light Cavalry

Reply #7 on: October 05, 2014, 08:19:54 pm
-

won't work because of the following reasons:
-Head don't faces the camera, makes it useless for the chatbox
-couldn't use two of them next to each other in a chatbox because of the "crate"
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Offline HarveyDentMustDie

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Re: Light Cavalry

Reply #8 on: October 05, 2014, 08:38:24 pm
Quote
Also the way the gun is held in Nights sketch doesn't make any sense at all.

Offline Cyangmou

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Re: Light Cavalry

Reply #9 on: October 05, 2014, 09:10:27 pm
Quote
Also the way the gun is held in Nights sketch doesn't make any sense at all.
Pretty interesting, could you explain what the terms mean and from what this sequence is?

For the harpoon weapon it although might not be ideal, because it looked like the tip of the weapon would be pretty much hidden or invisible which is also a disadvantage for showcasing the design.

To sum it down
I want to have a bit more active (aggressive and fiery) pose for the cavalry, as long as it meets the restrictions for chatterbox use.
This means:
-face has to face the camera
-it should be possible to displace the same 2 sprites next to each other
-light has to come from the front
-sprite needs to work mirrored
-legs won't be visible, but it has to look nice as a complete sprite.

the current sprite isn't carefully constructed muscle wise, because I shifted and tilted a lot of parts in order to find a good position for the legs, I would have to reconstruct it from scratch to get everything alright.

What's important right now is, if that pose reads good and looks believable enough.
Actually more from the limb placement.

so current wip:



"Because the beauty of the human body is that it hasn't a single muscle which doesn't serve its purpose; that there's not a line wasted; that every detail of it fits one idea, the idea of a man and the life of a man."

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Offline Facet

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Re: Light Cavalry

Reply #10 on: October 05, 2014, 09:35:13 pm
Quote
@Facet:
Now I am really interested, why you think Nights pose is actually more dynamic.
Also the way the gun is held in Nights sketch doesn't make any sense at all.
I am restricted on really active figure poses, because if I will use them later in a chatbox, you can imagine what happens.
And yeah, Of course I am acting in the poses.
The groups of muscles usually get more natural once soft gradients are applied. If we jus thave clear cut big clusters it always looks technical, but as stated: won't be visible at all. The most important thing is for me to find the anchor points for the clothes.
You could be reminded of Hogarth because of the overall proportions - I am going for idealized ones, not realistic ones.

er… I actually didn't mean to say specifically that either Night’s or Tim’s suggestions were more dynamic/correct or whatever; just affirming more broadly the idea that the long process you've gone through to get to that stage doesn't seem to be solving/refining a lot of the issues you might hope it to and instead is producing quite a bit of extraneous fiddly stuff (loads of full outlines and bones and muscles etc.) when the important stuff is pretty streamlined lines and masses.   

The latest looks better but I'm too tired to analyse.

Offline HarveyDentMustDie

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Re: Light Cavalry

Reply #11 on: October 05, 2014, 09:38:12 pm
Those are steps form soldiers "choreography"  for special occasions like burial or parade.

Offline Night

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Re: Light Cavalry

Reply #12 on: October 05, 2014, 10:01:51 pm
@Night, made your pose, think it's not suited for the cavalry.
I want to have something more aggressive and fiery, since I can't have the horse in there because of the perspective lines, the pose should give that feeling.
It's a nice basic pose, maybe I will get back to it with another sprite which needs to have this silence and stiff attitude.

I didn't gave any thoughts to perspective, within the first sketches, as soon as I start with illustrating it, well I have to apply it I guess.

Fair enough, although I wouldn't necessarily call yours' aggressive; something like the berserker's concept art from WC2(http://images3.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20071011211852/wowwiki/images/9/93/Troll_Berserker.jpg) I would without question call aggressive. And I realise you're not going to make poses like these because it is supposed to be used while conversing with other people, and also would hurt the overall aesthetic of the other characters you've made; but I still feel inclined to mention it simply to compare.

About the perspective, that's exactly what I mean; I like the way you made those quick sketches much more, feels more natural (I especially like, the pose I've mentioned on my previous post, 31. It's just so lively and vibrant, obviously not fit for the type of stuff you're making now, but it looks better).

About the anatomy and all.
I know this isn't as important, but I think I have to mention it, just for future reference perhaps.

left: my pose, right: yours
The way he's positioned now really doesn't look right for several reason, one of them is the reason tim has mentioned, which is the displacement of the muscle groups. The other one would be the impression it gives off; with the way you've built his skeleton it gives a very unnatural looking pose, almost as if he's being pulled or pushed from the side. The explanation for this is simple:
1) His shoulder-line, or clavicles to be more specific, are unhindered while naturally you would lean a little for there to be a fold between the rib-cage and obliques.
2) The hip bone is way too rotated! Despite my own pose suffering from the same thing to an extent , it has the lean of the shoulder-line to compensate for that.

I've addressed the way you've made the upper body in a way that would suggest you're trying to make a contrapposto, although I doubt that was the intention. If the intention was for him to look like he's walking (which is the sense I get from looking at the leg placement), then the hip-line would be almost unaffected.

As for the limb lengths, his rear arm is a little too short (the bicep specifically) push it downwards a bit and slightly to the left and it'll be fine. The rear upper leg limb is too long (fix this by moving the whole leg, including lower limb, up), or at least seems like such because of what I mentioned with the hip-line.

The black silhouette looks fine (aside the things I've mentioned already with the limbs), just maybe make the upper half of the body bigger and wider (think lats and shoulders).


I was unsure about the gun holding position in my edit, so I searched in google and found this:
http://laststandonzombieisland.files.wordpress.com/2014/05/cavalier-with-musket.jpg
The way I drew it isn't correct, or probably not correct because I just based it off of my memory as opposed to directly using it as a reference.
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Offline Cyangmou

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Re: Light Cavalry

Reply #13 on: October 05, 2014, 10:24:00 pm
er… I actually didn't mean to say specifically that either Night’s or Tim’s suggestions were more dynamic/correct or whatever; just affirming more broadly the idea that the long process you've gone through to get to that stage doesn't seem to be solving/refining a lot of the issues you might hope it to and instead is producing quite a bit of extraneous fiddly stuff (loads of full outlines and bones and muscles etc.) when the important stuff is pretty streamlined lines and masses.   

The latest looks better but I'm too tired to analyse.

Within this topic the most important are streamlined lines and masses, that wasn't clear and was bad moderation from my side and the reason of the last post, that the whole thing can move on.
But as I have said this is the first time that I do this design process digitally, so I played a ot more around then I would have to, in order to find out how to go best over some steps, how careful I have to be and which things I shouldn't do. It's a new approach of working for me and I also enjoyed it a lot so far =)
This all might seem pointless at the moment, but I get the answers I want and it definitely will save me time in the long run once the new steps are refined enough.

On top of that it's also hard to find good poses within the restrictions.

@Night:
Yeah those poses won't work, although it's possible to place the characters more interesting than just a really stiff standing frame and give them some kind of unique shape and hand position that it's easy to tell them apart just from a quick look.
The overdrawn exaggerated poses aren't the thing I am making since it doesn't go along well with the render style I have chosen. YOu say it looks better, I say they would definitely look better as single artwork, but also work terrible within a static conversation screen.

About the anatomy: what we are talking now about the contraposto, the hip placement and the leg placement, can be brought down to the problems I had before. But now I can edit it right from the beginning.

the reference with the gun makes a lot more sense from the hand placement for sure.

WIll construct it from scratch streaming soon.
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Offline jtfjtfjtf

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Re: Light Cavalry

Reply #14 on: October 05, 2014, 10:36:58 pm
The pose reminds me of the Doryphoros of Polykeitos with the contrapposto, back leg lifting off the ground, and the piece resting on the shoulder, just with everything flipped. I think if you want more "attitude" with the pose you can try emphasizing the contrapposto, such as dipping his left shoulder more and having the straight leg lock more at the knee. Night's anatomy picture shows a good shoulder dip.

Offline pistachio

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Re: Light Cavalry

Reply #15 on: October 05, 2014, 11:43:53 pm
It's good to see a lot of pros are back. I'm now working from an older XP/Vista laptop so no edits for now, sucks...

Heavy infantry was awesome in rendering/detail with a Fool or Bitmap Bros. vibe, I expect this turns out the same way.

What is as important as readability of a pose is intent or the idea. In order from the lineup: flirting, advancing, guarding. Basic, I could go into it. Verb and then added adjectives is a good place to start off.

This one is guarding like the Sturmkrähe, less formally, also disdainful/assertive or something like that.
Newer update with contrapposto is more stoic which is retained in the chatterbox cropping.
With the idea simplified and focused, the process is simplified and focused with less trial and error (guesswork of poses).

Wonky angles are still weakening the sense of balance/weight and forms: IMO that's more important than remembering 100's of muscles in perspective.
What Facet was probably talking about when he mentioned Hogarth is the emphasis on muscles and construction, but also the flatness and foreshortening problems: technically impressive but in a "gestalt" way lacking.

But the biggest fixated problem I see is the left shoulder is too low or pecs are out of perspective.

It's cool to plow through the piece now, but addressing this stuff head on in the future will lead to a more streamlined approach which sounds like what you're aiming for.

There is a book about FORCE: book and the site with some free short demo videos.
The examples are exaggerated (for animators primarily) and there are other books like it, Drawing Comics the Marvel Way is one, but a lot of this (simplifying graphic shapes and angles) applies to your case. Use it in gesture drawings if you can pick it up.

Looking forward to seeing the final armor design.
« Last Edit: October 06, 2014, 01:27:46 am by pistachio »

Offline lachrymose

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Re: Light Cavalry

Reply #16 on: October 05, 2014, 11:59:28 pm
The gun sequence posted before is a part of the movement sequence necessary for the command "Left Shoulder Arms!". The command is given either from the position of attention, Right Shoulder or port arms. The number of steps or counts depends on the situation, but they are necessary for a unit as a whole to memorize in order to put on those flashy shows.

Source: Myself, veteran USAF. Also did some time in a base honour guard unit.

Offline Cyangmou

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Re: Light Cavalry

Reply #17 on: October 06, 2014, 01:28:51 am
completely went over it with night in the stream.
I decided to try the contraposto in the other direction, that it actually lines up in a different way.
Quite interesting to see, how the perspective grid affects things if they are getting mirrored.
Supportive leg is now the rear leg, playing leg now the front leg
The hand rests now on the hilt of the sword. Head is also turned in another direction.



thanks lachry for the explanation.
ah welcome back pistachio.
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Re: Light Cavalry

Reply #18 on: October 06, 2014, 05:59:00 am


this is a fast redline, about two minutes, and possibly in a direction you do not really want to take the pose in, but that's not the point i'm trying to make.

You are clearly very skilled with anatomy, better then me, but i feel like your painstakingly procedural approach to building this figures, as impressive as it is, is draining the figure of it's gesture, weight and for lack of a better term, energy.

I think you need to loosed up. Slam down the weight, and flow through the motion. You can mess around with anatomical tweaks as much as you like, but at the end of the day the issue is more fundamental. I don't suggest you fix this issue overnight with this one picture, just that it's something to be aware of.

Glenn Vilppu's lifedrawing handbook and videos would be a good look in for this issue.
« Last Edit: October 06, 2014, 06:07:40 am by AlcopopStar »

Offline yaomon17

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Re: Light Cavalry

Reply #19 on: October 06, 2014, 07:33:38 am
The back foot seems a bit short. The length from heel to toe should be approximately the same as the length from the elbow to the wrist.

Offline jtfjtfjtf

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Re: Light Cavalry

Reply #20 on: October 06, 2014, 09:34:42 am
I feel the new pose is awkward because now he's holding the gun over his sloping down shoulder which would be uncomfortable. With the sloping up shoulder the crook between the neck and the shoulder can cradle the gun.

Offline Cyangmou

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Re: Light Cavalry

Reply #21 on: October 06, 2014, 11:10:09 am
I am also not too happy with the pose from yesterday evening.
If I act in myself, the arm which holds the gun feels to be really stiff in space and if it's straightened that much, the gun needs to be really long that it's in balance.
SO I stretched out the leg and moved the weight ove rthe centrum.

@alcopop
The problem usually is that a lot of dynamism gets lost with correct forms. If you take a photo it's usually also not dynamic, but that's close to the result if you are constructing the correct forms (depending on how exact you do it) If you render out the forms a lot of the dynamism gets also lost.
The quick line art approach works wonderfully for anime stuff, but as soon as it gets rendered with more realism all the broken joints look usually terrible.
I know that there is a lot left I have to fix up with my humans, but as everything it will get better with a lot of practice.

After all I don't like yesterdays pose a lot, even with the changed legs.
It just doesn't feel right for the character, so I went over the rendered pose once more with references.

The pose reminds me of the Doryphoros of Polykeitos with the contrapposto, back leg lifting off the ground, and the piece resting on the shoulder, just with everything flipped. I think if you want more "attitude" with the pose you can try emphasizing the contrapposto, such as dipping his left shoulder more and having the straight leg lock more at the knee. Night's anatomy picture shows a good shoulder dip.

More attitude would b egreat, not to sure how to apply it successfully.
I Looked up that statue, seems to be really close from the overall pose I want to go with, it has this nice about-to quality so I also used that one for reference purposes.
I am still not sure about the shoulder line/shoulders in the last sketch.

old one #2                                                     adjusted weight/legs                                          first pose with proportion changes
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Offline jtfjtfjtf

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Re: Light Cavalry

Reply #22 on: October 06, 2014, 12:09:52 pm
I did an edit trying to get more attitude. Emphasized the contrapposto-ness for the silhouette with the shoulder line and the side curves. I think if his mouth is exposed a smirk could convey arrogance/haughtiness.

Offline Night

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Re: Light Cavalry

Reply #23 on: October 06, 2014, 12:37:25 pm

Circled some stuff from yesterday that didn't quite get across; it's a little difficult to explain what you mean by words alone.
The rear bicep and delt are way lower, and the trap won't be very pronounced.
The oblique/ribcage fold; I tried to explain that it should go should go more like a > shape; or a:
\
 /
in the chat, with the rib-cage protruding more; but yeah..

The lats, and back in general I guess should go more to the right, just looks more correct.
The placement of leg muscle insertions (which I didn't notice in the stream, but I wanted to put notice on it now), shouldn't be as that far out as it is now.
And finally with the front foot, which I had a really hard time to explain. what I meant with the line of separation was to create a separation between the part of the foot that is on the ground and the part that is in air(ankle); it just becomes easier to envision it correct that way.

With the current pose with the proportion changes you've negated the contrapposto by change the legs' role.

Anyway, I hope that my blabbering in the stream yesterday helped you in some way at least; can't say I was too focused, was tired as fuck.


Went ahead and made a fully muscled figure; while in the process I fixed some minor issues that my own edit had.

This should give a better impression for what I had in mind.
« Last Edit: October 06, 2014, 01:16:45 pm by Night »
There is light at the end of the tunnel.

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Re: Light Cavalry

Reply #24 on: October 06, 2014, 09:28:20 pm
thakns jtfjtfjtf. GOt what you meant.
Also thanks for your further explanations Night. Might use this pose as base for another character.

current lineart:
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Re: Light Cavalry

Reply #25 on: October 14, 2014, 01:53:16 am
currently just wondering if I should make the masks beak golden. might look better.
Also think the arm at the sword became too long in the painting process and needs to be shortened.

pixel version:

« Last Edit: October 14, 2014, 02:25:57 am by Cyangmou »
"Because the beauty of the human body is that it hasn't a single muscle which doesn't serve its purpose; that there's not a line wasted; that every detail of it fits one idea, the idea of a man and the life of a man."

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Offline Johasu

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Re: Light Cavalry

Reply #26 on: October 14, 2014, 05:16:42 am
His left forearm definitely feels longer than his right.
Maybe you can pull the elbow on that left arm forward some to shorten it up.
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Re: Light Cavalry

Reply #27 on: October 14, 2014, 04:42:29 pm
some more detail edits.

« Last Edit: October 14, 2014, 04:44:54 pm by Cyangmou »
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Re: Light Cavalry

Reply #28 on: October 14, 2014, 06:59:34 pm
You, sir, are unstoppable. Quite a work ethic. If we were to ever work together, I'd have no hope of keeping up with you.


Great stuff.
Wish I was able to submit an edit right now, but can't.


But here's some things:

Right thigh plate mail
Edges of each horizontal metal strips wrapping around leg, going out of our view, seem to violate perspective.
I believe your sketch had it right.


Left shoulder
Seems mushy and formless. Fabric is difficult.
Perhaps less highlight stretching across his deltoid area so there's more distinct planar definition?


Bracers/jacket cuffs
They look under-rendered. Plain, as if unfinished.


Gloves
I don't understand the penguin gloves. Why those? Just curious.


Gun
Aside from melee attacks with his sword, it looks like all this guy can do is fire one single harpoon.
What will this really accomplish on the battle field?

Offline jtfjtfjtf

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Re: Light Cavalry

Reply #29 on: October 14, 2014, 07:40:37 pm
Did you decide to go with the smirk for the final piece?

Gun
Aside from melee attacks with his sword, it looks like all this guy can do is fire one single harpoon.
What will this really accomplish on the battle field?

Goodbye AT-ATs!

I also agree about the left shoulder. The jacket sleeve to shoulder assembly looks like it's tailored out of 1 piece. I think defining the seam line would help.
« Last Edit: October 14, 2014, 07:46:50 pm by jtfjtfjtf »

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Re: Light Cavalry

Reply #30 on: October 14, 2014, 10:01:28 pm
What I find most annoying, is that his gloves are far to large to be placed into the trigger guard to actually fire the weapon.
Not sure what the brown bulb is directly to the south of the trigger guard is either, whatever it is, you'd almost have to cup your hand around it in order to get your finger onto the trigger. If it is a grip its is far to bulbous.

Alas, it is a great piece.

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Re: Light Cavalry

Reply #31 on: October 14, 2014, 10:33:03 pm
more detail edits
-jacket/shoulder
-jacket cuffs
-face
-weapon




Great stuff.
Wish I was able to submit an edit right now, but can't.

Right thigh plate mail
Edges of each horizontal metal strips wrapping around leg, going out of our view, seem to violate perspective.
I believe your sketch had it right.

Left shoulder
Seems mushy and formless. Fabric is difficult.
Perhaps less highlight stretching across his deltoid area so there's more distinct planar definition?

Bracers/jacket cuffs
They look under-rendered. Plain, as if unfinished.

Gloves
I don't understand the penguin gloves. Why those? Just curious.

Gun
Aside from melee attacks with his sword, it looks like all this guy can do is fire one single harpoon.
What will this really accomplish on the battle field?

plate mail - was sloppy there, well and also moved the knee a tad wider forward in the illustration. WOrked over it once more.
jacket cuffs - actually also the part I was most unhappy with, I guess it has to do with the color, changed the overall design.
gloves - since it's cavalry and they won't move their hands for a long time this design actually keeps much warmer than single-finger gloves. And they won't fire to many shots anyways, because it's mainly a scouting unit

Did you decide to go with the smirk for the final piece?

Goodbye AT-ATs!

I also agree about the left shoulder. The jacket sleeve to shoulder assembly looks like it's tailored out of 1 piece. I think defining the seam line would help.
-yeah, made it more visible in the latest edit
-yes that's another good answer next to some other cool and fancy things one could do with a harpoon on a horse
-yeah that helped

What I find most annoying, is that his gloves are far to large to be placed into the trigger guard to actually fire the weapon.
Not sure what the brown bulb is directly to the south of the trigger guard is either, whatever it is, you'd almost have to cup your hand around it in order to get your finger onto the trigger. If it is a grip its is far to bulbous.

Alas, it is a great piece.

put more effort in there.
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Re: Light Cavalry

Reply #32 on: October 15, 2014, 01:24:51 am
Wow yeah. Good fixes. Big thumbs up!

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Re: Light Cavalry

Reply #33 on: October 15, 2014, 02:29:45 am
looks really cool man, and he could always take off his gloves to fire!

did a little edit on the material near the rightmost shoulder



eg. moved that crease coming from his armpit a bit to make better use of the space and added some highlights

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Re: Light Cavalry

Reply #34 on: October 15, 2014, 10:29:19 am
great edit probo, thanks man

-changed the drapery
-changed the seam at the shoulder
-increased the size of the holster

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Re: Light Cavalry

Reply #35 on: October 15, 2014, 02:54:04 pm
Looking neat!

Can't quite pin-point what's bothering me, but something about the torso and the shoulders just doesn't look quite right..

With the drapery on the arm only thing that I'd suggest to add are some creases forming from under the shoulders, the armpit I guess. Also on the rear arm the creases that are created between the upper and lower limb you would expect to be more dramatic (like with the shoulders area) and smaller than yours (the feel it gives off right now in the rear arm is kinda like plastic rather than cloth).

The area with the fur on the neck I feel should be lighter and the area under it too shoulder be lighter (it gives off the feel that the fur is way on top of the clothing under).

The foot looks like it's going inwards, which I doubt was the intention, so I moved it outwards almost completely (same with the knee pad, made it so that it faces more to the left and also faces slightly more downwards because the knee is bent).

Some other really minor stuff:
The end of the gun, where the hand holds it; it looks like it could slip out of his hand in any moment, so perhaps elongating it slightly to the palm of the hand would work.
The two button-like things on the fur, the one on the left looks a little too short (it should also be moved a tad to the back).
Think part of the chest should be seen on the rear end.
The back on the front should be protruding a bit more.



Anyway, keep up the good work!
There is light at the end of the tunnel.

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Re: Light Cavalry

Reply #36 on: October 15, 2014, 06:33:14 pm
...



some really great detail things, especially loved the suggestions about the drapery.

The only things I'd disagree with are:
The bright lit area beneath the fur collar - there is actually a cast shadow (which is now hopefully clearer recognizable now)
And the rear foot - the foot isn't placed on the ground which increases actually the inward bend of the foot. I think it wa snot clear enough, tried to alter the shadow and add some folds - works better?
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Re: Light Cavalry

Reply #37 on: October 15, 2014, 07:58:46 pm
Cool glad I could help.

Yeah it's definitely better now, only problem I had is that if there was so much shadow cast it'd mean that either the light source is really off to the far left, or that it's sticking out really far.

Only the heel isn't on the ground right? If so I realised that (my edit is a little bad, with the whole foot being shown on the ground), I still think it should be pointing more to the left though.
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Re: Light Cavalry

Reply #38 on: October 17, 2014, 12:04:22 pm
yeah only the heal isn't at ground.
I played around with the rear foot, made the folds more apparent and the overall form more consistent compared to the front foot.
I Guess it's now a good middle between outward bent foot, inward bend right shoe and perspective
Also think that this one is now pretty much finished.

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Re: Light Cavalry

Reply #39 on: November 10, 2014, 03:25:50 pm
I really love your stuff, but I feel like the details get in the way of establishing a good sense of light/dark. Too many local changes from very dark to very light. I was messing around with it a bit, but I don't have enough time to go through with it. Here's an edit with some more global shadowing. My edit on the right, original on the left: